A level choices and 'facilitating subjects'

[upatdawn]

Sixteeen year old DTSs are currently making their choices for A levels. For one, who wants to do biochemistry at uni, it has been very easy as he really wants to do Biology, Chemistry, Maths and (bizarrely) German. However, our other DS cannot decide. He hasn't started thinking about university courses yet, although he does want to go to a Russell Group. We looked at this link and three of the subjects he wants to do are under 'facilitating subjects' (they are history, geography and biology). However for his fourth option he wants to do psychology. Although it's actually a very demanding subject, many universities see it as a 'soft option'. Do you think it would be advisable not to do it and if he did would if effect he chances of getting into a good university? The whole process is so complicated!

Has he any idea what kind of direction he might want to be going in? He may not know the exact subject yet, but it might still help a bit to know what kind of area he is aiming for. Some RG universities are more sought after than others and some RG courses are harder to get into than others.

Psychology is seen as a bit iffy. It's not so much of an issue if that's the one that is dropped, however if it turns out that he's not so god at say history and it ends up making up one the the 3 then it oculd be more of an issue. The thing about psychology is that it can be studied without having done psychology A-level, biology is good preparation for a psychology degree, as is maths.

Cory has it right with "Some RG universities are more sought after than others and some RG courses are harder to get into than others."
FWIW, DC1 took Psych as one of her subjects to A2 and got into a Russell Group. If he enjoys the subject and, consequently, gets a good grade then that has got to be a positive. The only thing to watch out for is that it is a new subject: does he really know what's involved? (Having said that, some subjects that you continue from GCSE to A Level change quite a bit and sometimes catch pupils unawares.)
I have asked DC2, who is also doing Psych, what he found most unexpected about the subject. He said that he thought that it would be more discussion based. There is a large volume of case studies, facts, etc to learn.

DS has looked through text books, spoken to current pupils and teachers etc and although doesn't do it at the moment, he loves Biology and (to an extent) maths and statistics so thinks it would be a good choice. He also likes essay writing and analysing things so would agree it would be a good choice.

senua, it's good to hear that your DC got into a RG with psych and cory we will look into specific course specifications. At the moment he thinks he is drifting towards the sociology/human geography route so psych would maybe be better than say chemistry?

If he might want to go for a more Biology route then Chemistry would be better. Chemistry would keep more doors open, but it is a tough A'level.
No University is going to reject hm because he doesn't do Psychology, some for some courses might for not having done Chemistry. But if he really isn't interested he will find it very hard to get a good grade, and to keep his motivation up.

let him do the subjects he enjoys!!

The more I read on mn about RG universities etc when selecting A levels the more I want to scream at my PC. Unless someone has a distinct destination in mind, then the university being an RG one is not the only way to go; A levels are difficult enough never mind if they are subjects that the student doesn't have a love/interest of studying.

Study should be of discovery/interest/love of subject not just to get into a RG uni (which by the way is not always the top uni for all subjects) and there are other universities out there that are just as successful in getting their students into top jobs.....

It says on that link that students choosing one "soft" subject generally do not have any problems applying to Russell Group universities.

And it doesn't name Psychology as a soft option.

And it names Psychology as a useful A level for quite a few degree courses.

So I wouldn;t worry.

If there is a possibility your DC may move towards an interest in studying a biological science then be warned that chemistry A level is likely to be a required subject.

In the Russell Group biological sciences dept that I studied at chemistry was an essential requirement for all courses. Even biology A level was not essential, though most students had it.

I think for Biology, A2 Chemistry is often a preferred, rather than compulsory, subject. Although useful for sure.

For Biology some universities want chemistry others don't - DD1 is in her third year of a Biological Sciences degree and she doesn't have chemistry A level. She had to rule out some universities but there were still plenty of good universities to choose from.

I know that some departments (eg Sheffield and Birmingham) ask for Biology A level and a second "science." The list of "sciences" includes Geography and Psychology.

When I was applying I found most of the courses I wanted required chemistry. I think I would have struggled with certain aspects of the course I studied if i had not had the chemistry grounding. The biology I found could be picked up along the way, but an understanding of A level chemistry underpinned the course from the start.

Also seems a shame to rule out some of the top biological sciences departments because you do not have chemistry. I would strongly recommend that anyone choosing their A level options who is keen on going on to a biological sciences course should definitely choose chemistry.

Geography and psychology would have been of no help at all with the courses offered by the department I studied at.

The thing is cricketballs, some univerisities are better academically than others and for those who have academically very capable children then you want to make sure you don't limit their options unintentionally by making poor choices now: so you have to plan to aim for RG if you can.

They may change their minds, other universities are spectacularly good at some specific subjects, and one or two non RG unis are spectacularly good at everything and some non RG universities have great track records in getting students into good jobs. But its about percentages - the RG unis offer particular advantages which many of us want our kids to enjoy (higher proportions of students into top jobs; world leading reseachers in their fields; best rates of students going on to higher degrees or whatever).

So that's why there are alot of people on here at least plannign for the chance for their kids to go to RG unis, and the planning starts with A level subject choices.

You may wish to widen your search to include the 1994 group of universities. Russell Group universities are not the be all and end all!

I think Sheffield is one of the top biological science departments but DD1 chose somewhere else because she didn't like the modules they offered.

Biology is a big subject and a lot of the current work on climate change and habitats draws on geography. If your interest is more towards the biochemistry end then I agree geography is no use. I think the OP's son is more interested in social sciences/human geography but he hasn't shut the door on Biology with his proposed choices.

That's undoubtedly what the RG would like people to think, getting, but it's worth remembering that the RG really just began as an interest group for what used to be known as the redbrick or civic universities - the big old urban unis. Many of the unis in the 1994 group are just as strong - York, Bath, RHUL, Durham, Exeter, St Andrews for instance. (I work in the RG, btw!). It's in part because the RG 'brand' has been created and marketed so successfully that it has accrued some of the advantages you highlight, but that doesn't mean it's sensible for parents to fetishise it.

Camper, I hear what you are saying, but you have to bear in mind that employers also value degrees from RG uni's (and 1994 group as well) so you do have to give some consideration to this when selecting a course.

Webwiz, my degree was not biochemistry and I definitely needed the chemistry grounding to progress in my more general biological sciences degree. I would argue that any geography needed for a more ecologically based degree could be picked up much more easily along the way.

I agree with you whole heartedly camper - as I recall, it was whoever turned up to the Russell Hotel on the day of the meeting! And a lot has changed since 1993...

As I said upthread other universities are spectacularly good at some specific subjects, and one or two non RG unis are spectacularly good at everything - and you've listed unis who are 'better' at some subjects than most of the RG groups (and some were they are rated top in the UK, depending on how you measure - lets not go there!)

I was trying to get acorss the idea that you play the percentages - if you think you might want to go to a RG uni, if you plan to do subjects which would be accepted by the RG and give you the best chance of getting into a RG or equivalent or better(!) uni then you dont cut off your options at an early stage

whilst I agree with the not cutting off your options at an early stage I also implore any young person to think about what they enjoy or have an interest in not just RG band A subjects.

I don't have any band A subjects within my level 3 qualifications (mix of A levels and HNC) and yet, I attended one of the top universities in the country for my subject and was employed before my graduation ceremony (as was all of my peers from the facility)

Thanks for all of the feedback. By putting 'Russell Group' I wasn't ruling out any other top unis (as they vary by year and by course) but I found it was the best way of expressing the type of uni he wants to attend. I should also point out that he has no intention of studying biology further than A level, he just happens to enjoy the subject. If pyschology wasn't an option the chemistry (or whatever else) would just be a 'filler' subject.