what age does your school start teaching another language?

[cheapandchic]

I am not from the UK and I have just started researching primary schools for my 2 girls. I am finding it rather disappointing that many schools do not start teaching a foreign language at year one. I am very keen on them being bilingual.

I can speak italian and spanish although, neither perfectly...I would like to teach them but was really hoping the school would as well. I feel strongly that its important to start young. What do you do if you try to teach them spanish and then the school you get accepted in teaches only french?

Do private schools start sooner? Do you tutor your children after school? What do you do?

Dd started learnng French at school in y1, although her school now does it from reception. I think they do it in the attached per school now too, so from age 3.

But it's only 1-2 lessons a week, and it is done through songs and activities, and in isolation to other lessons. So although dd, in y5, knows a fair bi of vocab she cant really speak sentences in French bar some basic phrases.

The non-Anglophone parents who have most success in getting their children to speak English well are mostly bi-national families (Franco-Italian, Franco-German etc) where the parents speak at least three languages and are quite clued up about language learning and the amount of exposure required. Monolingual French families with ESL are much less clued up and tend to fail.

"another language"
sorry but in the big scheme of things French is an utter waste of time (except for ordering lunch while on holiday)
if Languages are a "tactical" thing then its hispanic and Sino all the way
otherwise why are people so fussed
France and Germany are fast on the way to becoming lingual backwaters
Chinese - probably Cantonese - will be the language of commerce
and until another language is more absorptive, English will remain the language of contracts

if you want them to be aware of other languages, go on non resort holidays and make your kids buy the lunch - easy

DS's state primary in Lambeth has been teaching Spanish since Reception. The teacher is a specialist MFL teacher, and he has made solid progress - he can do a lot more in Spanish than I can remember of my O level French, anyway.

I can think of many times outside of holiday when I would have found better French very useful.

If you do business in any country (or live there, or have a second home there), speaking the language fluently is essential, TalkinPeace2. French is a good first foreign language for the British as, once you have mastered French, Spanish, Italian or Portuguese are all a lot easier.

Two of my cousins studied Chinese at university. They haven't found it (remotely) "useful".

I learnt to speak Welsh fluently at school. Neither of my parents speak Welsh and I learnt the language as a result of thirteen years of Welsh lessons (from five to eighteen). Admittedly, my fluency was achieved as a teenager through additional outside exposure to the Welsh media but I would not have been motivated to learn the language if I hadn't begun to speak it in primary school where it was taught largely through songs, games and acting. I also think that it helped me to learn French and German as it is easier to understand and make links with other languages once you are bilingual.

I am also trained as a primary school teacher with a specialism in MFL. Our course tutor was from Luxembourg and was fully versed in the theories of language learning in the primary school, having learnt three foreign languages at school herself.

Taught properly, MFL in primary schools is supposed to have the same effect that my primary school experiences of Welsh had on me - it is hoped that the children will enjoy learning a new language, will appreciate that there are many different cultures around the world and will develop a positive attitude for language learning before they start secondary school, where the more focused work can begin.

It is, however, a sad fact that the vast majority of French, Spanish and German teachers in English primary schools are not trained in this philosophy and are, in fact, managing to put many children off learning languages at an even younger age than was previously the case. So, in theory, Primary MFL is a great idea. In reality, it is, as discussed, a bit of a sad waste of time!

I'm a passionate advocate of MFL learning (I teach it at secondary) but my DC have learned 2 years of French and 2 years of German by the time they leave juniors and there really isn't a lot of point - as in they don't know very much.

DD is in year 6 and in French can tell you her name, ask you yours and say how she is. Sorry OP, I think if you want serious language learning at KS1 or 2 then you will have to do some intensive work at home.

Our school started teaching French in Yr 6; all it meant was that my dcs ended up with a dreadful accent that has taken years to eradicate in dd. We would have been much happier for them to have been taught by qualified French teachers starting at secondary school.

I got a much better deal being taught French from the age of 12 by a teacher with a degree in French and plenty of experience of living in France.

If the tax payers were happy to fund that kind of teacher, or a native speaker with specific training in foreign language teaching, in every primary school, then yes I'd say it's a good idea. But for someone without proper qualifications to teach a language he/she doesn't speak- no, time wasted.

I grew up in a culture where an educated person was expected to speak at least 2 foreign languages, often more: when I went to uni my textbooks for my undergraduate course were in 5 or 6 different languages.

But noone believed that this was related to whether you had learnt nursery rhymes in your target language at age 5. It was to do with work spent learning systematically from experts in our teens. And instilling an attitude that meant that most of my friends expected to practise their languages as soon as they left school.

We ended up with a good command of several languages, the ability to carry on a conversation or read a novel without horrendous difficulties and a reasonable understanding of a different culture. A result worth having and I have certainly found it very useful in later life.

But bilingualism is something totally different. It is what you derive from growing up in a family or community with a second language and living that language in your everyday life. My dcs are bilingual. It is not something that can be achieved by teaching alone.

The introduction of French at reception, is IMVHO, an utter waste of time unless the teacher is of a very high standard, the teaching is happening regularly (not once a week!), and the DC are being given regular homework which is being undertaken peroperly.

In order to make any decent headway, a language has to be taught regularly, like reading and maths. Practice little and often. And there is no subsititute for learning vocabulary. Ohtwrwise the teacher just goes over and over the same ground. But parents are very adverse to their DC being given the homework necessary.

Since the current French 'teaching' in the very early years involves little of these, it is IMVHO little more than a tick box excercise. Indeed, the introduction of early French has had no impact on our linguist abilities as a nation. Indeed, the numbers of those taking MFL to a decent level is at an all time low.

Our primary teaches French from yr 2 or so but so minimally they might as well not bother, as far as i can tell they've learned the colours and numbers and that's it. I haven't come across many British children who are schooled in the UK who are actually very good at languages unless they have family connections in other countries.

It was one of my goals in life to have bilingual children but so far I've utterly failed, I meant to find a foreigner to have kids with but didn't somehow manage it, then I meant to live abroad so they could go to school in another language but haven't so far managed that either.

I did look for a French or Spanish tutor for my dds but haven't found anyone yet, so now I think I'll just take them abroad a lot once they start learning language seriously at secondary age, and find them places to spend their summers abroad. And that way, they won't be bilingual but they should manage to be competent at least. Which is more than most UK children manage.

I think it is important to be realistic about what you want to achieve. So many British people seem to think there is no point in languages unless you can be completely bilingual from a young age. But "competent at least" as Finocchio puts it is not a bad thing to be. I had almost given up hope about dd's French after years of poor teaching and a lack of interest among her peers. But a holiday in France has revitalised her interest, she is now reading a French book with a dictionary and watching French films, she is only 15, there is still time.

Our school teaches mandarin K-2 (infant stage) then Italian for 3-6. A token exercise tbh - I got quite excited when DD started mandarin in kindy (reception) assuming it would be offered all the way through primary, now she's in Y3 she's "switched" to Italian. DS2 did Italian in Y3-6 and didn't actually learn anything. It's a fantastic school btw, but languages are very definitely an add on.

OP-your children are highly unlikely to ever be bilingual.

Of course they can, and will become highly fluent in other languages if they want to. Or need to.

Dd has done 3 years of English at her (Italian)nursery school, and almost 3 years of English at her (Italian)primary. She is bilingual. The other children in her age group know colours.....colours......and a few colours.....(oh, and that Big Ben is in London....they started doing the verb "to be" but I notice that the teacher quickly abandoned that when dd had to point out to her that "it blue" and "it black" were missing a crucial element.

I don't think MFL are a complete waste of time at primary,but at best they will awaken interest in the children themselves. That's all.

I have recently started doing a bit of Spanish with dd because she has shown an interest.

Sunny
Where are you?
No need to be specific, but country?

I'm in Sydney Bucharest.

Oops sorry, was replying to Greythorne.

My children's school (state primary) starts in Y2, one afternoon a week, French. To be honest they have learned very little apart from a few colours, counting and bonjour/bonsoir, despite us taking them to France for 1 week's holiday to encourage them!

However, my children are fluent in my mother tongue but that's because despite me being very lazy (we mainly speak English at home), we spend several weeks a year in my home country and they mix with a lot of children over there. That is the key really.

My friends' children who are in a different country and learn English have similar experiences, even where they have put English as part of the curriculum and is taught very well, the children still struggle to pull a sentence together. Still, it is vital they understand English as it is becoming indispensable in many areas, less so for other languages.

cory it's not that I think it's a waste of time to learn unless one becomes fluent. But I do think it's a waste of time if one isn't going to learn more than red, blue and pencil case.

It's a bit like learning tennis and each week being given a look at the court and told how to hold the racket, but never actually being able to hit the ball.

I think it is highly beneficial for DC to begin languages earlier than 11. But parents and pupils have to accept that to make any decent headway they are going to have to put in some effort. That some things have to be learned by heart. And that is best done at home.

I am quite keen on early languages and found a private school for DD with a big commitment to language.

French starts in Nursery
Mandarin starts in Year 1
Spanish starts in Year 3
Italian starts in Year 4
At the end of year 7 girls choose two of these four languages to study
Girls who are doing well in their two choosen languages may choose to add German at year 9.
This is highly unusual in the UK and not everyone's cup of tea.

Oh meant to say all teaching is given by specialist teachers through. The school has native speakers in all 5 languages it offers.

It's NOT pointless despite the very obvious drawbacks. One reason - because it's presented in such a fun awy, it can help kids learn to love languages, who then go on to learn another one for real.

And shaking my head at people who think learning another language in general is pointless - how ignorant is that!

ds1 learns French at school and he is 7. not sure if they younger children learn it too.

he's at a free school though, so independent, but govt funded

@Lizcat - That school sounds very interesting. Where is it? (PM me if you prefer)

We're overseas and DD (10) started learning Japanese in Reception and French in Year 1 in our last country. I believe starting this young has been perfect for her as it's opened her mind to language learning. I am under no illusions that she will ever be bilingual but she has far more skill than I have! She loves learning languages and has perfect tone & pronounciation

Now in our 'new' country she's learning German every day and will start Spanish in September. She was incredibly quick to pick up German and after less than a year is confident to speak it. She was worried she'd lose her Japanese so now we have a tutor for her to keep her vocab up to scratch.

I have no major plans for her, she loves languages, that's all. I feel if/when she starts studying 'properly' in later years she will have a bit of a headstart if she wants to take her languages further.

In my school days we didn't start languages until secondary school - far too late IMHO. Start 'em young!

Peri have pm you the details.