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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Divorce on behalf of person in minimally conscious state

27 replies

NoPineappleonPizzaCampaign · 04/04/2024 14:49

My DSSis has recently been in a serious car accident in which she sustained head injuries which has left her incapacitated, and likely to be severely disabled for the rest of her life, this we have been told by the doctors. We are of course still hopeful that she will make a recovery of some sort, but the outlook for her long term recovery is very poor. She currently cannot walk, talk, or feed herself. We do think she can recognise and understand us though, and we have seen some positive responses and movements.

We are, or course, exploring the options available to us for her long term care. This is not the advice sought on this post though.

She was separated from her husband, for around the last 12-18 months, and there was a reconciliation during that time but separated again. They have been married 12 years, no kids or dependents, just themselves. The separation was known to other family members, and they lived apart, although there had been no attempt to start divorce proceedings by either party. Joint bank accounts had remained active as there were continued joint expenses being paid through the account, such as a PCP payment in joint names. Day to day living expenses are/were paid individually by each person.

She does not really have any money or savings behind her, but the husband does (not rich, but has assets to value £1m we estimate). Some of his assets were accumulated before they were married, although we won’t get a straightforward or honest answer from the husband on this one as he has gone into self-protection mode. It is, and never was, in his interests to file for divorce, since financially, he will probably have to pay her some money. He stated almost immediately after the accident that he did not want to be involved in her care, nor take any responsibility for what happens to her from now on.

Whatever we do from this point forward is going to cost money, and we are exploring ways to liquidate any pensions she has for example, to help cover care and other costs.

One option is for her to file for divorce to essentially claim her share of the marital assets. I see this as a long bumpy road, not least because the husband is going to kick,scream and delay everything, but would be worth it if the payout at the end was significant enough to make a difference to the quality of her life. I know that the starting point for division of assets is 50/50.

Is it likely that she might be awarded a larger share due to medical needs and incapacity to work in the future? Is it even possible to take her through a divorce when she is so incapacitated? (Anything we do would be with her consent, we are not planning on making massive life decisions for her without her input, however limited that might be).

OP posts:
titchy · 04/04/2024 14:55

Not a lawyer, but it could be the other way round. If she is deemed to need such a high level of care for the rest of her life, that would be NHS provided in a hospital, possibly partly SS funded. Her financial needs would therefore be minimal.

Linedbook · 04/04/2024 15:16

Surely you'd be better off persuing a claim for damages through the car insurance?

It's an awful situation for all concerned, but you don't think the answer is that her husband hands over more than half of his assets, surely?

As with all these things, you'll need to get proper legal advice.

Spacecowboys · 04/04/2024 15:24

Given that neither party had started divorce proceedings, are you certain that is what DSsis actually wants? With the seriousness of her injuries, it sounds like there may be issues with capacity and consent. She doesn’t sound capable of filing for divorce and depending on her recovery, may never be able to. As a previous poster suggested, a claim via car insurance is surely the best approach? What a horrible situation for everyone.

Octavia64 · 04/04/2024 15:25

You need legal advice.

She is likely to need care and the fact that she is married means that there may be jointly owned assets.

This might be a good starting point, but this is a complicated area and you really do need legal advice.

www.ageuk.org.uk/globalassets/age-uk/documents/factsheets/fs39-paying-for-care-in-a-care-home-if-you-have-a-partner.pdf

PutOnYourRedShoesAndLetsDance · 04/04/2024 15:36

She needs legal advice.
Insurance should be involved too.
I was left disabled after an ex threw me under a bus.. left for dead... he got jailed.. took 16 years to get compensation.. was just over 2 million.

user1567879667589 · 04/04/2024 15:56

I think you need proper legal advice.
I think you may find, hopefully, that the car insurance will cover her ongoing care needs. That is what happened for a friends sister who was injured in a car crash, she is still alive, although profoundly disabled 20 years on. She has two nurses and various adaptions and equipment in their parents home that had an extension built to accommodate her.

I wouldn't be using vital emotional energy worrying about divorce at the moment, it can wait until things are a bit more settled. And sadly, the cost of significant nursing care will be very high, so the insurance will be your best bet of securing the best care.

whatwouldAnnaDelveydo · 04/04/2024 16:01

Perhaps you could do it the other way round? If she's married, can't she use her own money (marital assets) to pay for the care? If he doesn't want to divorce, then the money is hers too. Of course, you have to check with lawyers if that's possible.

NoPineappleonPizzaCampaign · 04/04/2024 18:07

titchy · 04/04/2024 14:55

Not a lawyer, but it could be the other way round. If she is deemed to need such a high level of care for the rest of her life, that would be NHS provided in a hospital, possibly partly SS funded. Her financial needs would therefore be minimal.

Thanks, yes, this had crossed our minds as also her life expectancy could be argued to be not very long and therefore less required.

OP posts:
NoPineappleonPizzaCampaign · 04/04/2024 18:09

Octavia64 · 04/04/2024 15:25

You need legal advice.

She is likely to need care and the fact that she is married means that there may be jointly owned assets.

This might be a good starting point, but this is a complicated area and you really do need legal advice.

www.ageuk.org.uk/globalassets/age-uk/documents/factsheets/fs39-paying-for-care-in-a-care-home-if-you-have-a-partner.pdf

Thanks, I’ll read through this. We think jointly owned assets are not of significant value.

OP posts:
NoPineappleonPizzaCampaign · 04/04/2024 18:12

whatwouldAnnaDelveydo · 04/04/2024 16:01

Perhaps you could do it the other way round? If she's married, can't she use her own money (marital assets) to pay for the care? If he doesn't want to divorce, then the money is hers too. Of course, you have to check with lawyers if that's possible.

Thanks, yes, we had thought of this. We don’t believe jointly owned assets are of significant value, nor do we think we will get an honest answer or any help in accessing those assets from the husband. It’s a difficult situation for sure, they’re married in the eyes of the law.

OP posts:
UnbeatenMum · 04/04/2024 18:18

I'm not a lawyer and I think you need one, but from experience with a relative who lost capacity I'm wondering if you might need to apply to the Court of Protection to be able to make decisions on her behalf about money and health. But even then I'm not sure you'd be able to instigate a divorce on her behalf.

CheapThrillsMeanNothing · 04/04/2024 18:27

Did she have a private or company pension?
It should pay out a pension and/or a lump sum.

PandyMoanyMum · 04/04/2024 18:29

I don’t think she can get divorced easily if she has lost mental capacity. It will be complicated.

Springisroundthecorner · 04/04/2024 18:31

You need a lawyer asap
Apply to the Court of Protection for Deputyship (assuming you don't have POA)
Apply for CHC funding to help with her care costs

AcrossthePond55 · 04/04/2024 18:44

@NoPineappleonPizzaCampaign

What @Springisroundthecorner says sounds right to me re the divorce issue.

I'm in the US but it seems that some of UK family law sort of 'parallels' what's done here. Some, but not all of course.

Here, a divorce can only be filed by someone with the mental capacity to understand and institute proceedings. In the case of 'non compos mentis' you'd first have to have the person declared mentally incompetent by a court of law and then be appointed their (US term here) "Conservator of Person and Estate". Only a Conservator of Person can file a divorce on behalf of their conservatee. Conservator of Estate only allows one to control their finances.

You say that the joint assets aren't very much, so all his 'big' assets are in his name only? Were they accumulated before the marriage, and would that make them non-marital assets (it does here). If not, do you have enough knowledge to be able to tell a solicitor where to look for these assets?

You really need to see a specialist solicitor.

NoPineappleonPizzaCampaign · 04/04/2024 19:07

CheapThrillsMeanNothing · 04/04/2024 18:27

Did she have a private or company pension?
It should pay out a pension and/or a lump sum.

Thanks, we had not thought of that. I know life insurances will pay out partially in these situations, but hadn’t thought the pensions might. They would be private pensions from her early career in the financial sector.

OP posts:
Alstreena · 04/04/2024 19:09

Please get legal advice OP.

MoreHairyThanScary · 04/04/2024 19:27

You need legal advice particularly if she is due a payout from the insurance as he may as her nok be entitled to manage it.

I think court of protection would be a starting point.

Twazique · 04/04/2024 19:27

You may need also to change who her benefits from her job may go to if she were to die.

CandidHedgehog · 05/04/2024 09:01

MoreHairyThanScary · 04/04/2024 19:27

You need legal advice particularly if she is due a payout from the insurance as he may as her nok be entitled to manage it.

I think court of protection would be a starting point.

This. At the moment her husband has all the legal rights and powers. Does his disinterest stretch to not taking a multimillion pound settlement from the car insurance? He’d have to apply it for her benefit but there’s a lot of wiggle room in that.

You need to get the legal side sorted while he still thinks he’s avoiding caring for her and before he realises he’s giving up control of what could be millions.

NoPineappleonPizzaCampaign · 05/04/2024 10:03

Thanks all, that’s been helpful. We are concerned yes, that the husband will happily grab whatever he could from still being listed as a beneficiary. And we will be doing what we can to minimise or eliminate that risk asap. Can’t have it both ways right?

OP posts:
RB68 · 05/04/2024 10:15

Yes you have power of attorney issues first off, both in terms of finance and medical care. I would approach a solicitor first about this, I would also ask them about getting husband involved to the point of paying for these to be put in place so the responsibility is with someone other than himself which is where I think it currently sits.... so it would be to his advantage to support and pay for that.

WIth a POA you have to decide what is best for the person if you have no documented wishes regarding things. Solicitor will be able to advise on this.

With regard to divorce and financial settlement if your relative is not named or is only named on the main home you may be able to get legal aid to help pay for a financial settlement to be made, a solicitor can advise and process this if appropriate.

I wouldn't rely on NHS providing care and anything else long term - look at Derek Draper, once he reached a stage where no medical intervention was required he was left with little or no assistance regarding care in particular. Yes there were assets there but not really accessible funds etc

MoreHairyThanScary · 05/04/2024 12:10

You can't get POA without the individual having capacity, sadly it doesn't sound like OP's DSis is able to do this therefore everything has to go through the court of protection.

NoPineappleonPizzaCampaign · 05/04/2024 15:24

I wouldn't rely on NHS providing care and anything else long term - look at Derek Draper, once he reached a stage where no medical intervention was required he was left with little or no assistance regarding care in particular. Yes there were assets there but not really accessible funds etc

This is one of our worries. I had actually read a thread last week about how very sick/ill/disabled people could not access Continuing Healthcare Funding, and it was grim.

OP posts:
Moreveganice · 05/04/2024 15:34

I’m sorry you are having to deal with this. Please can I suggest you contact Headway for support. Also specialist legal advice could be obtained from Irwin Mitchell.