Missed Y4 - Which school is best for son ?

[hpstarmum]

We have a huge dilemma with our youngest son.

He is a very bright, bi-lingual and extremely sporty 8 year old - good enough to have been scouted for a top football club (we declined on the basis he is too young) and to be competitively British-ranked in 2 other sports.
We want him in the same prep school as his older brother, but they won't take him :-(

He took the entrance exam last year when he was 7 (late summer baby) but he did not do brilliantly. After discussion with the school they recommended that he tries again at 8, effectively being put back a year in the English system (so he would be the oldest in his year by a few weeks). We agreed, thinking it was a dead cert.
To counteract the exam failure and to prevent lack of self-esteeem / knock to his self confidence in repeating a year, we instead took him out the English system and put him in a foreign language school based in the UK and gave extra tuition at the w/e on English and Maths.

At first he found it very hard being in a foreign environment, but he quickly thrived and now loves it - the school has amazing sports facilities. Plus he is now bi-lingual and asking to learn other languages. (Unlike his older brother, who struggles with another language but is a very academic A+ grade student).

The issue we have is that this alternative school was only supposed to be a stop-gap for 1 year before he joined his older brother. It was not supposed to be for years and years. For the record it is miles away from home (1 hour) and involves getting up really early, lots of parental sleep-deprivation, inability for mum to work and no play dates for the child.

But now his brother's school - which recommended we put him back a year and re-sit the exam at 8 - has just said they won't take him after all... :-(
They are so over-subscribed that they said they could not take him as he did not score in the top third.
Which now means our son is a year behind in the English system and still will not be with his older brother... And as he has not sat any other exams, he has no English school to go to in September.

It is almost impossible to keep him in the foreign language school. Firstly, the distance from home is too great and the strain on the family is too much. Secondly, as much as we can be proud he is bi-lingual and happy that he is happy there, his grammar is not good enough and if it does not improve the teacher has advised he might have to repeat a year there :-(

Which clearly is not acceptable for a child who has already had one set back in one system.
On top of that, he would not have the parental support deemed necessary in a couple years time. By that I mean, he does not have the second language at home to help with homework.
Furthermore, his current teacher has just this week expressed concern that he is too bright to be in a foreign language environment. The teacher suggested that he surely must be unhappy and frustrated, even if he does not tell his family, as he can not fully write and speak all he knows or wants to say in his 2nd language. The teacher considers it in his best interest to be in an English environment in the long term...

We have spoken to the w/e tutors who have confirmed he was always placed highly in his classes and would easily succeed in the same school as the older brother...
But for the moment this school has said no.

So what do we do ?
Do we have to consider taking older son out and putting both in an alternative good school ?
If we try and find an alternative English school locally, how do we now deal with the fact that the younger son has effectively missed Y4 ? Or do we keep him a year below ?
Or do we just fight our case with the older son's school ?

This situation has really thrown us...
Don't know how to deal with it....

I would discuss it with your proposed school and be guided by their advice. If you are looking at prep schools most of them have experience in integrating pupils from foreign schools so it shouldn't be a problem for them.

I have discussed it with them and they know perfectly well the situation and so far they have said No. The boys are really close and I don't want them separated. And I do not want to knock the vulnerable younger ones confidence either...
The school concerned is highly sought after...
Younger son would thrive in that environment, but can't find the right words to express this to the school....

Think you've misunderstood me. I meant the school that would consider taking your Ds. The school you want him to go to has been very clear. If it is academic and he isn't then it would be hard to watch him struggle if you did get a place.

No I got you.
The school we want (with his brother) is academic, but he is academic. His current school consider him very bright and feel he must be bored with the level of his class.
It is not an option to have the boys in separate schools. I guess we have to go the admissions appeal route or find an alternative school to take both - although the older one will be upset....
Any other ideas...

If it's a private prep that your eldest goes to, an admissions appeal (in the sense that the term is normally used here) won't work - it's entirely up to them who they admit, they don't have to abide by LEA/Govt admission regulations. Badgering them is unlikely to change their minds especially if they are full and already have a waiting list. Many private schools look at more that just academics; they want to see if the child is the kind of child who would thrive in the environment (social, academic, sporting, whatever) that they provide. For whatever reasons, this prep have decided your youngest won't do so. They may be incorrect, but that's their decision.

Personally, I would look at other schools locally who would have places for both boys, and talk to them about the year placing of your youngest. Private schools often have more flexibility about year groupings. Or there may be a good local state school who you can talk to - it's not as if he hasn't been educated at all this last year, you may find that the differences in his education are negligible and he would fit in fine in his year group especially if he is bright.

So did he resit the entrance exam, or were they in the end unwilling to let him sit it for a second time?

If they have a lot of applicants it might not be that your DS2 wouldn't fit in, rather that they have 10 applicants who they believe would fit better.....

Why is having the boys at different schools such a no-no if an alternative within reasonable travelling distance can be found? I think you might have a (rightfully) resentful DS1 on your hands if you move him purely because his brother hasn't been accepted. My DD attends a selective prep and there are lots of families where the children are split between schools because of children not being accepted by the prep.They are very clear that they don't have any kind of sibling priority system and that younger siblings must perform in the top X of tehir cohort to be offered a place.

What a horrid situation - I really feel for you.
Am with marialuisa though - if your DS1 is happy and thriving, it seems a very big sacrifice to family unity to move him, and natural resentment may strike a bigger blow to the family dynamic than being at two schools.
I suspect you my have to live with having missed the year, especially if you want DS2 to go to a fairly academic school, as the re-entry could otherwise be v tough. THere are huge benefits to being one of the oldest in your cadre - enjoy these benefits and keep up his language so that he can see that the last year has been life enhancing.
This may be unehelpful, but did you not apply to some other schools as a back up? This could be a complication, as the 8+ process is pretty much drawing to a close (in London anyway - perhaps you are somewhere else which operates differently?). I have noticed that schools which don't have a formal 8+ entry (ie that run from 4 to 11/13 and so are just offering occasionaly places) often do their process a little later, filling in the spaces of the boys who have left, so that could offer a route for finding another option.

This is very tough for you - how annoying, after you'd made such an excellent one year plan. I'd agree with Michaelah, to accept the missed year and even see it as a positive in the long run. After all, in the US, the pushy educated classers actively hold back their kids from starting kindergarden to give them the academic and sporting advantage of being the oldest in their year!

Another small suggestion, when looking at schools for him going forward - I'd play down his second language. Some schools are still quite fossilised and won't see it as a benefit, they'll see it as a disadvantage to his ability in English and start fretting about him needing costly extra support.

(A German friend of mine was asked by my son's UK school if she couldn't perhaps speak English with her sons instead!!, no doubt worrying about them dropping a couple of marks on their SATs, grrr... Naturally she completely ignored them.)

And, to manage his (and perhaps your) expectations, he's almost certainly not bilingual. I moved to Switzerland 3 years ago and have seen several dozen foreign kids go into our French-speaking local school. After a year, they are at best conversational providing they stick to familiar subjects - and this is full immersion bar family conversations, with all schooling, friendships, TV, social clubs, etc, in French. Fluency comes in Years 2-3, near-native abilities or virtual bilingualism by about Year 5.

He's no doubt done extremely well, has a terrific accent and it will be a great benefit to him to have a good second language and the basis for learning others, but talk of bilingualism may unnecessarily muddy the waters.

I hope you find him a good place soon, what a stressful time for you.

Keep him a year below and put him into an alternative local school.

He won't suffer, being male, for being slightly older than his peers. Some of those children will only be 2 months younger anyway.

I doubt a state school will let him go a year below though. Clearly ds1 school don't want him, for whatever reason it is their perogative, perhaps it is a more academic and established year group and they don't feel he will fit in. There is no point trying to argue the case as his time there would be difficult if you did and they begrudginly took him. Find an alternative prep, one which will play to his sporting prowess and may let him into year 4 in September, or even before if they have a space (although for sports teams he has to play in his age group anyway ie. under 9's for 2010-11 season) If not the tutors surely have enabled him to keep up with his peers in the basics and the rest will just come.

Thank you for your replies. It is such a worrying time.
I guess we have to book an appt to discuss face to face, to see if there is any leeway.

If they continue to say No, then we have to make the decision whether to keep him back and start in Y4 in another school or to put him in his correct year of Y5 for September in another school.
His maths is definitely up to the correct current Y4. His english is also very good normally, but clearly he just did not produce an exam result as high as he should to guarantee entry.

We are just worried that if he now does not get moving forwards soon with the correct indi education, he really will fall too far behind. We can already see the huge strides the older boy has made this last Y5 term and a half. He is being nurtured to develop his potential in such a fantastic way and we so want that for the younger boy too...

He is now fluent in the 2nd language as he had had it on and off from birth anyway, just he had never studied daily in way he has over the last year...

If he stays back a year he will find it difficult to get into some schools at 13+ as he will be a few weeks too old for the cut off point. But we knew this when we decided to do the language route. Now there seems to not be the option to have both boys in the same school, last year's decision making process now seems foolish :-(

Again with sports, we understood the issues about competition age groups. However, he is so talented with some sports that he is already beating his own and older age groups (already been scouted for top league junior teams and has brit ranking in others...) so this was less of a problem for us.
Also, we are not worried about music as this is less age-related and he already plays 3 instruments, albeit only to grade 1 level.

We have not looked into other local schools and he did not take any 8+ exams. So there is unlikely to be a place at good schools, given the recent exam process... Hence the panic, frustration and worry now. All whilst trying to keep it from the boys...
Oh dear.