Writing skills in a rising five

[jabed]

My DS started the village school last September. He is an August born so he is still only 4 1/2. I sent him able to read and write . I taught him to form letters etc. He was bright so he picked it up.

Now his teacher says he doesnt put enough pressure on when writing but wouldnt clarify.
I cant see it because his letters are visable and well pressed. I taught him to reduce pressure because words should be on a page, not impressed on the next six. I am worried because they seem to want to label him and have some programme for strengthening his joints which includes lots of stuff I worry may damage his growing body. He hasnt got joint problems. Since they arent Dr's and he is young for his class, I am not happy. Also, let me say again. I cant see the problem.

I dont know what to do. Anyone met this?

For goodness sake, jabed, lighten up, your son is only four years old.
If you are finding fault already with the school in the eyfs, when learning is still play based, god help you when he is older and there are real problems to solve.

Goodness me, such aggression ladies ( Ladies? I assume that because of the aggression I am afraid, blokes would be less inclined I think but thats a stereotype).
I asked for information only and updated out of courtesy. I do not "lighten up" about anything. It is my nature to be serious. We are quite serious people in my family ( now had the teacher commented on that trait in my DS I would have understood) . I may be over protective. My DS is very dear to myself and my DW. Forgive us for that. I am sure you must understand how one feels if you have/ have had a small child also?

I am not a physiotherapist but neither is the teacher of my DS's class is she?

Since you mention it, my DW did suggest we obtain an appointment to satisfy ourselves that he does not have any physical issues. She went with DS to our GP and GP laughed and said words to the effect of lighten up, take no notice of the teachers, he looks healthy, leave him alone.

As for what I do - I teach mathematics in senior school (so I do know about teachers and their foibles, hence maybe I cannot lighten up over it, as you put it).

Thank you for your concern.

your wife went to the GP about possible co-ordination problems and the response was that he looks healthy?

I'd be less worried about the school than I would be that you've got a rubbish GP

Thank you for your concern.

As a teacher I worry a lot about teachers and schools (because I sit in a staff room and hear much of the BS they spout daily).

My GP is very good. I have every confidence in him. I suspect you have taken far too literally my paraphrase of his statements concerning the health and general fitness of my DS.

Jabed out of interest why did you feel it necessary to send a child to school able to read and write, when he was already young for the school year - were you worried he would lag behind because of his age? I wonder if you might have inadvertently created a problem by putting him out of step with the class and if your son is the serious type maybe he finds that awkward and this awkward feeling is presenting itself in unexpected ways.

At my son's school the classroom is doesn't have many tables and chairs for the children to sit at for writing, what tables there are are usually set out with craft materials, natural materials for exploration, toys for role play etc. The children do writing in a variety of ways - on paper, on interactive whiteboards, with their fingers in gloop - to allow for a range of development stages. DS is a typical boy and doesn't have good writing yet but I'm far from worried.

If the school says your DS is meeting his targets I wouldn't be worried either. You say you are a teacher but I have to say you don't sound like you have a lot of insight into the profession. You said you aren't happy with the school generally - what are your other reasons?

no, I actually wasn't being flippant.

My DS has fairly severe handwriting problems - there's no way in the world a GP would notice anything though, he's perfectly fit and healthy - in fact he passed all his developmental checks including the ones with writing in them.

Doesn't stop his writing being so bad that he'll be doing all his exams next year on a computer or using a scribe...

You may be a teacher, but this isn't your area - you may think his writing isn't an issue, but realistically that carries no more weight than an early years teacher telling you that their child is fine when you're telling them there's an issue with their maths ability.

Schools do not waste resources on children that don't need support and you should know that more than anyone...

They've identified an area he could do with some support in, they're trying to provide that and instead of being glad that they're on the ball, you seem to be taking it as a criticism of him.

It may well be a minor issue that resolves itself as he grows, but I can't see how any exercises they give him would damage him.

I actually think it is very sad that an environment which should be geared up for 4 and 5 year olds to play in has now been filled with tables and chairs. Is there any space for the children to play on the floor? I find tables and chairs are often restrictive to children, as they tend to signal to them that their activity needs to be 'contained'. I'm not saying no tables or chairs ever btw.

FWIW I have been researching the learning styles of boys within the EYFS as part of an assignment for my degree and the research clearly shows that boys in particular benefit from having plenty of space, whether it be on the floor or at a table to pursue their interests and to promote their physical development skills.

Finally, it is not unusual for practitioners/teachers working within the EYFS to suggest to parents that their child might benefit from 'exercises' to support fine motor development. I think it depends which exercises are being suggested. Maybe the teacher wasn't clear in his/her ideas of the exercises he/she thinks would help? It could be little things like picking playdough off of a marble or using large plastic tweezers to remove little animals from a tray of cooked spaghetti. It doesn't necessarily mean a full on regime of press ups for example (a bad one, I know!)

It was not a choice. The school demanded ( sent a letter with a list of things every child was expected to be able to do on starting school) that he be able to write his name and address amongst a list of many other things.

I complied. As it happens he took to the task well and I was able to teach him a little more than required. He learned to read himself. He was reading by about 3. There was no direct intervention there from either myself of DW. We are a book reading family though and we read to him and shared stories etc.

My biggest worry was having (again an LA policy) to send him to school at just turned 4. I would have chosen to keep him home until this coming term but the school made it clear that he started in September or they wouldnt take him.

Since he was young and the village school is walking distance from home, we ( DW and self) decided that this school was best. I am beginning to question that now. I still do not want him to travel away from home too far.
He is young.

I am not trained in early years. I am a senior school teacher (independent sector) and I am what many would term an "old foggie" (another no no, an older parent) . I have seen it all come around and go around and I am no longer impressed.

I have far too much insight into my "profession".

Thanks for your interest.

The list is interesting. I don't think I would be happy with a list dictating what my children are expected to be able to write on entry to reception. Social skills and independence skills, yes, fair enough.

You say you are considering options. I think this is a good idea if you are really not satisfied with the way the school is providing for your DS. I did the same for DD1 after reception year (it was a bullying issue, rather than a learning one) and it has made such a difference to the whole family. We did however, spend a lot of time talking things through with her teacher and the headteacher before we made our decision as we felt it was better to be armed with all the facts before proceeding.

Anyway, good luck and well done to your DS for meeting his 'targets' (in reception ffs)

OK, now I am gobsmacked that a primary school should require a child be able to write his own name and address before starting reception. Recognise his own name written, maybe. Be able to say his address, maybe. But write them???
Are you sure you didn't misinterpret the list? I'm just incredulous.

Me too fluffy.

Goodness me. Lots of posters claiming things that have not been said and never happened. I seem to have opened a can of worms.

All this was a simple enquiry about a comment made about my son not pressing hard enough when he was writing. Nothing about him having difficuties. all that came with other posters. As far as I can see his handwriting is good. Its sound and legible. No evidence of what was said at all.

As I said, when asked the teacher backtracked and declined to say what she had meant earlier. Since then nothing more has come of it.

For what it is worth, my gut reaction in all of this is that his teacher made an error and confused my DS with another child and thats why now there is no issue. Of course I cannot prove that, its just a feeling I have

or she/he decided not to persue matters because of your reaction ...

YES, Mrz , it was you wasnt it who stirred all of this stuff with your assumptions about my DS and what he needed - you being a SENCO and having a vested interest (you the same one as on TES by any chance?).

The teacher never suggested anything. She never had a reaction. I have concerns about the school but I kept them to myself since they were not educational but about the size of the classes and things my DS was saying about other children and what was happeneing. DW was also seeing things that concerned her at the school gate but kept them close to her heart rather than saying too.

But as a result of this next term he will be "going to school with daddy" . We suggested this to him as a way of gently saying he might come to prep in my school. He was very keen. I was surprised as I thought he had liked his class and school and might say he didnt want to leave, but it turns out not to be so.

I am not sure my school has the best prep for him but he will not be alone in starting next term as we have many summer intake boys and girls. I feel it has to be better than the large class he is currently in for the moment anyway. We will wait and see if the issue is one which arises again.

Thank you for all your interest.

I hope he is very happy in his new school jabed and his present teacher's concerns are unfounded.

I'm not sure however how my being a SENCO gives me a vested interest perhaps you could explain???

SENCO - special education needs. Trained to look for problems and pehaps finding ones that are not there. All with the best intentions of course. Dont get me wrong on that.

Have a nice Easter. You off somewhere nice (up so early for holidays) ?

Oh sorry forgot. State schools are still working. We ( DW and self) decided to let DS have a day off today. Since he is leaving anyway. Nice sunny day, thought we could all have a day out somewhere together.

Have a nice day.

Jabed you may not have intended this, but with your last few comments you have managed to come across as a bit of a public-school snob with regard to state schools.

Maybe its because I work at an independent school? Maybe its just because I am a snob? Maybe its because I feel badly let down by the local state school right now? Maybe its because I am kicking myself for not doing enough homework concerning the school I sent my DS to? Maybe its because I feel a desperate need put it all right and know I have let my DS down badly here.

Why is it no one is allowed to suggest that teachers can be wrong? Why have I no right to question a teacher when I think they may have got something wrong? They are not G*ds. They are not always right.

I feel quite strongly that some of the things said by some posters here have been based on assumption and they have made that assumptions are fact here. There has been no evidence whatsoever presented to me ( or therefore I to you) that any teacher with any comment was correct.
Why cant I question their views anyway , just as a person and a parent?

Also, whilst being a dad on mumsnet , why isnt there a place people can discuss independent schools without having to contend with this label
"snob " all the time? This is a first class resource of useful information and more importantly experience. Right now I need that experience. I do not need judgement for wanting the best for my DS.
Sorry about the rant.

I've got nothing against independent schools - went to them myself! You've obviously not meant to sound how you came across - that happens a lot on the internet. It's just that without saying quite what else you have against the school, the issues you have mentioned sound relatively minor and it sounds a little as though you have all too easily just decided to put your son in the private school where you work.

as the mother of a child with SN - I absolutely do not think a teacher's opinion is always right, rofl, in fact I'd question most of them if they said the sky was blue

however, early years teachers do know more about co-ordination development in young children than GPs do

support for children with a diagnosed problem is hard enough to get, schools do not waste resources on children with no issues, I've worked in schools that are having to ration paper, nevermind being able to afford to waste someone's time on a child who doesn't need it

joint exercises are in no way detrimental

neither is allowing a bit of investigation to see if there is a problem or not

neither is working on the floor and having lots of space to move around

which is pretty much the whole thread - and is in reaction to things you posted

it may well be that the teacher has at some point mixed him up with another child, or that your wife has the wrong end of the stick about how serious the teacher thought it was - but taking him out of a school because they offered him help seems a bit severe

I genuinely hope that it is a complete misunderstanding and that he has no problems at all with his handwriting, firstly because obviously I would hope that for any child, but also because if he did have a problem if you refuse to acknowledge it until officially diagnosed as a major issue by a doctor it will be too late to do anything to resolve it

Thank you all for your thoughts. Having investigated further and found out a few more things I didnt know I am taking my DS out of school until he reaches 5. Apparently I can do that, its legal. I never had to send him to school last September (would I had known that then instead of being pressured by the system) That will give us some real breathing space to find him a suitable place for September.

You live and learn.

Thanks for everything

Actually jabed I'm a full time Y2 teacher in addition to being SENCO and a host of other roles so it's actually in my interest to have no one on the SEN register to reduce my workload...jabed Fri 08-Apr-11 07:29:33

and I'm up early to go to school to work as I often do during holidays to play catch up on paperwork ... now if only I could persuade all the parents their child doesn't have SEN ...