Welsh vs English primary education/curriculum

[Mirrorball]

Does anyone have any insight into Welsh vs English primary education. Our local primary school, just over the border in north wales uses the Foundation Stage up to year two. I think this is the same as English schools?

I'm sure there are some teachers on here who could perhaps advise me of any advantages/disadvantages with this curriculum?

In Wales it is Foundation Phase where children work up into year 2 through play, through doing etc from 3-7 years .....England foundation stage goes from 3-5 although I do not know a lot about it TBH.

I work in Wales and yes I like foundation phase if it is done corretly as you do get a more well rounded child from it.

In England the Foundation Stage goes up to the end of Reception, in Wales it goes up to the end of Year 2.

As SaliMali said, if it is done properly the Welsh system is very good. They still learn to read and write etc, but in a far more relaxed and play based atmosphere.

Obviously it is still far too early to tell what effect it has in later life as the first year group to properly go through it are only going into Year 2 in September (although some older children took part in the trial). But it is based on the Scandinavian system, where children seem to do very well from a more relaxed start.

Thank you for your replies.

ds - do you think that left in the hands of one reception teacher plus one nursery teacher and two teaching assistants to 56 kids the 'free play' may become just a big unstructured free for all couple of hours.

The set up is that from 9ish til 11ish nursery and reception have free play together.... how can teaching staff supervise and help the playing become learning for each child with a ratio of 4 or 5 members of staff to 56 kids? I'm concerned!

I appreciate the learning through play Scandinavian system, must do some more reading on the subject...

I am suprised at that ratio of staff to children. I work as a nursery school teacher and the minimum ratio for 3 and 4 year olds is one adult to 8 children. So for 56 children there would be 7 adults.

The English EYFS covers birth to 5 KS1 begins in Y1 whereas as SaiMali says the Welsh curriculum will cover 3-7 (more sensible in my opinion) but at the moment still being phased in gradually so up to now 3- 5s with 5-6 year olds included from September and 6-7s from September 2011.
Both curricula are based on similar principals -lots of experiential learning through children's interests. So very similar approaches and methods.
The Foundation Phase in Wales recommended a ratio of 1 adult to 8 children for 3-5s in England it can be as high as 1 adult to 30 4-5s but issues with funding in Wales have impacted on ratios.

5-6 year olds (the children who have just finished Year 1) have been included from last September, Year 2 will be included from this September mrz

Basically it is the same group of children who started Reception in September 2008 (DS2 was one of them), they were the first Reception Year to have the FPC, then the first Yr1, from September they will be the first Yr2.

Is the nursery section of the school in the OP inspected by CSIW? As they would not allow a ratio of less than 1 to 8.

In the nursery school in which I work the ratio is 1 to 8. In my DD's Reception class in September there will be 16 children with one teacher and one TA. In DS2's Yr1+2 mixed class there will be 24 children with one teacher and one TA (plus a SEN 1:1 assistant).

I don't think that is the case across Wales some areas piloted the curriculum and are a year ahead. I have to admit my information comes from research I did a few years ago and not first hand but the Welsh Assembly website says the same here

The Foundation Phase will be implemented over four years as follows:

* 1 September 2008 for all 3 to 4-year-olds in the Foundation Phase
* 1 September 2009 for all 4 to 5-year-olds in the Foundation Phase
* 1 September 2010 for all 5 to 6-year-olds in the Foundation Phase
* 1 September 2011 for all 6 to 7-year-olds in the Foundation Phase

The statutory roll-out of the Foundation Phase for three- to-seven-year-olds in Wales is to take a year longer than originally intended.

Education minister Jane Hutt confirmed last week that it would now be introduced over four years.

The decision follows advice from the Foundation Phase Implementation Group, made up of local government representatives, early years specialists, the teaching unions and Estyn, which held its second meeting last week.

The change means that the roll-out of the curriculum for three- to-five-year-olds will take place over two years, with the Foundation Phase for three- to four-year-olds statutory from September for the 2008-09 school year.

09 September 2009, 00:00am

The Welsh Foundation Phase entered the second phase of its roll-out last Thursday, when the curriculum was extended to include four- to five-year-olds.

Except in Powys who started the role out a term later for N children. Wales also have been garenteed money so all schools should have a 1-8 ratio in 3years, n and r classes and a 1-15 ratio in years 1 then eventually in year 2 also. This is the recommened ratio and if the school is not doing this then Estyn(the inspection team) will pull the school up for it.

There is lots of emphasis in PF on problem solving activities.

Maybe its because we were involved in the pilots then (my setting actually started the FPC in September 2006 as part of the second wave of trials, the primary school was also involved).

DS1 has just finished Yr 2 and he was taught using the FPC despite being too old for the "official" start.

Maybe other schools are later, as you say.

Regardless of this, the school in the OP should not have a group of 56 children with 4 adults. Estyn and CSIW would have a fit!

Oh I missed that 1 could it be a open class with 2 class teachers and a more open learning system? Yes ESTYN and CSSIW would have a fit if not.

funding shortfall

www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/2010/03/16/headteachers-concerns-over-funding-for-foundation-phase-91466-26039116/

kirstywilliams.org.uk/news/000470/report_confirms_foundation_phase_fiasco.html
I'm an outsider so my knowledge is from reading obviously those of you working in Wales will have first hand experience.

I think that the foundation phase money has been provided now and garenteed this is at the expese of 3 year old funding in the county I work.

I was aware that there was a funding shortfall for school budgets as a whole (I am secretary of the PTA in my DC's school and we have to find money to pay for a lot of things which would have previously been funded by the LEA). In September 2008 the Reception class had 2 TAs, but by September 2009 there wasn't enough money to employ both of them plus an extra TA who was needed for Yr 1 under the FPC, so one of the TAs from the Reception class moved into the Yr1&2 class. In September there will be 16 children in the Reception class, so the one teacher plus one TA will make a 1:8 ratio, however when another 4 children start in January and then another 2 after Easter there will be more children in the class and probably still no money to pay for a 2nd TA.

I wonder if anyone who has experienced both sides of the fence have found there to be a certain shortage of concentration span in foundation phase due to, basically, not learning to sit down and apply themselves to a task for a sustained period?
At least that's what a teacher suggested when assessing my dcs who, having been progressing well and leaving the Welsh FP with excellent reports, found themselves bottom of the class in their new English primary

Google www.flintshire.gov.uk or www.wrexham.gov.uk Some schools in Wales are introducing EYFS early years Foundation stage. Google EYFS Wales

kissingfrogs how old are your children?

It isn't unusual for children who were doing well (or even high achievers) in one school to find they perhaps aren't coping so well in a new school nothing at all to do with the foundation phase or any other curriculum just a different group of children

LucindaCarlisle Wales has it's own statutory curriculum for 3-7 year olds not the EYFS

mrz: ages 5 & 6. You may have a point as they were still settling in before the end of summer term. Thankyou.