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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Original poster

Urgent- parental responsibility and school trip

28 replies

mynamechangemyrules · 24/05/2024 23:14

My DCs live with me, both parents parental responsibility, ExH sees them 1/14 as won't take all at once.

DC1 is refusing to see father. ExH is dreaming up ways to punish him for this 'non compliance' as he delightfully refers to it.

He is saying he will block DC from attending their school trip. (Merit related/ selected trip due to being good at the subject).

I had confirmed ExH's agreement to allow child to attend prior to paying for trip as he has form for disallowing things such as this on a whim.

ExH messaged DC to say that I could not stop ExH from doing this as legally DC can't leave the country without non-resident parent's permission.

I know this is legally true if I were to be taking him as I could be charged with child abduction (he has used that before to block us holidaying 😳😬) but with the school taking him is there any legal obligation to get his permission? Bearing in mind I actually already have it in email anyway, but he now wants to override this- can he?

OP posts:
JohnofWessex · 24/05/2024 23:22

I suggest getting proper legal advice if he is mucking you about like this.

I am assuming you are a UK Citizen with no family abroad, if you are he wil get nowhere trying to stop you going abroad on holiday

holybaloni · 24/05/2024 23:23

Oh gosh that's tricky. I mean he probably could as he's got PR, but since you already have his permission in writing would be have to provide a reason for this sudden change of heart? I would speak to the school asap and get some advice. It could be a very difficult situation for them if they are stuck at an airport with one child who can't go. I suppose it depends how much of an arse your ex actually is. Will he really go through with it? As in ringing the airport/authorities? What an utter dick move.
The alternative is to have your dc miss out on this one thing but at least then they'd see what a controlling horrible twat their dad is and be justified in their decision to go NC.

Original poster
mynamechangemyrules · 24/05/2024 23:34

Yes, will try for some free legal advice as I'm skint after paying for the trip 😂 (ExH doesn't pay CM)

He is the absolute king of the dick move (said he'd stop us at the airport/ was calling border force on the day of our holiday flight and I just panicked and we didn't go so bye bye ££££)

No family abroad.

OP posts:
dethbitto · 24/05/2024 23:36

He sounds awful, fancy doing that shit to your own kids. How spiteful!!

Fgshwga · 24/05/2024 23:36

@mynamechangemyrules

Do you have a child arrangements order in place currently?

TokyoSushi · 24/05/2024 23:38

Oh gosh. I'd imagine that school would be reluctant to take DC of one of the patents says no, what a horrible situation, hope you can get it sorted.

Wasywasydoodah · 24/05/2024 23:48

You could apply for a specific issue order. Fill in a c100 form. Pay the fee (less than £200). You don’t need a solicitor. Will take a little while but put the date on the form so the court knows.

Livinghappy · 24/05/2024 23:51

He has potentially several routes to block this and contacting the school would be easier and probably quite effective. Schools can't get involved in parental disputes so would advise not to travel.

Ex could also go to court for a prohibitive steps order to prevent travel but that would take time and I doubt would be successful.

How old is your son? How long is the trip? When is it planned for? Do you have a child arrangement order?

Unfortunately you will need legal advice as depending on your sons age you maybe able to get an order than prevents your ex from stopping future "reasonable" holidays,such as max of 2 weeks, not in school term etc

I'm not sure if a court could remove PR but they can place conditions on what he can object to.

Starlightstarbright3 · 24/05/2024 23:52

I would ask for your post to be moved to legal . It would be unfair not to inform the school .

He is a prize dick who has absolutely ruined his chances of any relationship with his son has gone

LetsGoRoundTheRoundabout · 24/05/2024 23:54

Have you got a child arrangements order in place? If so then you can take your kids abroad for a short holiday without his permission.

In this case though, if he kicks up a stink with the school that’ll be the issue - if they have someone with PR saying the child can’t go then they won’t want that issue. I’d get a court order for the trip.

Singleandproud · 24/05/2024 23:55

Get a child arrangements order, the resident parent can take the child out of the country for 28 days without the non resident parents permission.

Why did you let him ruin your holiday? In terms of the school trip, again a quick and relatively short trip to court she sorted that out, if DC is older than 12 they can decide what they want to do and courts will look particularly unfavourably on ex's petty behaviour.

Mooche · 25/05/2024 00:18

I had a similar situation and my DD dad contacted the school a day before she was due to go (despite knowing about it months before and not saying a thing). I have to say school took it very seriously and they weren't going to allow DD to go unless he gave his consent.
It's shitty to do that to kids and in sorry you're going through it. I hope it works out for you both

Original poster
mynamechangemyrules · 25/05/2024 09:10

Thanks all for the useful advice and ways forward. I do feel that being divorced from a twat is sometimes an endless stream of life admin 😂

OP posts:
Temporaryname158 · 25/05/2024 09:15

you must go to court and stop him doing this.

not only for now but also in the future. I can’t believe you didn’t turn up to the airport on a paid for holiday due to him. You are allowing him to abuse you from afar. Get the fact he has the 1/14 court mandated and merrily go on 12 night holidays together going forward and get it formally noted you are resident parent

millymollymoomoo · 25/05/2024 10:40

Take control
get a cao or at least a specific order to allow him to go
your ex just wants the feeling of control - so remove it

and btw he’s a c*nt of the highest order to treat his own child in this manner. No wonder your son doesn’t want to see him!

JohnofWessex · 25/05/2024 22:15

Why doesnt he pay CM? Off to the CSA methinks

momentumneeded · 27/05/2024 10:47

So sorry you are going through this. Have a similarly vindictive ex so completely get it. How old is the child?

I have attempted to pursue a specific issues order for a 17 year old after his Dad refused consent for an overseas holiday. Forked out for the pointless MIAM but then on submitting the court application was told that no court will make a section 8 order for a child over 16. This means no specific issues order or prohibitive steps order unless exceptional circumstances. This does not include a family holiday with the resident parent! This was an off duty judge who told the clerk this at the counter. So basically there is no legal route to obtain consent where one parent has not given it but equally that parent will get nowhere with a pso for the same reason. However this is totally at odds with the FCO advice which, as you say, states you are at risk of being accused of child abduction if you take a child under 18 out of the country without the consent of both parents. It's crazy and makes no sense but just allows abuse/ control to continue. I honestly don't know what to do. I wish I hadn't asked for consent now though as per FCO advice as I've handed dates on a plate. Grr.

If your child is under 16 I would honestly just apply for a child arrangement order so he doesn't get to do this. It's worth it for peace of mind.

Original poster
mynamechangemyrules · 27/05/2024 19:39

momentumneeded · 27/05/2024 10:47

So sorry you are going through this. Have a similarly vindictive ex so completely get it. How old is the child?

I have attempted to pursue a specific issues order for a 17 year old after his Dad refused consent for an overseas holiday. Forked out for the pointless MIAM but then on submitting the court application was told that no court will make a section 8 order for a child over 16. This means no specific issues order or prohibitive steps order unless exceptional circumstances. This does not include a family holiday with the resident parent! This was an off duty judge who told the clerk this at the counter. So basically there is no legal route to obtain consent where one parent has not given it but equally that parent will get nowhere with a pso for the same reason. However this is totally at odds with the FCO advice which, as you say, states you are at risk of being accused of child abduction if you take a child under 18 out of the country without the consent of both parents. It's crazy and makes no sense but just allows abuse/ control to continue. I honestly don't know what to do. I wish I hadn't asked for consent now though as per FCO advice as I've handed dates on a plate. Grr.

If your child is under 16 I would honestly just apply for a child arrangement order so he doesn't get to do this. It's worth it for peace of mind.

Thank you for such a useful answer.

Just wondering whether, as you say, if going to court will play into his narrative?

Will a child arrangements order sort this or does it come under the section 8 thing you mention. Sorry if that doesn't make sense...

OP posts:
Wasywasydoodah · 31/05/2024 00:18

A child arrangements order allows you to take child out of the country for 28 days without his permission. I’m not a lawyer but I don’t think it will apply to school trips. I think you need a specific issue order (which is a section 8 order). Fill the c100 form in. Put dates. Say it’s urgent.

Kelly51 · 31/05/2024 00:33

Never once I have been asked for both parents permission for trips and never once questioned at airport regards my DC having different surnames, no way would I cancel anything.

Emsy999 · 31/05/2024 06:53

Sorry I have no legal advice for you OP but what an awful situation to be in. How these spiteful, controlling parents can sleep at night is beyond me.

Like others have said you have to speak to the court. Even if he manages to stop your poor son from going with the school on this go trip he mustn't be allowed to have this control over you both into the future. If he can't give a valid reason as to why he won't allow him to go then the court will hopefully overwrite his wishes.

Take back control. I wish you well.

OMGsamesame · 31/05/2024 06:56

Why doesn't he pay CM? Have you applied to CMS to take it directly?

Emsy999 · 31/05/2024 06:56

If you have his written permission already then I would just let your son go. Does the ex know the details of the trip? When he goes etc?

Birdseyetrifle · 31/05/2024 06:58

momentumneeded · 27/05/2024 10:47

So sorry you are going through this. Have a similarly vindictive ex so completely get it. How old is the child?

I have attempted to pursue a specific issues order for a 17 year old after his Dad refused consent for an overseas holiday. Forked out for the pointless MIAM but then on submitting the court application was told that no court will make a section 8 order for a child over 16. This means no specific issues order or prohibitive steps order unless exceptional circumstances. This does not include a family holiday with the resident parent! This was an off duty judge who told the clerk this at the counter. So basically there is no legal route to obtain consent where one parent has not given it but equally that parent will get nowhere with a pso for the same reason. However this is totally at odds with the FCO advice which, as you say, states you are at risk of being accused of child abduction if you take a child under 18 out of the country without the consent of both parents. It's crazy and makes no sense but just allows abuse/ control to continue. I honestly don't know what to do. I wish I hadn't asked for consent now though as per FCO advice as I've handed dates on a plate. Grr.

If your child is under 16 I would honestly just apply for a child arrangement order so he doesn't get to do this. It's worth it for peace of mind.

At 17 your child can travel on his own. Book the trip separately and still go. They can go through as an individual traveller.

ThisBlueCrab · 31/05/2024 07:07

I would play him at his own game

He has 1/14 contact and doesnt pay maintenance, so hardly parent of the year. So firstly a court will take the wishes if a 14 year old into account so won't really get him anywhere. But I would use the return threat of going to CMS for maintenance