Dad seeking opinions on CMS and custody payments

[DryRiser]

I'm an ex-DH seeking input on custody costs etc, so you can go to town on me if i'm AIBU. 😂
I earn £100k pa, and my 3x DS will live with 50% of the time. Via the CMS calc we have worked out I should have to pay £613 pcm (which i'm happy with), and i'll also cover all their costs when they're with me, and likely the majority of shared costs (school trips, new trainers etc)

All of this I'm okay with, and I want the best for my kids, I just want some opinions if i'm under or over selling my contributions?

Context: ex-DW has a very low income, and will be on benefits when the time comes (at the moment i'm paying for everything). She knows she'll have to get new better paying job, but it looks like i'll still be paying CM.

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I think that's perfectly fine. Since you are 50/50 and paying major expenses, she has the freedom to work more and get a better job.

Surprising you’d be paying anything on a 50/50 arrangement to be honest other than picking up the costs when they’re with you and then going halves on things like uniforms etc

Sounds good

Just because your a high earner doesn't mean she doesn't have to contribute and your doing 50/50.

With having the kids 50/50, paying cms, paying for the kids when they are with you, food electricity etc and things like trainers etc your properly looking at over £1000 a month to be spent which is a lot

I think if one earns over a certain amount even if it is 50/50 you still pay cms to the person who earns less.
My DH pays similar as per cms despite having he kids 50/50 and quite often more because we take the kids away in the holidays and on weekends even when it's not our weekend (FH ex is happy with this) which works out extra days with us

That SHOULD say DH NOT FH

I have 50:50 with me ex. We have a shared account for kids expenses (school dinners, bus fair, uniforms etc).

Your situation is a little different as there would potentially be huge discrepancies on how they would live half the time. i thinks is great you recognise that and that you have your kids best interests at heart. You can always re look at how you do things. My ex and I have coparented for 8 years + and have made lots of changes as the children have gotten older.

As a single mum to 3 I think that sounds more than fair.

Especially as you are having them 50%.

On the face of it…If legally that is what is being stated then you are fine. Not enough information to say morally. For example are any of the children in very expensive childcare which the ex would struggle to pay half. Will she have to move further away due to housing costs. Lots of variables. If the question is child focused in trying to keep them in the same schools, nurseries etc which would be impossible to do if the ex is low income. Then I think you need to decide what can be done to compromise those higher costs if it’s just not doable from one side. For example choosing a cheaper childcare provider that won’t financially cripple her, or paying a higher percentage if keeping the same provider is important to you.
Good communication now will benefit the whole family for years to come. Fair is not always equal, just be child focussed and you won’t go wrong.

If it’s genuinely 50:50 o nights and shared care the cms is £0

I've looked into this. Because she'll be receiving child benefit, it's me that has to pay. The amount then is relative to how much I earn and how often the DS's are with me.
There doesn't appear to be anything means testing going on, so if ex-DH earns £20k or £35k, I still have to pay the same.

What I can't tell is what happens if I'm also on benefits... guess that would just be something we work out between us.

Law here is a little more complex than people often realise.

The CMS calculator is based on overnight stays. If you have half of them, then the CMS formula may still be applied. But it assumes there is a caring parent and a non-resident parent (old terms, but more or less correct). Indeed, you can pay CMS even if you have more than 50% of the nights!

However, if you do sufficient parenting to be regarded as an equal parent (not an 'NRP'), then no child maintenance is the outcome. That's more than just half the nights, but includes things like the mental load, scheduling, appointments, etc.

But, you should also be thinking what will work best for you as a family! In your situation you might also be thinking about what happened to assets, pensions, etc. in the split. ~£600 might be a worthwhile investment in a good set of family links. Moreover, why not start there and see how the family and care change over time? 50/50 care doesn't always persist, and it could be more complex and vary by child, etc.

The CMS calculator will throw out a figure for a 50:50 arrangement even though it may not be payable. A true 50:50 arrangement is about shared time and costs. It is important to note that some of the parenting costs are fixed and not shared. For example housing, you will pay for your home regardless of the time spent with the children. However food, clothes, hobbies and activities should be shared costs and vary according to the time you have them.

For very high earners the 50:50 and no payment rule won’t apply, nor will the normal CMS application. But 100k isn’t a very high income.

The income disparity can be addressed in one of 2 ways. Through a bigger share of assets under a clean break. Or as a spousal maintenance payment. However whilst child maintenance is not taken into account as part of means testing for benefits, spousal income is.

In you post you reference salary disparity. On the face of it this seems a good reason to make an additional payment for child maintenance. However your ex’s salary is not her potential income. This will be a combination of salary and benefits. She may also need to increase her salary if it is not maximised either for a benefit claim or it will be assumed as part of asset split.

TLDR
The calculator cannot be relied upon for 50:50 arrangement where no maintenance is the norm if you share costs.
Your ex can improve her income with benefits or a new job. She could get a bigger share of assets if there continues to be a disparity in take home income. You need some legal advice to help approach the split - re disclosure of assets, income and needs.
At the end of the day you can pay her what you want for child support.

Yes the income of the mum won't affect your CMS -- your ex could be a pauper or JK Rowling and you'd pay the same.
If you went on benefits much more miserable than £100,000 I can assure you you'd pay a fixed sum which I think is £7 per week.

Thanks LemonTT, you're clearly more experience and knowledgable on this than I am.
We've agreed (not legally yet), a 50/50 split on assets and children. I'm happy with this as we both put in an equal share of energy into the marriage and family - there is no dispute there, and from my perspective, anything different to this would cause massive resentment which will make the children's life difficult in the future.
In addition, I'm happy to pay £613 monthly and cover infrequent future costs. I think when we draft the consent order i'd like to request that this is reviewed annually, or more often depending on status change. i.e. either of our income changes.

Does this sound right?

No point putting it in a court order … after a year it falls under the jurisdiction of cms not the courts - and if truly 50:50 you’d have a nil cms assessment

Unless you’re agreeing as spousal maintenance/ in which case your ex will be means tested for benefits including this ….

Thanks Milly, can you be clearer on CMS vs Spousal Maintenance? Am I missing a trick here?

Child maintenance ( which you’re not due to pay if true 50:50) comes under the remit of cms even if you have numbers in the court order. After 12 months courts don’t have jurisdiction to child maintenance

child maintenance is not considered when looking at benefits for your ex

spousal maintenance is under courts and your ex could at anytime try to vary it upwards ( may /may not be successful) and is counted as income when considering benefits - eg every £1 in spousal is offset in benefits so your ex. May not be better off

You should be looking possibly at ex getting higher share of assets, no spousal and then if you agree cms fair enough. Your ex needs to up her income

When you say 50/50 do you mean the same number of nights and school pickups/drop offs? It’s strange the CMS calculator says you have to pay this much if it is genuinely 50/50.

Are you paying 50% of any and all childcare costs, and before and after school clubs etc.

My ex always said he had them 50/50 but the evenings he had them he would still bring them home to me after dinner. Not really 50/50 at all.

My guess here is there’s some important context not included in the OP and that the Mum has been the primary carer and SAHP whilst Dad has been working.

So I really think it’s not at all UR that the OP pays maintenance to sustain the previously SAHP whilst they get on their feet.

THIS is why if you’re going to be a SAHP you should always get married!

Yes, my query would be how one person ends up on a very low income and benefits and the other has a six figure salary. It seems unlikely that equal energy has gone into bringing up the DC.
The person on a six figure salary will also have a pension, no doubt and the financial ability to outsource care as needed.

He should absolutely be paying spousal and possibly a pensions attachment order so she gets a share of that too. Ex will have undoubtedly facilitated his career.

He shouldn’t be paying spousal at all

ex needs to up her income and if appropriate assets should be split on something higher towards her to compensate lower earning

I agree the asset split seems wrong. How is the ex going to house herself on 50/50 split of assets. Surely better for her to have a larger split and less CMS paid.

Why? If she has been a stay at home parent for many years why shouldn’t he support her whilst she gets on her feet?