Teen Eating Disorders Thread 7

[Lottsbiffandsmudge]

We have managed to fill the previous Thread here https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/eating_disorders/4471980-Teen-Eating-Disorders-Thread-6?page=40

So I thought I would start a new one.

Everyone supporting a young person with and ED is welcome here for advice (non professional but lived experience) and support.

Hoping everyone can find us...

@D1ANA22 yes she still has pudding and snacks. Only two snacks though, will not eat the evening one. I’m in awe of you getting your dd to 104%, we’ve been stuck at 86% for so long. I was still loading for ages but then she was of the mindset that she didn’t need to eat much because she could eat less and still maintain 🙄

@LittlePickleHead when we have been to events/on holiday with family I’ve just made sure I had lots of food in my bag, not made too big of a deal about eating/not eating at the table but made her eat more later. It’s not easy. But actually one meal my sister had cooked and dd was pushing it around her plate and pulling faces and my sister got cross with her and she did then go on and eat it and was markedly better at mealtimes afterwards. I think sometimes they think we’re just being really unreasonable for making them eat and when my sister got annoyed dd realised its not just me being a dick!

The loading food thing is so tricky as I think in the early days it's really important to get those fats and calories into them as quickly as possible to help restore brain function.

However now we're in a situation where what dd thinks she needs to eat to maintain and what I know she needs to eat to maintain are quite different.

I don't load food like I used to however I still make calorie dense meals and when we were on holiday in Portugal dd lost weight eating, in her mind, similar amounts to at home.

It is a minefield, my thoughts are I'll keep going until I see a shift hopefully in her mentality and she can start eating freely.

Love I don't want to scare you but the low heart rate and abnormal bloods are not good, I'd want to speak to a Consultant as well. There should be a clear escalation plan and you should know what the risks are in her being at home vs hospital. The 'it's normal for her' is normally medical talk for very chronically unwell patients and my fear is they're risking your dds life by ignoring the warning signs.

If your dd seems even a little bit worse than usual I'd take her to a&e or call an ambulance.

I've reported the spam post.

@Moomarre thank you for the insight of your experience. DD is 104% but her eating is not natural - if we backed off I believe she would relapse quite quickly and sadly she also resorts to other maladaptive coping methods.

Her mood is better and she is not as anxious.

I'm sitting here sobbing once again as dd blew the evening apart over something completely ridiculous.

And to add insult to injury I can hear her in her room face timing friends laughing and joking.

She's even horrible to the poor cat who sits meowing at the door being ignored.

Even if we get through this I feel like our relationship will be damaged forever. I don't think I will ever forget these awful days.

@Whyisthishappeningtous sorry to hear what a difficult time you’re having. I read somewhere that the anorexic sufferer doesn’t remember the worst behaviour that they inflict on their family and I will never recount to her the dreadful things that happen, leave that in history. My DD is approaching 16 - I resign myself that our relationship was never going to be the same as she grows up anyway so don’t cling to ‘old DD’ anymore.

One day I believe that she will realise that DH and I saved her life - and she will be aware of the love that we have for her.

I have seen glimpses of our DD this evening - it can be done.

@Whyisthishappeningtous how are you this morning? It is so draining and anxiety inducing being a parent of someone with an ED. I remember that feeling of always being in the brink, wondering when the explosion would occur and what would be lobbied at me as a failing. Sometimes, you just can't hold back and the tears fall and I don't think it did my Dd any harm to see the impact on us all. But it can and does improve and relationships can be restored- hold on in there

Why I've been in that exact position so many times with dd over the last couple of years. Even to the point that she would be the same with the pets, that she usually adores. I can remember being so angry with her and life that this was happening and that dd 'allowed' it to happen.

Somehow you just have to keep putting one foot in front of another and believing that this illness is not your dd.

My dd is now in a v similar place to D1s dd and I can see her slowly coming back to me, our relationship has changed but she is 16 now so it's natural that the relationship will evolve and reshape.

I found with dd that she seemed to go through stages similar to the stages of grief; denial, bargaining, anger, depression and hopefully finally acceptance.

Its also okay for you to want to scream, shout and sob - you're only human and I think everyone on this thread has been there.

Big hugs @Whyisthishappeningtous. I feel the same - one of the best tank gs

Oops! What I was going to say was one of the best things about this group are all those who have been through the same and have got their kids back. Hang on in there xxx

Hi All, Hang in there, take care of yourselves.

I have two queries please. We have been referred by DR now to ED team, whoever that is.

In the meantime, I wondered, is it ok to say to my DD 'That's the eating disorder talking. But we need to feed you DD, and I understand that is what the ED is saying, but we need to keep you going by feeding you '. ?

Any recommendations on how to talk to her please?

Thanks so much

Hi @HelpNeeded7 Sorry you find yourself here - but welcome! Eva Musby's book and YouTube channel offer some helpful scripts to encourage refeeding. Yes, do encourage her to see ED as separate from herself (if possible - mine doesn't find it possible yet). It's trial and error really though with what works. Lots of people find "Well done" is counter-productive. Direct prompts, e.g. 'pick up the biscuit and eat it' are usually more helpful than explanations about why she needs to eat, as this just gives the ED a chance to argue back.

Thank you everyone. You are all lovely. I feel better today, the great side effect of a good cry is a deep sleep. It's harder when we have a few better days then it comes crashing down.

Helpneeded Yes I say similar things to dd. She knows she must eat but ED voices make her feel guilty. I just say she needs to listen to ME who loves and cares for her and wants her to hsve the best life she can, and not ED who wants her to be ill and miss out on life. Also a lot of empathy and understanding how difficult it is but we're in it together fighting ED.

Great you've been referred help, Eva Musby is really good for what to say/not say. Generally I wouldn't say that's the ED talking but focus more on 'this is what you have to eat' 'this is what your body needs' 'yes it is exactly the right amount' 'trust me I know what you need' etc which you can say on repeat.

I have said to dd on occasion when she says something that is clearly the ED talking 'hmm is that really true or is that what the ED tells you is true?'

Thank you all for your advice and reassurance that I was not behind over anxious I have badgered the consultant and not much has come from it other than we now have three weekly bloods and heart rate etc and an appointment with an ED unit next week however her heart was still below 40 today it terrified me. She has always been an athlete so while it is naturally lower than the average that is beyond that surely ?

sorry I should mention I am obviously very grateful for all the extra help she has been offered and is receiving but am still anxious she needs her heart monitoring more

@lovewinter Is that three times weekly or every three weeks? When my DD's heart rate was in the 40s, the hospital sent out nurses to our house over a bank holiday weekend to check it hadn't fallen below 45 - this was their criterion for hospital admission. Her hospital appointments have only just been reduced from twice weekly to once weekly and her heart rate has been normal for a while now. (Though weight falling unfortunately). Could you send an email to the consultant asking them to "confirm in writing that she is safe at home with her current extremely low heart rate and liver function issues"?

@love sorry to hear about this stress re heart. I hope you get some support and answers soon. Can anyone advise about how to actually work out the WFH percentage? I have been given 2 conflicting percentages within the space of 5 days and I'd like to keep an eye on this myself.

Shitty morning today and I'm questioning if I've done the right thing.

The morning was a bit fraught at DH had to go into the office and so I had to sort both DS9 and DD13. DD decided last minute she needed a lift as she was late and had her instrument to carry. So I had to really rush to get DS to breakfast club so I could get back in time to drive her. I could see she was stressed but I had to rush to make it all possible.

When I got back she was waiting in the hall but clearly upset and when we got in the car she was saying she hated herself, she hates her friends, she hates the horn etc and was very wound up, kicking the glove compartment.

I know she at that point wanted to stay off, but I've found that a day in the house isn't helpful for her mood. So I drove her and calmed her down and she did go in, but before that she was saying she hates herself and wants to die.

Did I do the right thing? She's having issues with her friends because there are so many food obsessed conversations and judgements about what people are eating, and that's one thing I have no idea how to sort out. Some if it is clearly driven by their parents which is extremely frustrating. They are a nice group of girls but clearly the whole dynamic isn't healthy for DD at the moment. But I don't want her to become alienated either.

I just feel so inequipped to deal with any of this, particularly the feelings that she wants to hurt herself when she's that wound up. The anxiety and self loathing she has is ramping up and I wonder if going back to the GP and specially asking to consider medication is the way forward?

@LittlePickleHead sadly, this level of anxiety is normal, but in my view you have done the right thing sending her in to school. My DD would attempt to avoid school and stressful situations, but we would push her for her sake to get out of this maladaptive comfort zone. Sometimes I would compromise if she was feeling 'unwell' - let her settle at home, hot water bottle and paracetamol and take her into school after morning break, it always worked. Staying away from school would have become quite normal for DD and having the two of us in the house together does not help our collective mood.

Two girls I know of developed AN during the first lock down and have not returned to school, home schooled now. They lost contact with their friends and as you say became alienated, their lives are online now and IMO that empowers the isolation that causes and feeds the ED.

The unhelpful conversation with her friends is unavoidable - such conversations are everywhere, instagram thigh gap pictures etc. DD's school spoke to her friends and their parents about DD's diagnosis - not only a safeguarding issue but so that they could help support DD, would school consider this?

Some people swear by medication for their DC's - we didn't follow this path and have found that food and brain healing have resolved a lot of the anxiety and depression and self-loathing, food and weight have improved DD's mood, but it has taken a long time.

Thanks @D1ANA22 for your response. It's reassuring as it's so easy to second guess yourself.

When you say brain healing, do you mean specifically through food, or something else?

It does feel like her brain needs to be healed. She hates herself and thinks she's ugly, she thinks her face is really red and if that was cured everything would be better.

I don't know how to address it - I know early everyone in the world has to come to acceptance with the things about themselves they don't like, but everything I say to DD is wrong and makes her more upset. Does the self loathing get better through refeeding? As I feel that this was a cause and a trigger for the ED

LittlePickleHead Your dd sounds very similar to mine. One of the first signs something was wrong was her breaking down saying she was ugly and hated her body shape. Its very difficult to know what to say. Camhs agree she needs counselling but say she needs to restore more weight first. She is very slowly restoring weight and it's definitely helping her mental state. We have lots of chats about how instagram etc is mostly fake and we watched the Dove advert together with the girl taking off her make up, and I send lots of inspirational quotes and we print off colourings of inspirational quotes and do them together. I just hope and pray that with better nourishment it all starts to sink in.

Sorry to hear your dd was so upset this morning. It's heartbreaking. We've had many similar mornings. Sometimes she just goes with knowledge she can text me to go home. Sometimes she goes later and sometimes I just suggest she stays home and we plan a drive, or watch a movie so she's not just sitting in her room alone.

D1ANA22 is so right that school/college is important they only manage a couple of hours or a half day. Just getting up and ready and out of the house is vital to their mental health (and ours!).

It's difficult with friends and what they see online. My dds close friends do know that dd has an illness and I did speak in basic terms to their mums about it, but friends are obviously not going to be conscious of everything they say. I just try to be the voice of reason at home to try and cancel out anything negative she might have heard.

Love personally I would not be happy with having dd at home with a heart rate that low, it's dangerous and I'm actually quite shocked they're not doing more. Anorexia has a scary high mortality rate and sitting on a heart rate of 40 or less is risking her life imo.

If it were me id be asking for admission and I would want reassurance from a consultant cardiologist that she's not going into heart failure. Teens generally are very good at compensating until suddenly they can't and it hits crisis very quickly.

I too would be asking to see a cardiologist asap.

Swatty you can get an app on android phones @Lougle has it, I don't think it works on iPhones. The fb group is useful for wfh advice EDSUK.