FREE SCHOOLS? Clegg says "never for profit"....Gove is not so sure.

[chill1243]

Where do you think that "profit" debate will be in 3 or 4 years time on the eve of the general election?

It will very much depend on how broke the Government is over all - I'm taking it as read that we'll still be hugely in debt, but size of the deficit will have changed, will global factors. Neither is looking particularly promising right now.

The key issue will be about how much the government wants to pay for schools (and other public services), how much dosh is actually available, and the possible options for bridging shortfalls.

Higher taxes? Alternative (private) funding to all existing services? End State involvement in certain services?

All parties will have to set out their stalls on these issues.

A FAIR SUMMARY, med

My theory is a bit "conspiracy theory" driven, but I do firmly believe that there are moves afoot worldwide to push back on public services and privatise the public arena as much as possible, wherever possible - in the developed world, at least.

This might be in an attempt to revitalise economies, but there might be other darker motives, I am not really sighted on the deep seated reasons. There are many many conspiracy theories I have read, but not sure which one ticks all the boxes.

What is certain is that we are being precipitated down a path far away from the old social democracies that Europe was based on - and as a philosophy I think it has been fairly successful for many years. (You just have to look at America and all its millions of destitute people to realise why I think this was a successful model after all).

What I am deeply uncomfortable with, is that the fast and furious move towards privatisation is being done with no consultation of the public and not much thought in many cases. This could lead to massive problems in the future. What I would welcome is a debate and a thoroughly thought out plan of the future long term - something I have not seen at all from this government nor others around Europe doing the same things.

Talking of the future, I dread of a future for my own children where money will rule even more than it does now, and that whoever does not have enough money will be denied even the most basic provision such as education and health.

Lovethe harp.

I understand your worries. Would it help if I told you Cameron is surveying happyness.? He thinks hes Ken Dodd.

I'm always so reassured when Nick Clegg promises something.....

I don't think they'll be prevented from making a profit, in the end - whether any of them will be able to is another thing I suppose.

Have these schools been sited overwhelmingly in areas where there is a shortage of school places? I heard £130m to set up 24 of these schools (capital costs), or £5.4m each. If the money needed spending to create much needed spaces where needed, fine. But was it spent that wisely?

If I remember correctly I believe there are about 10 in inner london, so yes it would seem that some of them are in places where more schools are needed.

If there was a primary one in my area and considering the state of our local state school primaries I would be happy to consider moving DD. I agree that money should be spent trying to improve schools, but is that not what labour has tried to do for years and failed. I think that sometimes it may be necessary to go back to the drawing board and start again.

Well if Nick Clegg says "never for profit", then we can rest assured that (a) he'll stick to his word, and (b) he'll have the political muscle to impose it on the tories, or let them go it alone and oppose any such legislation. Right?

Phew, we can sleep soundly now!

As for where we'll be on the eve of the next election, the tories will make non-commital noises about leaving all options open, as they are doing now, so that they can't be attacked on anything specific. Then if they win the election, they'll dismantle the entirety of state-funded education as they will the welfare state, NHS and everything else, and we'll be America.

And all the Daily Mail reading morons who voted for them will scratch their heads and wonder why, with everything privatised, the cost of living is twice as expensive and their taxes haven't actually gone down that much anyway. And try to work out how they can blame it on the socialists...

yes, too true

The Conservatives have been in power for 36 of the last 60 years. For 35 of those years they have been in power on their own, without needing a coalition partner. They have had plenty of time to dismantle state funded education, the welfare state and the NHS. Somehow they don't seem to have got round to it yet despite Labour repeatedly telling us that this was their plan. One can argue about whether they have damaged or improved these things but saying they are going to dismantle them appears to be pure scaremongering. My own view, for what it is worth, is that all governments have improved these things in some areas and damaged them in others, regardless of which party was in power.

On the subject of the thread, I personally have no strong feeling on whether or not free schools should be able to make a profit. As far as I am concerned what matters is that the education delivered is of good quality, free at the point of use (so no fees for parents) and doesn't involve the state paying inflated fees.

(I could list a whole pile of other things that matter, by the way, such as fair access for all, looking after SEN children properly and so on but I don't have time for an exhaustive list!)

Then if they win the election, they'll dismantle the entirety of state-funded education as they will the welfare state, NHS and everything else,

I wouldn't mind if they did. Provided the new system works and yes, I would be happy to pay more for a good service. In our area the state of some schools and hospitals is as such that it can't get worse.