whose job is it to make sure they are emotionally ok?

[justacigar]

Just wanted to hear people's opinions on the role of pshe in schools - do you think teachers have a duty to help children become happy, functional young people, or is that strictly the parents' domain? I'm not a media request in disguise - I've just noticed how little my dd's teacher knows her :she's 6 and in a class of 30. She is at school for 30 hours/week but they seem to spend very little time building their class community, apart from facile "we don't bully in this class" kind of stuff. bearing in mind how important "emotional intelligence" has been found to be as an indicator of future success, I would have thought this would be just as important as learning to read. thoughts?

A child's Emotional Quotient is mainly down to you as the parent, after all, 30 hours a week over 38 weeks a year is still only 13% of their time spent at school - 87% of dd's time is in your care!

Last time I tried a link it didn't work, hope this does this time. Marshmallows are a great incentive!

marshmallows

I am a volunteer in school and the year 3 class do pshe on one of the days I am in ,it is really a nice thing to see the kids love it and it is a very interesting insight in their little lives.

Sorry to be dim - but what is pshe?

the problem is now school is just focused on its SATs and so all the time is spent on learning academic stuff... therefore leaving no time for teachers to focus on non academic skills... especially when there are 30 kids to keep under control as well... sometimes teacher spend most of their time keeping kids in class and under control before they can even start to teach national curriculum stuff, never mind do the soft skills...

I think it is for parents to do this -- in a perfect world the teacher would have time to support this work but unless you pay for a small class size in a private school it is unlikely you will get it in a state school...

the school my DS goes to has a very refreshing ethos of focusing on community and social skills first in the early years and has taken the decision not to focus on SATs... result is bad SAT results but OFSTED gave it a great review saying the teachers do look after the emotional needs of the kids but then slated it academically... I am worried when the head leaves his philosphy will go with him and he will be replaced by some obe more driven by SATS..

Personal, social , health education

I think that eacher have some imput, but agree with WIARW, most of that responsibility is down to the parents.

They have their work cut out sticking to the NC and compulsory literacy and numeracy hours. Remember teachers hands are tied over what they can teach.

There can be nurture groups for children who have emontional probelms, but not all schools run them . Google for Sandra Boxall (sp not sure) if you are interested

But if a child sleeps 11 hours a day, it spends 53% of the time it spends not at school, asleep!

That sounds wrong acutally but please check my maths:

8760 = hours in a year (24 x 365)
1140 = hours at school (30 x 38)
7620 = hours not at school
4015 = hours spent asleep (365 x 11)

53% = hours spent asleep/hours spent not at school x 100

Time spent 'with parent' therefore is 3605 hours = 41% of its life, not 87%!

Also if child is in after-school care of some description, s/he is spending even less time with parent.

I guess it dpeends whether you count sleep time as being time when you can get to know someone or have an impact on them iyswim.

Mine are in school for 6.5 hours a day and they sleep about 11. So that makes it about 50:50 in the week. But I'm with them all day Saterday and sunday, and you aslo get 13 weeks with them in the summer. Granted many people work, but even so the child is with the parents more than the school.

Also I want to do this for my kids. I don't want anyone else teaching them the most fundimental things, that is my job

8750 hours in a year
4015 hours sleeping
4745 hours awake minus
1268 hours in school

3477 hours awake and not in school through a normal year

So The parent will have three times the anout to spend on this stuff than the school and isn't ties to the NC. Granted many parents will need child care, but they would investigate the cild care provision of this sort of thing?

sorry 8760 hours in a year!

I don't disagree mb, I just didn't like a potential statistical misrepresentation

I'd never really thought about hours spent in school until now. And having worked it out for DD I find that in spite of her longer than state school hols (an extra 4 weeks/year) she spends an 106 hours in each each year to the 1140 quoted earlier. In fact more than that as she does 2.5 hours of after-school clubs each week (cubs and ICT club) but since they don't run for first and last week of term and parents' consultation weeks, I can't be bothered to work out the impact they have!

DD's school allows pupils - all the way through - into the classroom from 8.20 for an 8.40 start. They suggest that pupils get there no later than 8.30am as this gives them a good opportunity to catch up with their friends.

Justacigar, what do you think they should be doing to build a community?

I would consider that anyone who has contact with children has a responsiblity for their emotional well-being. It's not a matter of one person being more important than another. Also I think it is particularly important in the early years at school, as a lot of this is learning how to get along with people, and this skill is probably at it's most importnant at school (when else do you have to get along with so many people, with so little choice of companionship?). Most (good) infant schools do quite a lot of this, but it's not usually labelled as PHSE in the early years. Circle time, in particular, is a good example of developing emotional intelligence.

Of course the other thing to bear in mind that it is much easier to manage a happy class that work well together than an unhappy class with a lot of disputes, so good teachers will do this as part of their approach to class management. Our primary school has five "golden rules" all about being a good community (except the one about running in the corridors!)

Just a thought, but hasn't the government just taken away management points for pastoral stuff in schools, on grounds that teachers are not 'overpaid social workers'. If its true, then deffo not the role of the teacher - PSHE - when I taught it, was all about the knowledge of social issues, such as knowing what a condom is etc, where to go to get support on x,y,z... not the 'happy, functional young people' bit.

Seems the government thinks it is the parent's job!!

Must be the only thing govt do think is parents' job then. I thought govt believed that contributing as much tax as poss to the system was the job of every adult hence proposals for getting as many children as possible the option of 'good' childcare from age 12 months by ?2010.

My kids cover this sort of thing in PHSE....as they are in primary they haven't started practicing with condoms yet!

Whatever proportion of time is spent in school v. at home, I would have thought that teachers would not have time to look after the emotional health of their students beyond purely behavour management eg making sure children don't hurt others, talk out of turn etc, just so that the teacher can get on with the job.

To that extent, the teacher is helping the child to learn how to get along in a group.

But I can't imagine that a teacher would have the time to sit down with a child and find out why he/she child is acting up eg stress in the home. This would fall to the parents, particularly in state schools where there are big class sizes.

I thought pastoral care was largely a selling point of private schools - ooops, dodging knives now!

Whatever proportion of time is spent in school v. at home, I would have thought that teachers would not have time to look after the emotional health of their students beyond purely behavour management eg making sure children don't hurt others, talk out of turn etc, just so that the teacher can get on with the job.

To that extent, the teacher is helping the child to learn how to get along in a group.

But I can't imagine that a teacher would have the time to sit down with a child and find out why he/she child is acting up eg stress in the home. This would fall to the parents, particularly in state schools where there are big class sizes.

I thought pastoral care was largely a selling point of private schools - ooops, dodging knives now!

Message withdrawn

I think the attitude that teachers should somehow be making more effort to ensure children are 'good' than the parents do is a major contribution to delinquency.

It's not up to the teachers to make sure children are happy and well balanced people. All they can do is try to avoid the more overt unhappiness.

Parent's job, definatly.

Message withdrawn

Whatever proportion of time is spent in school v. at home, I would have thought that teachers would not have time to look after the emotional health of their students beyond purely behavour management eg making sure children don't hurt others, talk out of turn etc, just so that the teacher can get on with the job.

To that extent, the teacher is helping the child to learn how to get along in a group.

But I can't imagine that a teacher would have the time to sit down with a child and find out why he/she child is acting up eg stress in the home. This would fall to the parents, particularly in state schools where there are big class sizes.

I thought pastoral care was largely a selling point of private schools - ooops, dodging knives now!

I would think that there is more time in early years to look at this sort of thing (not much becfore my Primary collegues lambast me! )things like circle time etc

I know that my children's teachers brink this sort of thing into lots of activities.....for example when discussing the tsnuami in geography they came up with a way of raising money....their emotional response was being developed.

When it comes to secondary you have almost no time at all. I am a year 7 tutor and I have 20 minutes with the each day. Half of all that time is taken up with sorting information, signing h/w planners. getting forms in, distributing information about clubs, room changes, sports stuff. The rest of the time I am expected to help develop their reading and numeracy. We do have 6th form mentors which is a help.

In class I have no time, none at all. At best I can 'fire fight' with the most emotionaly immature and scarred individuals, but I have no time at all to spend unpicking their often higly complex needs.

I think parents have a duty to do this. Sadly I really don't have the time.

its my job as a parent to ensure that my children turn out ok. a teachers job is to teach.