Should new teachers get paid more?

[nappyaddict]

My sister is in her 2nd year of teaching. She teaches Year 6. It works out that her take home pay is only 70 pound more than her boyfriend who has no qualifications and works as a chef in a small pub, on 6.20 an hour and works 48 hours a week.

But he probably does 8 weeks more than her per year.

Her salary will increase at a rate that his will probably not match

48 hours a week is a lot of contracted hours, most people will only be contracted to do 37 or 40 (though they may do more).

So do we think because teachers get a lot of holiday then they should get a lower salary?

The pay goes up quite quickly. I think it's fine.

No what I meant was her boyfriends is artificially high as he is working a lot of hours (contracted ones not extra that your sister may or may not do).

I agree that the boyfriend is working very high hours.

Have you included pensions in the calculations?

The holiday is in general a red herring - research shows that teachers actually average out at at same amount of hours worked as someone on a typical 37.5 hour job with short holidays.

If he had a 40 hour job the difference would still only be 103.94 a week.

I know the salary does go up quite quickly but I am just wondering whether the starting salary should be more, or whether it should increase less steeply but start increasing sooner IYSWIM.

teachers in general should be paid more not just nqts

It's not an unreasonable starting salary IMO. And there is quick progression. We do get a lower salary because we have long holidays I think.

104 pounds a week is 400 a month take home

Even if this were a month (104), the progression in teaching is such and the pension is good that it is still a pretty good package. Unless her boyfriend moves to a very prestigious restaurant or owns his own business he will struggle to keep pace with her earnings.

I think it's unfair that they get lower salary because of the holidays. They also work longer than contracted hours which like GrendelsMum pointed out all averages out in the end.

Well yes - I'm just done working now, and I will be in school at 7.30 - so I get that it's long hours. But next week I'm on holiday! I'm pretty well paid really (quite a senior position) - and am more bothered about other things rather than salary.

Most professions are expected to give more than the contracted hours. I'm afraid it is the way of the world. Teachers probably have more job security compared with a chef in a pub. You shouldn't be comparing her salary to her boyfriends, but that of perhaps a merchant banker or Jeremy Kyle and asking why do they get so much?

nappyaddict, other people will similar qualifications to your dsis don't necessarily get paid more

a friend of mine was bemoaning the fact that her husband was paid so little as a newly qualified teacher. In the end I asked her to name the sum: it was more than my husband got after 20 years with the same firm, in a job that entails managerial responsibilities and requires a BA. The difference being that dh has had to watch half his colleagues being laid off every few years and wondering if it's going to be him next. Job security is next to nothing. Oh, and he often has to work long hours (no overtime compensation- has to be taken in lieu, when work slows down) and travel halfway across the country

If people can't afford to live on a teacher's salary, it makes you wonder how they would live on most ordinary people's wages.

All teachers should be paid more.

It doesn't go up significantly quickly, no more so than other jobs.

Friends of mine who went into graduate positions after uni other than teaching are mostly on about 5-15k more than me. (I'm actually a SAHM now, but I mean last year).

When I started teaching, I left a job that paid 5k/year more, plus company car. Yes, we have the holidays, but sadly the way to attract the brightest teachers isn't by paying so poorly.

yes they should,be paid more overall imvho, but dh is a teacher and it one of those dedicated ones that do prep work as it hsould be done etc, holidays are genrally spent marking and prepping, as are nights and weekends. He is looking for a 2nd job to do in hols so we can manage.

he can type much better too.....

Teachers pay scale

www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=6000186

There are other links on there for more senior possitions SEN etc.

DD1 is in her NQT year and teaching at a Secondary School in London. |She was put straight on to point 3 which is good, However she works far more than her contracted hours, She is planning lessons and marking work most weekends and evenings. Also her school has a differnt timetable for the 6th form. They start lessons at 11.30 and finish at 5,30. So she is sometimes teaching from 8.30 to 5,30.

sorry, exaggerating there, should have been "halfway across county", not "country"

sorry LoupyLou - you are wrong.
I somehow have managed to surround myself with teacher friends and know very well that when they reach the top of their payscale (which has a greater number of points than any other I know of), they have the opportunity to progess through the three 'upper' payscales.
Other LA employees have three points to their payscale and then that is it.
Also, there is the job security, the pension and, yes, the holidays. I get sick of hearing how most teachers work more hours than they are contracted to. Everyone does in an effort to keep their job. NONE of the friends that I have who teach work anything like the number of hours that are often quoted and NONE of them have any work whatsoever to do in the summer hols (or any other hols)
MOST of the friends that I have who teach freely admit that they only teach because they did not know what else to do - not a vocation at all.

Slightly tangental, but to answer your post, I think your friend is comparing apples and pears. Her career and earning potential is far greater than her partners and she should look at the whole package (both now and her potential)

Sorry LaydeeBB, but you are wrong.

Show me another profession that requires post-graduate qualifications and pays so badly. Show me a comparable LA position that requires this level of qualification.

As for your friends, it would appear that you have somehow managed to surround yourself with unmotivated, lazy teachers, who go against the norm. Either that or you aren't getting the bigger picture from them. I can assure you that the majority of teachers that I know teach because they love teaching, and put in a lot of extra time and effort to ensure the children in their care receive the best possible education.

Regarding job security, the teaching profession is being hit just as hard as any other industry. My school has had to make non-voluntary redundancies every year for the past three years, on quite a wide scale. Sadly, the more experienced and older teachers are the first to go as they do cost more.

I cant see a reason for paying new teachers more. The salary is pretty comparable with other graduate careers when first starting out.

I will now don my flame retardant pants.

Most people think they are under-paid and over-worked. The thing is that teachers (and their families) are very vocal about it.

Before teachers claim parity with other careers they should really consider the details.

How do levels of qualification compare?

What level of qualification does a qualified teacher have? Professional qualifications such as a solicitor or accountant have are ranked alongside Masters level. Do teaching qualifications match? Do teachers advance their levels of qualification? Many other professionals move their education along throughout their careers through further study such as Continuous Professional Development, further degrees etc. Do teachers do the same?

Focussing on hours worked is a mistake - most professionals work long hours especially at the start. If teachers want to be paid like professionals then they need to be sure that they behave like professionals. Many do but some dont.