Query regarding priority on waiting list as a sibling

[pinkypig]

I am hoping some of you experts out there can help.

We very luckily got our first choice for Reception entry for our 2nd son to start in Sept 2012. We have been on the waiting list for a year for the same school for our eldest son who would be going into Y1 in Sept 2012.

The council tell me that our eldest son will not be given priority as a sibling until our younger boy starts at that school on 4 September 2012. My fear is that all the movement will happen between now and the end of August, and that when the sibling priority kicks in on Sept 4 there will be no place available for our eldest in Y1.

Is there any way we can challenge this or get the priority activated as of now?

Many Thanks

Hmm - not so sure - though my only experience of this has been at secondary level. Using the logic that a child currently in Y6 who will not be there next year does not confer priority, then it follows that a child who is not currently in the school but will be next year, should confer priority. The rules usually say something like "the sibling has to be expected to be in attendance at the school at the time of admission of the applicant", the situation usually applying to an older sibling for a younger applicant. I think the principle still applies, though - the younger child has been offered a place and - assuming you have accepted the place - will be in attendance at the time of admission of the older child. The fact remains that they would both be going to school together in September, regardless of the current situation. It would certainly be worth appealing against the decision (you can only do this if you have formally applied for a place for your older child this year and have been unsuccessful).

We successfully appealed in a case involving interpretation of sibling rules. Slightly different circumstances, but appeal panels are at liberty to use their common sense in cases such as this, and yours sounds like a strong one.

hottiebottie - The point is that if the older child is offered a place now they will take the place up immediately, not wait until September. He would therefore be admitted before his younger brother and would have been given sibling priority on the basis that his younger brother will attend the school at some point in future. That would break the rules. And you can't appeal against your place on the waiting list. You can only appeal if someone else has been admitted from the waiting list and you think you should have got the place. I'm afraid pinkypig doesn't have a case. The LA is applying the rules correctly.

I didn't think Pinkypig wanted a place for the older child immediately - I assumed she had applied for a place starting in September (on the basis that most schools and indeed families prefer to change schools at the start of a new term or school year). It would indeed be wrong for the older child to be given a place on the basis of sibling priority now, but if the application is for September then the two boys would be attending the same school together at the start of the new school year.
I am aware that the rules for infant class sizes are quite rigid and appeals are therefore difficult to win for this age group, but at least the older son will presumably be in a much better position on the waiting list once his brother starts in September.

Yes I would be happy for our eldest DS to start in September on the same day as his younger brother. We originally applied for this school for our eldest to start Reception last year and are still on the waiting list but placed number 15.

Anyone think we have grounds for appeal?

You may be happy to wait until September but if the place is offered now you must take it up within a few weeks or you will lose it. The LA cannot work on the basis that they will offer you the place now on the understanding that you aren't going to take it up until September. They are not allowed to hold the place open for you. They must therefore offer it on the basis that it will be taken up immediately. On that basis you clearly should not be getting sibling priority at this stage.

As per my last post you cannot appeal against your place on the waiting list. You can appeal against the initial refusal to admit your child. Equally if a place is offered off the waiting list and you think it should have gone to your child you can appeal that decision. But you cannot appeal asking the panel to move you up the waiting list. The panel cannot hear such an appeal nor do they have the power to change your waiting list position.

That's really clear - thanks for all the advice :)

Agree entirely that Pinkypig should accept a place if offered as soon as possible, but didn't think it would be as the family is currently so far down the waiting list. If it did happen then any perceived upheaval would only be for a few weeks, so definitely worth accepting. Of course it's possible that the older child would have to stay at the current school for the beginning of Y1 but would be in a far better position the next time a place comes up at the wanted school. It's always a good idea to keep options open - stay on waiting list (which is a separate process from the appeals) and go to appeal, though even if the panel agree there is a good case there is still the issue of the infant class sizes to be taken into account so their hands are tied somewhat.

In our appeal case the rules has been applied exactly as published: the rules stated that sibling priority could only be conferred if the sibling was in year 7 - 10 at the time of application (i.e. the older child could be no older than Y11 when the younger one joins, sixth form didn't count even if place offered.) Our younger child was refused a place in Y7 of an oversubscribed secondary school on the grounds that her elder sister would be going into the sixth form and was disregarded for sibling priority. The panel saw the illogicality of this and allowed our appeal, taking the school over its PAN. However, the appeal panel had the flexibility to do this since the maximum class size is not set by law for the secondary age group. Pleased to say that the school in question is now an academy and has adopted the wider definition of a sibling to include the sixth form.

Best of luck and I hope your DCs will soon be at school together!