I am in quite the quandary

[DaddyF]

Hi all,
This is the first time I have ever posted on the internet, so bear with me. I am a 43 year old dad of two boys, both 15 and turning 16 next month. I have been separated from their mum for 10 years and we share custody 50/50. There is no court order, we just agreed things ourselves when it was amicable.

The problem is that the boys are really struggling when they are with their mum. I will keep it short, but the main things are:

• She does not cook much and the boys often lose weight when they are there. Portions are small and there is little in the way of proper meals, vegetables or salad.
• She goes out socially several evenings a week, leaving them on their own.
• She has told them she does not care if they revise or not for their GCSEs, so they feel they get no support.
• They both have acne and eczema which I manage with the doctor, but when they stay with her the progress is undone.
• They cannot talk to her about any of this. She is very emotional and tends to gaslight, so they feel they will just get shouted at or dismissed if they try.

There are more things I could add, but I do not want this to turn into a rant, I just want everyone to have some context.

The issue right now is that the boys have said they do not want to go back on Sunday. I am finding it hard to argue with them and to be honest I would rather they stayed with me, where I know they are supported. The problem is that their mum can be very unpredictable, so I do not know how this will play out.

My question is: where do I stand legally if I tell her “the boys do not want to live with you anymore, so they will be staying with me”?

You need to speak to a family lawyer about this.

At their ages, their wishes would be given a lot of weight by the court (if it went to court). You have no court order currently so I don’t think there is a legal issue with them not returning, unless she takes action.

One Q - Why can’t they manage their acne/eczema when away from you? They could be going to Uni in a few years, now is a good time to teach them stuff like that.

Thanks for responding.

It's not that they can't control it, it's that the poor diet makes them both flare up.

If in England there as no existing order from their 16th birthday the family court cannot make an order saying where they should live - it’s their choice. They don’t legally have to live with either of you (but financially obviously would probably choose to over being homeless). There are exceptions 16-18 eg the child is disabled and lacks capacity to make decisions then the court still has the ability to make an order.

If there is going to be conflict with mum then perhaps get them some private counselling or the school may be able to offer some support so they can talk things through with a neutral third party. It would be sensible to keep school in the loop anyway.

Hey BigCity,

Thank you for your insight into this. I think this is what I am going to do. They are literally 16 at the end of the month, it's as close as it gets really, and they are distressed at the thought of going back.

We have been in a similar situation before where the boys were reluctant to go back because of her boyfriend (nothing physical). When I raised it with their mum, all hell broke loose and the end result was the boys being criticised because of how it made her feel. That is why there has been hesitation so far.

However, we have learned from that and this will be handled very differently. The point I am making is that there will be no conflict with the children. It will be with me, and I can handle that.

I appreciate your comments about the school. I had not actually considered that.

to add @DaddyF that the boys (when both are 16 or over) in my opinion do need to voice who they want to live with, with the mum themselves because it sounds likely she would not believe you and she won’t take it from you.

On the food front when they are with their mum you’re putting a lot down to the mum on what they eat but in my experience of 16 year olds they eat what they want and as much as they want. Veggies and salads are low calorie so it doesn’t seem like a lack of these are the reason for any weight loss.

is she saying to them order a takeaway and they are very much up for this but are telling you that she forced junk food on them?

Hi @Beachlovingirl

Thanks for that. We know the boys will have to say it to her themselves and they are ready to do that. This has been building for a while and I have always said that unless they are prepared to speak up directly, it cannot happen. It is not enough coming from me.

On the food side, I get what you are saying and yes, they can be picky eaters. But the issue here is portions. For example, she might cook a small gammon with just a handful of chips, no peas, no egg, no pineapple, nothing extra. I know it might sound like I am being over critical, but I know exactly how much they eat. They also will not eat cereal there because she only buys UHT milk, and bread often runs out midweek which rules out toast. They end up constantly hungry, sometimes even buying a supermarket meal deal on the way home from school. Lack of food is one of the main reasons behind their feelings.

@DaddyF that does sound rubbish with the food situation. Doesn’t sound like she is shopping for 3 adults with adult appetites. There’s nothing wrong with being picky eaters as my two oldest are also picky eaters but that means - if anything - they need to have lots of available food that they like.

I couldn't agree more @Beachlovingirl. They cost me an arm and a leg!