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eBay

If you buy or sell items on eBay, you will find tips and advice on this forum.

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Original poster

Perfume selling on Ebay and EU Law

25 replies

cardamomginger · 26/12/2013 14:45

I sell (or at least used to) perfume on Ebay. Mainly decants of high end/exclusive/hard to find fragrances. I decant these myself into glass vials or atomisers. Last year it was all tickety-boo. Lots of other sellers were selling similar products and everyone seemed happy. I sold to some lovely people and, other than a few inevitable impossible to please buyers, people were happy with what I provided.

Ebay have now banned the sale of decants and unofficial samples and partially full bottles. This is all part of their policy and I accept that I can no longer sell on Ebay.

Ebay are claiming that it is against EU Law to sell either a decant or a partially full bottle of scent or any type of cosmetic product. I've had a plough through some of the (immensely dull) EU legislation on cosmetic sales and cannot find anything that bans these kind of sales. All I can find is a requirement for a list of ingredients to be provided with products sold and that, where the size of the product does not permit the list to be stuck to the container, the list may be separately printed and supplied 'in close proximity' to the product. That's fine - I can do that.

Does anyone know anything about EU Law on this topic? Is Ebay right? Or can I legally sell decants? As I say, I accept that I can no longer sell on Ebay, but if I can find another forum on which to sell I would like to. An alternative is to set up my own website. But I want to be legal!

OP posts:

ToysRLuv · 27/12/2013 15:33

I left e-bay because of this as well. one of my listings was removed and I decided to go before I was banned. Now have huge amount of vintage and niche stock and bottles..

Apparently the big perfume firms have managed to get some kind of special law, so their products cannot be sold if they're not in original branded containers/packets, as their "brand might be damaged", I sort of get this, as it's sometimes hard to prove a vintage bottle is authentic (no receipt), but then again, how can you prove that other designer gear in this price bracket (e.g. clothes) are authentic? Sometimes there is no way to prove this 100%.

Fucking annoying.

Fancy swapping decants?

Original poster

cardamomginger · 29/12/2013 15:11

It sucks.

I've gen back to Ebay to try to get them to cite the exact piece of EU legislation banning these sales. So far, they have utterly failed and have kept on referring me to Ebay policy. I was aware of the 'brand protection' thingy, but believed it to only be certain brands and that whilst they had been able to get Ebay to agree to ban such sales, it was not illegal as such for private individuals. Anyway sending daily emails to Ebay asking them to answer the question I am actually asking, rather than the one they want me to ask, is giving me something to do I suppose....

(And you are right - the logical conclusion is it is illegal to sell any designer clothes, handbags, jewellery etc second hand. Daft.)

Am thinking of setting up independently, but might be up for the odd swap in the meantime. What have you got? PM me?

OP posts:

scaevola · 29/12/2013 15:15

Might it be something to do with excise duty?

Can you sell fags and booze (other items subject to excise duty)?

Original poster

cardamomginger · 29/12/2013 16:11

i've already paid duty on the stuff I sell and i'm not sure goods can attract duty twice over. goods sold on after having been bought once don't attract a second lot of vat. but if it was a question of ending to pay duty surely I could arrange for this to be done?

thanks for the thought - will Google and see what turns up. but why the flip eBay can't just point to the exact bit of legislation is beyong me.

OP posts:

LidlAngel · 29/12/2013 16:15

I'm a bit confused - I've just gone onto Ebay and searched for "Jo Malone perfume" and there are loads of part used bottles? Or are part used bottles different?

MollyBerry · 29/12/2013 16:20

If they're part used they're still in their original containers.

eBay may never come back to you with the legislation just beacuse they don't have to - they run the website and like MN they make the rules!

SandyDilbert · 29/12/2013 16:22

I agree - ebay rules don't necessarily mean that is the law - ebay make their own rules for sellers, regardless of any legislations.

Original poster

cardamomginger · 29/12/2013 17:20

if it's just eBay policy, then fine. they can do what they want. but they specifically told me it was because it was illegal under EU law. yet they have repeatedly not met my request that they cite the exact piece of legislation making it illegal.

yes, some partially full bottles and decants are listed. but far, far, far fewer than used to be the case. I think as they find them, they delete them and forbid sellers from listing them, or similar.

OP posts:

SandyDilbert · 29/12/2013 17:21

well no amount of you emailing them is going to change what they say is it. I would just leave it if I were you. Current listings will be removed if they are reported.

Original poster

cardamomginger · 29/12/2013 17:27

i'm not asking them to change their policy - I accept I can no longer sell on eBay.

I do want them to produce this piece of legislation that they claim makes selling these items illegal. given that I can't find any mention of this in EU law, I think my request is reasonable! i'm not doing this to be awkward or difficult - I genuinely want to know what the legal position actually is!

OP posts:

DoItTooBabyJesus · 29/12/2013 17:30

If it is an eu law, there will need to be an English, Scottish or Welsh Statute to enact it. Maybe ask ebay which domestic law enacts the EU law they are thinking of.

The domestic legislation will also have offences, defences and penalties listed, so well worth looking into from that angle.

Obviously, they may well be trying to dress their policy up as something more substantial, in which case there will be neither domestic nor EU law for you to look into!

MissBattleaxe · 29/12/2013 17:34

I agree that this is a total bugger. I often used to sell disappointing blind buys on ebay.

I guess you could Fragrantica and Basenote forums to swap? Or ebay Facebook Groups?

ToysRLuv- I'd be interested in what you have too.

Original poster

cardamomginger · 29/12/2013 17:38

thanks doittoo. at the moment they are stuck in a loop of avoiding my request, through stupidity, not reading my emails, or willfully ignoring what I say.

where would I look to see if there is anything in English law?

OP posts:

Original poster

cardamomginger · 29/12/2013 17:40

missb - thought of those, but i'm more interested in selling than doing swaps. I was doing pretty well from it when all was ok. not enough to get rich, but it made life a bit easier around the edges!

OP posts:

DoItTooBabyJesus · 29/12/2013 18:04

It will need to be a fairly new law, and that's tricky to get through at the minute as there is a 1 in, 1 out policy so no new laws unless one is repealed IYSWIM?

I'll have a google and see if I can find anything!

DoItTooBabyJesus · 29/12/2013 18:17

eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CONSLEG:1976L0768:20070919:EN:PDF

Is this the directive you've been directed to?

It's old! And relates much more to the safety of the product.

Original poster

cardamomginger · 29/12/2013 18:18

thank you! 1 in, 1 out, eh? seems like a strange (and somewhat Monty python-esque) basis for government and legislation !

OP posts:

Original poster

cardamomginger · 29/12/2013 18:20

yes! exactly - ingredients and labeling (and i can photocopy them). nothing as far as I could see about decants or partially full bottles.

OP posts:

DoItTooBabyJesus · 29/12/2013 18:51

The 1 in 1 out is because there is too much law, spread out all over the place. I agree it's ridiculous.

Nothing that I can see either. It's an ebay smokescreen by the looks of it.

Also, it's old enough to have a domestic statute, but I can't find it, sorry. I will have another look though.

ToysRLuv · 29/12/2013 22:29

Cardamom and MissBattleaxe: I'm currently visiting relatives abroad until the 6th. Would be gappy to swap or sell decants after that. Have got full list somewhere on the latest perfume addicts thread on S&B. Will dig it out tomorrow when in my laptop.

I think e-bay's afraid of being sued for ££££££ again, like l'oreal did to their french subsidiary, I think. No idea under what law/guise, though..

ToysRLuv · 29/12/2013 22:31

"gappy" = happy (thanks Kindle keyboard!)

MissBattleaxe · 30/12/2013 10:01

Thanks Toys. I used to be on that thread under a different guise but it got too tempting to be on it all the time so I had to leave! It was very addictive, worse than Facebook or Twitter.

ToysRLuv · 30/12/2013 16:58

Cardamom and MissBattleaxe: Have sent you lists Please do contact me if you fancy anything!

It's true about the addictiveness! It was the thread that made me branch out to e-bay.. I'm staying out now

Pendulum · 30/12/2013 17:13

Have you had a look at the law on repackaging? It's a trade mark issue. If you are altering the packaging and 'dress' of the item and selling it under the original trade mark, this might be the problem.

Flibbertyjibbet · 30/12/2013 17:17

Its probably just another way ebay are restricting sales of things when the original producers object.

2 years ago I sold a 'one squirt to test' channel Mademoiselle which gave me a migrane. It had been a pressie off my sister who won it but didn't wear perfume. We got a good price for it. I suspect that Chanel hate this sort of sale as they would consider it devaluing of their high-end brand.

But its such a shame as the part used bottles let people buy and wear the scents that they might not be able to afford otherwise.

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