For those with children learning a musical instrument...

[Tinker]

...when do you admit defeat and throw in the towel? My 8 year old was learning the violin in Year 3. Hated it. Got frustrated practising it, hated the teacher. Now, from what she says teacher sounds like a bit of a prima donna (male - would he be a primo don?) - sulking, shouting, sending them to the head/out if got bits wrong. Oh, and very unreliable (So much so that I wrote to the head about him) When she was practising, at first she was happy but as it became more complicated and, therefore, more errors were made during lessons, she became a lot more anxious about the whole thing. By the end she was hardly practising at all unless nagged and saying she hated it.

She wants to give up. I, living vicariously,, would like her to continue. Is it worth pursuing with a private tutor if the desire is not there? Can a good teacher make much difference to a reluctant student?

Thanks

Thank you

the teacher makes a tremendous difference. My children moved schools and the loss of enthusiasm for one instrument was obvious! If my oldest had not been starting secondary I'd definitely have gone for a private tutor. We're hoping to see a revival of interest when the new lessons start.

Tinker, I copied this over from another message for you as it seemed relevant!

Hi
Im a educational consultant in music education and this is what i think. firstly research suggests that we are all musical - whether you think you are or not is more to do with your musical experiences to date. Most people in our culture have extremely limited musical experience and have been put off of music by teachers and other folk who have put them down or made them feel that they are not musical. When you are involved in musical activity your brain lights up like a christmas tree - music stimulates every single part of your brain unlike no other activity - it even stimulates parts of your brain that are never stimulated by anything else. Music is crucial to our sound development in fact After the research i have done i thinkit is vitaly important that we all are engaged in some sort of musical activity - However i would shy away from any activity that didnt give us some kind of worthwhile feeling. Now lets take instrument tuition - a lot of instrumental teaching can be boring and fails actually to involve us musically and can infact put us off for life - £60 for a violin in the grande scheme of things for a life time of enjoyment is not very much money. The violin is an extremely difficult insrument to learn and play and I would recommend it for only a few - and infact i think it helps to have knowledge of another instrument before taking up the violin. Consider why you are sending your daughter for lessons - is it your desire or hers - would she prefer to take up another instrument - and why not let her try most music shops these days do very good hire schemes where you can quite simply try before you buy. In addition to this you need to allow your daughter to see the bigger picture - does she know what she could acheive by learning an instrument - learning to play sometimes is a hard slog and needs discipline - but if you never seem to get any better and all anyone does is have a go at you theres not musch incentive. She needs to see other people playing and realise what she could acheive

hth a bit

kate

The original message is here

The one bit of advice that I have to pass on is to stay with your child when they are having lessons until you know the teacher.

DS was having violin lessons with the susuki method which meant we had to learn too.

These lessons were held at the local "school of music" and his teacher was very very creepy and behaved and sat and touched DS in a strange way.

DS was 5 years old,

I couldn't cope with being in the same room as this teacher and so we stopped going we still had to pay to the end of the term.

DS is now 10 and plays the trumpet with lessons from school.

I agree that you should change the teacher, but IMHO I would be wary of someone that put flyers through the door.

Good luck

My dd1 and dd both played the violin at school from age 8 and have both now given up. I was not impressed with the attitude of the music teacher, who did not really tailor the lessons to ability but to school year. Ds was especially good but has now started at secondary school and did not want to miss lessons or carry his violin around all day. The main problem here is the lack of fun things to do with the violin outside school - no orchestras for primary age. Can't be much fun just practising in your bedroom. DD has now started the piano which is much more successful for her in terms of enthusiasm, and she has a head start knowing notes etc. Also, although it is more expensive, she is taught alone and the teacher has skipped through all the bits she already knows (having been on the waiting list for 3 years!). Try just backing off and not insisting on practice more than a couple of times a week, as they do come and go with instruments, but it may be that another instrument would be better.

Oh, we're on Discussion of the Day

Thanks for more thought-provoking posts. I'll see if she has the same teacher this year, if not, I'll try and persuade her to try again. Teacher really was unreliable though. Would just not turn up for some lessons, off for about 3 weeks once after having a car crash and didn't even bother to tell the school. Think that's when the rot set in. They'd practise and he wouldn't turn up to listen. They get demoralised/lose interest and he would get annoyed.

Otherwise, shall try a private tutor and then think about different instrument. Interesting, though, that the violin is considered more difficult.

Message withdrawn

snailspace - you're probably right. I'm not forcing her, honestly . Will see what happens this term and play it by ear - 'scuse the pun.

Message withdrawn

As a teacher - I've taken children that were "bored" with their existing teacher and wanted to try me, because people had told them I was more fun.

My opinion - most of them are already turned off, they have stopped listening to themselves play and the instrument is dead for them. Once they stop practising they go backwards and a new teacher faces the challenge of taking them back a few steps without them noticing.

Most of these students are behind people I started off at the start of the year, because they don't practise. BUT they claim to be enjoying themselves. Argh - I don't know the answer either, and I'm supposed to.

Ooh there's nothing worse than an awful teacher. My mum was determind I would play the guitar & sent me to all sorts of teachers. One would make us sit in a circle & strum Beatles songs...and...he would like us to sing I have a terrible singing voice & would mime ( age 10/11), he'd notice & say, come on xxxx I know you're desperate to join in. Actually, thinking back he was nice, it was me that HATED the guitar. (I never practised either).

Whose idea was it for DD to play the violin ? does anyone else play violin/instrument in your family ? if not, it might be worth someone else taking up something. Perhaps she doesn't grasp the concept of music -I didn't because a guitar, to me, is just cords & so didn't sound like a proper song, such as a piano would.
It's great to play an instrument so shame for her to give it up.

Sounds like the Little Prince, hausfrau (was that a boa in a French horn?)

batters - they're not. She was quite adamant she didn't want to go in that man was teaching and, heeding the advice on here, thought no pint in forcing the issue . Her best friend is still doing it so she (my daughter) must really dislike the lessons. Have looked into getting a music studnet to teach her - will let you know if that goes anywhere. What about yours? Have a violin I could sell

As an ex violin teacher I think that the teacher/pupil relationship has everything to do with progress. Some teachers are great - just not with young children. Some are quite frankly mad. As a Head of Music I had to sack (or get ht to) 2 borough recommended teachers - one was using drugs and one was quite frankly useless. There was also the lovely old guy with the incontinence problem. Dds both started and gave up at school - teacher is a lovely woman just not great with beginners. I think learning outside is the best solution by far - progress is. usually much quicker and you actually meet the teacher regularly. I'd tell the school you don't feel you're getting good value for money - it could be lots of others feel the same way. Sounds like a big injection of fun ways to learn the violin is needed.

I've gone on a bit but this is one of my many soapbox issues - yet another area where our education system too often provides a mediocre service

My eldest DD started learning the violin at 3 and was a "natural" according to her lovely teacher. She loved playing and had group and individual sessions. She passed her grade 1 when she was 6. Then we moved to another part of the country and found her another teacher. He taught in a very different way and soon DD was determined to give up which she did. Now her younger sister is learning and she is very envious. She really wishes she hadn't stopped as they could play together and it would be a lot more fun. I am hoping that she will ask to have lessons again as she did seem to have a talent for it. From this experience I think finding the right teacher is key to success.