Holiday permission for kids

[Advice822]

I'm in NI incase that makes a difference.

Stbxh has no contact with ds at present and is in trouble with police and may end up serving time. I wanted to check if there is a way I can get permission to take ds on holiday etc without having to go through stbxh every time especially if there comes a point where he's incarcerated and I won't be able to easily ask?

Any advice? My solicitor has advised against a residency order at present because stbxh hasn't sought contact with ds since we separated and she felt it may not be granted or may encourage stbxh to react and could backfire if contact was then established. Not sure if that has any bearing I'm very confused as to how the whole process works.

The risk is whether your ex would know you are going on holiday and then be perverse enough to stop you going. Which he could do by either taking out a prohibited steps order or contacting the police or port police to stop you taking them out of the country. This happened to someone I know. They still got to go on holiday but it was delayed. The call by their ex was spiteful as permission had been sought for the trip.

Otherwise you will just be a single parent getting on a plane with your children. Port authorities are looking out for trafficking not you. Therefore if you have the same name and ethnicity they won’t stop you. Unless your ex or his family do something spiteful to stop you.

They can’t do that if they don’t know anything about it.

I wouldn't like to think he'd do that but as you say you never know. Ds doesn't have the same last name as me as I've reverted back to my maiden name (I never changed any of my documents like passport to my married name when I got married) and ds has my married name. So I was worried that might flag up but then I could provide my marriage licence and his birth certificate to prove I'm his mum I guess?

Please don’t risk it .. I was with my neighbour heading for S Africa on an eagerly awaited safari holiday of a lifetime paid for by their grandparents to help them come to terms with their parent’s acrimonious divorce.. she had asked him for permission.. he refused .. she ignored and went anyway .. until Heathrow stopped her with a report of child abduction (for that is what it is) his desire to hurt her was much greater than his children’s upset .. we didn’t go.. all money lost . DONT DO IT !!

Go to court for £215 and represent yourselves and ask for a specific steps order to take your kids abroad for no more than 28 days in one year . Job done .. nothing he can do..

I have a different surname from my kids. I have been travelling with them internationally for years in and out of UK airports - without any problems. Once, upon our return to the UK I was admonished for not having their birth certificates with us. But that's it.
I am now divorced, and continue traveling the same way. Just take the old marriage certificate and full birth certificate - the one that lists full names of parents.

South Africa - incidentally - was the only country I knew that had the requirement for the parental permission, some years ago. Now this requirement has been lifted.

@Advice822 don't bother with going to court now and rocking the boat. Your ex isn't even seeking contact. I presume he has no information on your holiday plans or means of transportation.
There is no immigration control upon leaving the UK - so no one is registering your goings.

If you are planning to travel to the usual touristy destinations in Europe - there is no requirement on needing any permissions for when the kids are traveling with just one parent. If you are travelling to more exotic places - check their immigration website.

I have the same name but different nationality to my children. I’ve always travelled alone with the children and up until about 5 years ago never had any issues. But we have had a few moments in recent years where the border control asked a lot of questions and asked for paperwork, which at the time I didn’t know I needed. What seemed to reassure them was the children being old enough to answer questions like ‘who is this person?’ (Mum) and ‘does your dad know you’re travelling’, ‘who are you visiting’ as well as being able to show our return tickets. We were only going to my home country in Europe.

I now have a ‘lives with’ order and carry that with me when we travel.

In your situation I’d probably take the risk for now and just feign ignorance. Unless he somehow reports you, they’re unlikely to have any reason to stop you at the border but there is always a risk.

yes of course… 9/10 times you will get away with it .. until you don’t BECAUSE ITS THE LAW … so go for it and deal with the kids disappointment when their holiday is fucked.. for the sake of £215 at court..

I don’t think this is about the money, but rather the can of worms she doesn’t want to open by asking the court for a residency order and then triggering demands for contact by dad, which in this situation doesn’t seem to be in the best interest of the child.

What is your basis for quoting statistics like 9/10? How often do YOU travel on your own?

I live in London, and most of my friends are international families that travel regularly. No one has ever been refused travel over the years.
Yes - at times kids are asked in the airport - mostly upon arrival in the UK - to confirm that the mother is in fact their mother. I think we were asked in Morocco, once. Some Eastern European countries ask as well.

There is no law you are referring to. There is nobody tasked with enforcing this supposed law - UK has no immigration controls on departures. No one checks.
In some countries, they check on arrival - and hence airlines flying to those countries will ask the travellers. As it used to be with South Africa, but no longer.

Going to court for residency order is not as easy as you imply. And it is more risky than just traveling.

However - more recently - it's the 6mo+ passport duration that seems to trip people in the airports. Every time we travel - we observe people trying to convince the agents to let them through...

That's an awful experience!!

Our separation hasn't been acrimonious so far, he seems to have taken the decision that its in ds best interests that they don't have contact and I agree with that decision but it's been a year and so far he's been reasonable to deal with in so far as the little communication we have had. Not saying that can't change especially as we get further into the divorce process but that's unlikely to happen between now and holiday. I really can't see him trying to spite me as he knows he's the one who's repeatedly messed up and so far he's been remorseful. I just haven't wanted to do anything to rock the boat that might make him rethink contact as then I'd need to fight him on it and that COULD create a bad dynamic.

I'm not an expert on NI law but in the UK you don't need to get a residency order for this. You would ask the court for a Specific Issues Order only for the right to travel. It has nothing to do with contact or residency. It's a one off decision made by the court that allows you to travel. I'm really surprised your solicitor didn't tell you about it.

Can you get him to write a letter and sign it at this point ?

I was in a similar situation and always took Ds’s birth certificate .

My Ds was asked a couple of occasions who I was - he has ADHD so can come out with inappropriate responses so often held my breath .

Reality is it is a risk without that bit of paper .