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Original poster

Going full time at 4 yrs and 3 weeks. Not ready!

75 replies

Clare123 · 02/01/2011 22:23

My ds will start school September after having his August birthday. Our borough is requesting all
children start in September. I spoke to the local
school which he will going to, about possible part
time, but the head made it very clear it is not an option she would like to consider.

The problem is my ds is not ready, he is bright, but struggles holding a pencil and had NO interest in letters or numbers. He counts to about 13. His concentration is still very limited, but most worryingly he says things like "I'm not good at drawing/counting etc". I worry his self confidence is just going to drop even more when he is with 5 years old who cab do all those things!

We do have the private option and can afford it. What would you do? Any advice/opinions?

OP posts:

KATTT · 04/01/2011 07:47

Clare 123

Look at prh47bridge's comments and look at oracle's comments. There's a great insight into the two different systems here.

Which system would you rather your child was in? Which is going to be looking our for your child's best interests?

OracleOfDelphinium · 04/01/2011 08:09

I should probably add that I am not a great advocate of children being in the 'wrong' year. My own children are in the school year that corresponds to their d.o.b; I just deferred their starting dates (DS went straight in to Y1) and asked for p/t for the others in Reception.

WillbeanChariot · 04/01/2011 08:10

This thread is stressing me out... DS isn't even two yet but I will have to apply for primary school for him this September. He was born three months premature in late august and is fairly behind although doing brilliantly considering what he went through. I know he may catch up a bit before school, but it seems so unfair to have to send him when he will be effectively 15 months younger than the youngest in the class! I guess I will have to contact my LEA sooner rather than later about teaching him 'out of year'.

KATTT · 04/01/2011 09:07

Sorry to hear that Willbean. Be interested to hear how you get on.

Karoleann · 04/01/2011 09:46

I didn't think DS1 would be ready for school in the september when we applied in the January - he was 4 and 8 weeks. They change so much at that age - he wasn't able to hold a pencil well either and wasn't taht interested in learning letters either.
But, I was really suprised, they don't do very much in the first half term in reception - its just getting used to being at school and sitting and listening. They started doing proper "learning" after the half term, but its still very basic.
He's started to blend words now. But its still learning through play.
The problem will be if you hold him back, he won't have had this very early settling in bit.
Most Pre-prep at reception (unless you go somewhere more progressive like King Alfreds in North london) are much more academic, he'll probably struggle more.

GrizzlyMacDuff · 04/01/2011 09:58

if you are going to go private and want them to accommodate different learning styles and no academic work in the first years you could consider montessori or Steiner? I don't know too much about them, but know that they do not advocate academia until around 7, learning through play is core until around then, might suit your child better. If you are going to pay, then pay for exactly what you want.

neolara · 04/01/2011 10:13

My dd went to school at 4 and 6 weeks. I was worried like you.

It was fine. She basically just played for a year and had a fabulous time. She adored it. She only went in the mornings until the October half term and then full time after that. If she had found it difficult to cope, I'm sure the school would have been flexible about continuing half days.

From what I've seen, the private schools around here are very much less playbased and more structured than the state schools. This is presumably the opposite of what you would want for your very young ds.

LIZS · 04/01/2011 10:21

dd went at about 4 and 10 days - also fine . I think you need to review this in August rather than go through such angst now. They change and can learn so much in the interim. Don't spoil your enjoyment of this by worrying, possibly unnecessarily. If anything expectations will be higher, less flexible and more formal in preprep.

hatsybatsy · 04/01/2011 11:43

this thread has got very heated?

just to insert a note of calm, my dd started reception aged 4y and 4 weeks and has been just fine. A little bit tired to start with (aren't they all?) but really very happy and settled.

FWIW she is at an independent school and it is v play based which suits her fine. (not sure why people are making all these asumptions about independent schools?)

OP -hope it works out.

LIZS · 04/01/2011 11:51

Mine isn't an assumption about private btw - observation based on dd's experience.

GrizzlyMacDuff · 04/01/2011 11:56

hatsy heated? you need to read some more threads

Original poster

Clare123 · 04/01/2011 17:43

Thank you all for your replies, I do appreciate your comments - will have a chance to read them properly when the children are in bed. Most of the people who have replied saying their child was fine starting at just 4 yrs seem to have daughters.....any mothers of excitable young boys??

OP posts:

CointreauVersial · 04/01/2011 20:19

A friend of mine has a daughter with Downs, born right at the end of August. With all her physical problems it was clear that she wouldn't be ready to start full-time school at four; my friend eventually persuaded the LEA to keep her back a year, but it was a MAJOR battle - they didn't like it at all and fought her all the way (Surrey, btw). Judging by this thread it rather depends where you live as to how the LEA views such requests.

OP - although I said that dd2 was fine starting school at 4, I take your point that she is indeed a girl; she is also the youngest of three, so fairly mature for her age. A first-born boy may be an entirely different matter!!

slummymomma · 04/01/2011 20:52

DS2 started when he was 4 and a week. It worked perfectly fine for him. As DC3 he was very used to the school and well socialised. He was perfectly 'ready' in terms of social and personal skills but showed little interest in formal learning.

He had a wonderful year and made some great friends. In his year all children started in September which, initially, I was unhappy with as his elder brother had experienced a split intake (September/January). One year on, however, I can see that the single entry works well. In a split entry the summer borns are disadvantaged by less experience of school and the fact that friendships are formed in the first term amongst the older children. DS2 is particularly drawn to the 'cooler' older boys and if he hadn't been there from the start I suspect they would have discounted him as a baby.

So IMO don't worry. Don't expect too much formal learning in reception, there's plenty of time for it in year 1. DS2 has made great leaps now he is in year 1.

granted · 04/01/2011 21:57

Yes, Clare - I do have a boy. Like yours, he was v into running around and doing boy stuff - and like yours a summer baby.

And as I've argued very forcibly already on this thread! he loves it - started this Sept (also phased in over a few weeks' of part-time - I think all schools do that, so it's not as though they go from nothing to full days; it is built up gently) and he absolutely loves it. They know boys work differently to girls - lots of big building activities, outdoor activities, etc etc - v v little (if any?) sitting at a table and being made to concentrate - writing is optional - if thet want to do it, they're helped, but if thety don't, that's fine too...

Really, if you're worried, you should go and talk to the reception staff at the school/s you're interested in and ask them what they think - you'll find they deal with this every year, and are used to settling in younger kids and are used to boys wanting to be...well, boys.

:) Honestly.

PS Is he your first-born, out of interest?

sims2fan · 05/01/2011 19:30

Granted - but what you may find is that the youngest and/or 'less ready for school' children don't want to write, and don't want to sit at a table, and so they don't have to in Reception, which is fine. However, a lot of the older and/or more mature children will choose to do that sort of activity, so when they all start Year 1 and the sitting at tables isn't optional anymore (even if there is still a lot of play, in every school I've been in there is some compulsory 'work' every day in Year 1) the older ones (and a few younger ones who were ready earlier) are at an advantage, because they will already know how to write letters, sound out words, write simple sums, etc. It is not a problem for the younger Year One children to learn all that this year, but from my expereince as a teacher, some of them will then remain 'behind' their peers all the way through primary school. And the ones who do catch up will often have had a hard slog to do so, whereas if they had been allowed to start school a year later they would have been more ready and wouldn't have been behind to begin with. This is not the case for all summer born children. My SIL states that she is glad she was a late August birthday, as she would have been utterly bored if she'd had to wait another year to start school. But, it is the case for many.

Original poster

Clare123 · 06/01/2011 18:17

Sims2fan - Are you a teacher? I am seriously considering the private option so that we do what is right for him and work with a school, rather than goverment rules that don't have any regard for individual differences. What is your opinion on this? We have found a lovely little school, that has a pre prep that he would go into first.

OP posts:

mrz · 06/01/2011 18:37

I've taught numerous "just four" boys in reception who have done really well (often outshining their older classmates). I've also taught "almost five" girls (and boys) who struggled. It's down to individual children and how well prepared they are for school life without mum or other adults seeing to their every need.
I can't say I've experienced what Sims describes as many younger children like to work at a table with an adult.

KATTT · 06/01/2011 19:29

Clare I'm not a teacher but I do have one child at a private primary and one child at a state one.

You've put your finger on one of the main differences between the two.

I've thought long and hard about it. It's not about smaller classes, more motivated parents. It's about power. In the state system the school has all the power - you have none. None at all you can't complain, you can't move your kid (they're all full round her), they can dismiss you, refuse to see you, be rude - nothing you can do about it.

In the private school it's a more even distribution of power, you are paying for a service. This has a lot of effects from the more minor - all the staff are much more professional in their attitudes. To the absolute central one - everyone has the same goal - getting the best out of your child.

mrz · 06/01/2011 20:41

Sorry KATTT that isn't my experience as a parent or a teacher.

sims2fan · 06/01/2011 21:22

Clare - yes I am a teacher. All I would say regarding state vs primary is to be really sure that the private school is not a pushy one, which demands more of 4 year olds than a state school would. I once knew a little boy who started nursery at a private school aged 3 and a half, and within weeks had gone from being a fun loving bundle of energy, who was forever doing forward rolls, and was so keen to explore everything, etc, to a little nervous wreck who sat and bit his nails all the time.

onadietcokebreak · 06/01/2011 21:38

Sims2fan- the poor boy that is so sad,

OP does your son go to pre school or nursery? My DS is 4 thus September. I actually think he would be ready to go and us going to be bored another year in nursery.

howtoapproach · 10/01/2011 13:18

My DD is an older one (September birthday) but was still v immature - couldn't sit still etc when she started.

They seemed to group them for phonics and things very early on, so that learning was at their own pace.

A friend of mine kept her DS in pre-school until Xmas - he was very bored by the end and missed a whole term of phonics - mine has learnt all the letters, sounds, blending and is now reading quite well in the space of the first term.

They do grow up very quickly once they start and I think the reception teachers are very willing to help if a dc is having trouble settling.

If it were me, I would be more inclined to get dc used to longer days - perhaps in a pre-school setting with a view to starting in September.

But then I don't have the private option....

WilfShelf · 10/01/2011 13:32

" all the staff are more professional in their attitudes"? In a private school compared to state. Bloody hell, that's going to win you lots of teacher friends...

I have never experienced anything but utmost professionialism in my 11 years of kids in state schools. I'd be very surprised to find any deficiencies there.

booble · 13/01/2011 14:38

As a mum of a daughter who is born half way through August I think its very important especially for the younger ones in the class to start school with their peers in September. If they don't they will be even more behind in january when the other date for entry is for many schools. the class teacher wont teach one curriculum to the septemeber starters and a different one to the jan starters. If you feel that your child is not keeping up then work with him/her at home. Ask the teacher what was covered that day and go over it again at a suitable time. If you start school late, the child will have missed out and valuable teaching.

Teachers are used to teaching summer born children and wont expect them to concentrate as well.

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