Is this parental alienation?

[JM376]

Please help… I really need some advice…

After 6 years of being in an abusive relationship with my children’s dad… emotional, verbal and sometimes physical (he is a narcissist in every sense of the word) and after completely losing myself in the process, I decided enough was enough, packed a couple of suitcases and left with my children. They’d witnessed it all and my little boy was starting to emulate his behaviour, getting very angry and shouting. I had to leave to get my children and myself out of that situation, I didn’t want them growing up thinking that was a normal way to live.

This was 6 months ago and the hardest thing I’ve ever done. We’ve been living with my parents on the other side of the country since and the change I’ve seen in the children is amazing, they are so much happier and actually acting like children.

Their dad saw them a couple of times and then they had no contact for 4 months as he refused to stop speaking negatively about me to them, and basically saying completely inappropriate things to them about the separation, which was obviously very upsetting for them.

He’s now got a solicitor and has now seen them for two weekends, one of the conditions being that he is not allowed to badmouth me to the children.

All has seemed ok, until tonight when my little boy is beside himself crying that he misses his daddy. He said that his daddy drew him some pictures about ‘what’s happened to his life and my life’ saying that I took them away from him and the police said he couldn’t talk to them anymore, until he made 6 monies (?). My little boy said that I should’ve left him with his dad and just taken his sister because he likes his dad more than me.

He is only 5 but it’s completely broken my heart that he said he likes his dad more than me. Obviously I can’t tell him the truth about his dad being abusive to me for 6 years. I’ve just said that it wasn’t a nice place to live as mummy and daddy kept shouting. But his dad is obviously making out like I’m evil and taken him away for no reason.

I don’t know what to do or say. Is this the start of parental alienation? Is he beginning to turn my sweet boy against me?

Your ex sounds like an absolute nightmare. This sounds like parental alienation to me and just making stuff up like that about you getting the police involved?! Your husband is creating his own cinema version of you leaving and he’s the main character.
can you ask your little buy what he likes about his dad to see if these are real things or if your ex has just drummed onto him that if he asks to live with the dad enough you’ll have to allow it. A 5 year old doesn’t know what he’s saying and the consequences. The boy sounds very mixed up after seeing his dad.
Hopefully the ex finds someone new OP and he’ll probably not bother with the kids as much any more.

Oh dear I feel your pain. I went through similar in terms of an extremely abusive exH who was a wealthy businessman and had money to throw at his solicitor over every tiny issue (all made during our marriage). All I can offer were the wise words of my solicitor during the process, (when I was losing sleep that my ex was building up a ‘portfolio of lies’ about me to justify why he had had an affair, then tried to force me out of the marital home when we had several other properties - he tried lumping me with two offices and a flat), and various other acts of despicable behaviour.
He was too clever to bad mouth me to the kids, but was equally vile in a slightly different way. My solicitor at the time said “your children will learn by simply knowing and observing you as they grow up, what you are both truly like. Just try not to react”. We had to get court orders and an injunction out to get him to stop creeping into my home during the early hours once we had split. It took 20 years of “trying not to react” but finally, at the age of 22, he let his guard slip with my DDaughter and lambasted her for something she didn’t deserve. By this time she had also heard how he spoke to clients with whom he was in conflict with (this was where his pure evilness was triggered - he actually ‘enjoys’ conflict). I have never tried to make him out to be the man he truly is to my DC as that would be devastating for them-however I have absolutely nothing to offer them, in terms of his ‘good’ points, other than he does love them in his own way (money) and explaining that he suffers from a lack of emotional intelligence. He is extremely academically intelligent with no fear of anything or anyone, and I tell my DDaughter to learn all she can from him, from a business perspective (she’s done extremely well with a masters at Uni and is now working and living independently, is learning about starting a business and how to trade shares) as is Dson, and life is good for both me and them now. My DSon is close to his dad - both love motor racing, and is very loving and caring towards me. I very nearly moved across the country when we split as for my own sanity I needed to get as far away as possible but I forced myself to stay near him for my DC sake. He taunted my Ddad during court hearings simply because my dad was supporting me financially-they’d always got on prior to all of this. I lost my dDad in 2023, and his best friend passed away recently, and the utter cunt turns up at the funeral. Everyone there was part of my parents social circle and were people who loathed him after that he did to us. They were all visibly shocked to see him - my poor DDaughter didn’t know where to put herself. It was dreadful, and again, he was taunting my family knowing nobody could say anything at the time. He’s like a stalker who I can’t shake off and his behaviour is just absolutely unfathomable. So I just get on with my life and humour him-I gave up trying to reason with or analyse him decades ago. Some people just aren’t worth your brains cells or energy trying to reason with, and he’s one of them. It will get better OP. Your son doesn’t know the making of ‘hate’ yet, and he will learn from you, how to treat others kindly as he grows and that his mum is a kind and loving person. Stay as calm as you can as much as possible-it’s very hard at times - and seek help from your GP if need be - some meds can be amazing at helping us through trauma. X

I'm a family solicitor, my suggestion is that you immediately write to your ex's solicitor to explain what has happened (i.e., that your ex has been denigrating you to the children and discussing adult matters with them) and that you no longer agree to unsupervised contact, therefore any contact going forward must take place in a supervised centre. This will give you the benefit of (1) supervision and (2) a report in case he does say anything untoward. See how this goes and perhaps you could agree to unsupervised in the future. He may make an application to the court but I think you have a good case to say supervised contact only right now.

I'm not judging you, but these are likely the points that could be brought up in court by either an inquisitive judge/magistrate or determined solicitor.

While not impossible, if we're to conclude that your partner has only recently had the ability to induce parental alienation it would be unusual to see such a manifestation so early. One of the earliest effects of parental alienation is often the guilt attached to thinking negatively about the other parent and they become conflicted and it's often more the case that the primary caregiver is able to alienate much quicker given the time they have available with the child.

How many children do you have, and share with your ex?. What are their ages and presumably, there are no negative results of their visitations or confirmation that the father is purposely and negatively talking about you recently, more previously?.

Additionally, is there any formal contact order in place?.

I'm a family solicitor, my suggestion is that you immediately write to your ex's solicitor to explain what has happened (i.e., that your ex has been denigrating you to the children and discussing adult matters with them) and that you no longer agree to unsupervised contact, therefore any contact going forward must take place in a supervised centre
Really, that's what you advise clients?

Firstly, we have no idea what the dad has told the child. Kids at that age misinterpret many things they hear. Some of it could even come from hearing his mum saying things to a third party.

Secondly, it's very common for kids of that age to state they prefer one parent over the other. It's doesn't mean they are bring manipulated, more that they are trying to adjust to the changes and conflict in their lives. It would appear that the OP stopped contact once already, doing so another time will do more damage to the child than trying to put accusing to bed and focus on their coparenting relationship and rebuilding some trust.

I can't imagine a judge supporting the action of stopping contact, again, and ruling that contact should only be supervised from what OP is describing. They would most likely send them off to mediation, possibly suggest dad undertake a parenting class.

Yes it sounds like classic parental alienation. The way DH combated the badmouthing was to never badmouth back and let his ex hang herself with her own rope. The kids soon realised who the bitter and twisted person that wasn't pleasant to be around was. I hope it works out for you.

From what you describe, it sounds like the start of parental alienation – the ex is likely influencing the child’s view of you. I’d suggest documenting incidents, asking for a neutral mediator, and maybe family therapy to keep the child’s voice safe. I talked to Brian Ludmer, who runs LudmerLaw, and his family‑law advice helped me get a clear plan.

Get your 5 yesr old into play therapy- there will.likely be a charity near you who can offer it cheaper if needed. This gives you a professional third party expect where you chikd can hopefully work through and discuss these issues- and if you end up in court you will have their report to support what gou are saying. I have recently been advised this from my own solicitor.

You have no evidence... so a judge isn't going to stop all contact or do it at a visitation centre. Sorry to say. My ex showed alot of his true self in court, including sharing adult issues with the kids, rhe judge said she would not give prolonged periods of time with dad as she did not feel it would support a relationship with me, he doesn't always put the kids emotional needs first, doesn't always follow.medical advice, extremely emotionally abusive to.me... still gets 3 nights out of 14.
My children are struggling with what he tells them. He hasn't changed his behaviours at all, and he's showing the kids the forms he is completing to take me back to court.
So I would also advise that you teach your children critical thinking skills. Books like the Sky is Red, how to be a detective, the boundary balloons, and so many others help do this without saying a single bad word about dad.
Also, when they repeat things, ask them a question so they question what they say, rather than saying the opposite. I often say adults have different opinions, or have you seen me act that way, what do you think of that person (when dad badmouths my entire family).
It is unbelievably hard. Warn school and nursery to log anything the kids may divulge.