Here we go!!

[Noki]

I’m an egg donor. Sorry, just excited, and not talking to too many people IRL so just wanted to blurt it out somewhere! First injection of Ovaleap just taken! It’s getting really real Scan on Tuesday and expecting egg collection start of November.

You name change when you want and I'll post where I want. I do find it odd that you name changed and then made personal attacks that were aimed at me, there's no denying that. I don't feel the need to hide anything I have posted. That's just me. My full history is there for anyone to see.

I have friends who are donor conceived as well as friends who have donor conceived children but you wouldn't know that. I have no religion and reject the comparison with a group you clearly don't like, how disingenuous of you. Not in the spirit some might say. It's also pretty offensive to Christians and anyone else you accused of being Evangelical, but it's up to me what I find offensive, if it was a fair comparison or relevant I wouldn't have minded.

This 'constant bombardment' is imagined in my view, a quick check down the threads of this board confirms it, including the last thread I posted on. It was not me who mentioned surrogacy.

This thread remains active when it has a new post on it so there is no need to 'watch' this board by me. This board is largely supportive, sharing experiences and information so I don't see the problem. Surrogacy and egg donation is discussed on several boards and I have seen threads deleted as people don't want to hear bad experiences or hear anything other than agreement.

I will not tag you as you have specifically said you don't want to engage but I did not want to have an accusation be left without a right of reply.

trying to put off someone who has made their own informed choice to be an egg donor

No one is trying to "put people off" but not all posters will be fully informed and given the health implications I think it is entirely reasonable to point out some of the possible problems.

Clinics, keen to sign up new donors tend not to spend too much time discussing things like ovarian hyper stimulation syndrome and other health risks - I wonder why.

My hospital had 24 admissions for OHSS in 2019 (up from 11 in 2018) and at least one needed treatment in ICU. I have no idea how many -if any - of these women were egg donors, they may all have been undertaking IVF for their own purposes. But these risks apply equally to egg donation. I have been involved in the treatment of two women who needed a nephrostomy tube to the kidneys to allow urine to drain as their swollen ovaries had blocked off their ureters, which is what prompted me to look at the numbers in more detail. Hardly a minor complication and not one that you are likely to see mentioned in any of the information leaflets clinics supply.

Oh my!

I think I’ll just round off by saying thank you so much for the well wishes ☺️ And much, much love to all those at any stage of a donor process. The love is filling me with warmth. Oh wait. It’s just another flipping hot flush 🥵 very glad I picked winter for this!

OP. I wish you good health. My sister, who struggled for many years with infertility, went through IVF which meant she went through the same kind of egg stimulation you will go through. Before she did it, she asked about health risks of the procedure and found there was very little research on immediate or long-term effects of the drugs on her body. She found this very distressing so only did a one time egg retrieval. I bring this up because I see a lot of people harping on some PP about inserting themselves into this conversation. I try to put myself your position, OP, and I'd want to be fully aware of any health risks, so I'd suggest to assume good intentions on the posters who want you to be aware of the risks. Peace and best wishes to you.

They may inform of known risks but, to the point I made about my sister, so many unknowns exist as it's not well studied at all.

www.statnews.com/2017/01/28/egg-donors-risks/

What is your agenda in posting that article @Delphinium20

Anyone reading the donor conception boards has been through IVF, likely on multiple occasions. We are the ones living through this, having the conversations with the doctors, obsessively reading the research papers. We will have considered the known risks and decided the risk of childlessness is worse. I repeat, we are the ones actually living through this.

As for the unknown risks, they are exactly that, unknown. You have no clue if there are any long term risks but you’re trying to plant doubt and fear in this woman’s mind. And scare those of us who have multiple rounds at an already scary and stressful juncture in our lives. Why?

My sister went through IVF despite being the risks to her health because she wanted a baby. Asking women to go through unknown health risks to give other people children is quite different, don't you think? The desire to have a baby can be quite intense and I worry the pressure put on women to undergo egg retrieval doesn't address these unknown risks.

@CP26 what is your agenda in minimizing risks to women who donate?

@Delphinium20 but no one is asking her, she explained she came to the decision herself to donate altruistically. You’re assuming she doesn’t know her own mind.

@Delphinium20 and it’s not about minimising risk it’s about focusing on the ones we know exist after 40 years of IVF. Any unknown risks are speculative.

The point I'm trying to make is there isn't much research or follow up for women who donate their eggs. Part of ethics is to check in to see if the OP feels well informed on her choice. Advice is freely given on MN and women with experience often feel compelled to help other women. People who want donor eggs may be appreciative of their donor, but they are not unbiased advice givers, far from it. Unlike sperm donation, egg donation is risky and I think everyone should pause and consider what we are asking young women to do.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28473127/

@Delphinium20 so I assume from that link you’re trying to insinuate there’s a greater risk of breast cancer? Again, speculative. And thankfully unlikely to be true.

www.kcl.ac.uk/news/fertility-drugs-do-not-increase-breast-cancer-risk-study-finds

“ Researchers from King’s, in partnership with King’s Fertility, analysed studies involving 1.8 million women undergoing fertility treatments. These women were followed up in studies for an average period of 27 years and had no increase in the risk of developing breast cancer.”

Again, the differences between a personal decision to undergo fertility treatments for yourself and accept health risks for yourself is quite different than asking it of another woman, especially of a young woman who has never had children of her own.

We Are Egg Donors

www.weareeggdonors.com/about

is a volunteer run site in the USA, with a worldwide community, to share information, discuss health and research, advocate for egg donors and ensure future donors are given the opportunity for fully informed consent.

I do think there is tighter regulation in the U.K. thanks to the HFEA than in other parts of the world especially the USA where egg donation is BIG business:

"Egg donation brings in about $100MM to the fertility industry every year in the US alone."

That is a huge financial incentive. Can you really feel confident that the health of the egg donor will be prioritised under the circumstances.
Egg donation is sold as doing a wonderful thing for the benefit of infertile women/families. But be under no illusions, the fertility clinics and IVF specialists make huge profits off the back of that donation. It's not just the infertile women you are doing a big favour to.

Here is one of their blog posts, six red flags to look out for - some won't be relevant I think, in the U.K., such as advice about attorneys, but it's still worth looking at and thinking about the information being shared by your fertility clinic.

www.weareeggdonors.com/blog/red-flags

And here is another blog: "A first time egg donor's story in 28 pictures"

www.weareeggdonors.com/blog/photo-essay

She suffered from OHSS despite having been brushed off that it was incredibly rare, needed time off work and then returning with a phased return. And ends up feeling guilty for putting her own health and well-being before the desires of keen purchasers who want her to "donate" again.

"Despite the fact that I have two other IPs who want me to donate, I will not be donating again. I feel very guilty for having to turn them down, but there is no way I can let myself go through this again."

Oh, that photo essay was painful to view...oh, she's so young.

I have thought long and hard about posting this. And the reason I am is I want to make people aware if how some of these posts has made me feel as I think there maybe other women or men in a similar situation to myself feeling how I do about some of these posts.

I posted back at the start of the thread to thank the OP for her generosity (I think the original purpose of this has been lost in all these messages). The reason I thanked her was I am currently under going a donor cycle to receive donor eggs.

It has taken a lot of thought and consideration by my husband and I to get to this point and we wish that we never had to get to this point. That consideration has included looking at the 'financial/business and regulatory' issues which you discuss which is the reason we are using a UK donor. The journey to here has been horrendous and that combined with other things has significantly affected my mental health. I won't go into detail here but one of the things I am dealing with is immense guilt feelings due to past experiences.

Whilst sat here reading these post I am in tears as some of these posts are making me feel guilty for exploring this option at all, let alone under going the treatment. However saying that I know this is the right thing for my family and I.

I joined this forum for support and I am not getting this and with a heavy heart I am now leaving. But wanted to make people aware of how difficult this journey is for people and maybe a little consideration to this before posting could be used.

I will end by reiterating my gratitude to the OP and any other donors out there. I have not taken what you are doing lightly and your gift means more than I could ever express. Thank you

@cp26

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28473127/

“Until this information is available, we call for more realistic explanations to egg donors about the lack of knowledge of long-term risks as well as more transparent informed consent documents.”
“The lack of information may be misleadingly interpreted as lack of risk. Long-term hormone replacement therapy is recognized as a risk factor for breast cancer; the breast cancer risk of ovarian stimulation for egg donors is unknown but is a possibility. “

Not sure I am in complete agreement with this procedure. However, I don't think its the same as surrogacy shich I am not generally in favour of at all.

@Donimo

I have thought long and hard about posting this. And the reason I am is I want to make people aware if how some of these posts has made me feel as I think there maybe other women or men in a similar situation to myself feeling how I do about some of these posts.

I posted back at the start of the thread to thank the OP for her generosity (I think the original purpose of this has been lost in all these messages). The reason I thanked her was I am currently under going a donor cycle to receive donor eggs.

It has taken a lot of thought and consideration by my husband and I to get to this point and we wish that we never had to get to this point. That consideration has included looking at the 'financial/business and regulatory' issues which you discuss which is the reason we are using a UK donor. The journey to here has been horrendous and that combined with other things has significantly affected my mental health. I won't go into detail here but one of the things I am dealing with is immense guilt feelings due to past experiences.

Whilst sat here reading these post I am in tears as some of these posts are making me feel guilty for exploring this option at all, let alone under going the treatment. However saying that I know this is the right thing for my family and I.

I joined this forum for support and I am not getting this and with a heavy heart I am now leaving. But wanted to make people aware of how difficult this journey is for people and maybe a little consideration to this before posting could be used.

I will end by reiterating my gratitude to the OP and any other donors out there. I have not taken what you are doing lightly and your gift means more than I could ever express. Thank you

Wishing you the very best of luck. Some of the comments are hideous. You have absolutely no need to feel guilt. X

Oh @Donimo that’s so sad! Please don’t feel guilty. I can’t speak to other donors (have never met another donor!) but I’m doing this absolutely willingly and in full, careful consideration in the hope I can help someone.

Interesting you mentioned the financial considerations, I did too! There’s always adverts on the radio for donors, but I really don’t need any financial incentive and started out by asking my GP if I could donate via the NHS. You and I will know what the answer was and where they directed me.

I don’t know what I expected when I put my first post up (I was just so bursting excited!) but it wasn’t quite this

What is clear is that there are real women with real feelings in this conversation, some who have been through great pain. At one point I had considered donating eggs to my sister (she shut that down), so I'm not insensitive to why women consider alternatives, I just feel a bit more knowledgeable now. What also seems clear is that agencies who solicit donors, agencies who offer egg donation as an option to hopeful families, and medical research on women's health has a long way to go in really considering the ethical and medical risks inherent in donor conception for all parties involved. I've read the hyped up brochures of agencies and their hopeful, nothing-to-worry-about language, and I don't think this does anyone any good. I hope that the NHS and the UK government at least stays with altruistic, non-financial donation and does not go down the route of donation as a business like other countries.

One of the things that made me pause when talking with my sister was confusion on all the data.

For example, that KCL study was a study of studies and looked at the databases for infertile women not fertile ones, like young women donating their eggs. It also notes a serious bias and very low quality data. In short it looked at 20 studies over 30 years at a specific group of women “all cohort studies reporting new incidences of breast cancer in infertile women using ovarian stimulating drugs. quality of evidence seemed very low because of the serious risk of bias and indirectness (randomized studies). 88.41% very low quality of evidence (so not just low but very low). The article shared earlier sounds really groundbreaking and reassuring that there are no risks of breast cancer associated with fertility drugs but that’s not what the study says. This goes to my point in we have a long way to go to wade through the unknowns.

Again. Good luck to everyone.

Thank so much for your altruism @Noki and I'm also sad @Donimo is leaving - these boards are meant to be supportive . I'm finally pregnant as a single women using a sperm donor at a UK clinic (because of my age I couldn't wait any longer to find the right co-parent), which some people disagree with - but I've mostly found people on Mumsnet very supportive and helpful. I'd try the Mumsnet Infertility board Donimo where people are more sympathetic to needing a donor and anti - donation people tend to post less there.

I agree that in other countries egg donation can have some very dodgy implications with exploiting young and vulnerable/poverty stricken women - but the UK has some of the strongest regulations in the world in terms of low financial payments/incentives, mandatory counselling for all parties and clinics can be struck off the HEFA register if they are caught (in their regular inspections) of not informing people of any risks involved.