Financial settlement - strategy with a narcissist

[GotToGet999]

Hello,
seeking advice. Separated from ex (narcissist and DA issues in marriage) for 1 year, have dd aged 7 who lives with me and sees ex eow and 2-3 eve per week. Said ex has 1 adult child living with him plus 1 minor, from his previous marriage. Ex has gone for 50/50 shared custody of our son through courts - as he doesn’t want to pay cm and in true narc style will do anything to spite me. There are some safeguarding and welfare issues which mean I oppose 50/50.

finances yet to be sorted but I’m thinking that it’s best to try to come to some king of deal on this given the amount of lawyers fees and the fact that ex gets really upset about ‘giving’ money to me - this might encourage him come to a deal. Wondering if there is some strategy to get him to come to a deal

basic details: we both work full time though he decreased his earning capacity deliberately. I’m on 60k and he is on 90k. His pension is x2 the same as mine, 60k v 120k. I would want a clean break and maybe nominal spousal maintenance as he will no doing get a better paid job after all sorted.

his Achilles heel is money. Mine is my son.

any idea what would be a fair split here, and any idea how to get him to table? We have a fdr in April.

thank you

You 100% will not get spousal so don’t bother pursuing it

it will be hard for you to contest 59:59 child arrangements on welfare and safeguarding if you are ok with eow plus 2-3 evenings a week

on your salaries and pensions you’ll be looking basically at pretty much 59:50 with perhaps v small increase in favour to you to equalise pension

50-50 split that should say perhaps slightly higher to you if you equalise pensions

@millymollymoomoo thank you
the 2-3 eves are not overnights, just 2 hours after school (and these are being varied as v disruptive)
so are you saying 50:50 split or 60/40 in my favour overall?
advice I have been given is to include a nominal s maintenance in case his salary goes up OR a bigger share of assets . Ex previously on 130k plus bonus

It’s both in unlikely to get spousal- esp when you earn the salary you do
you will waste loads of money fighting for it
yiu will get child maintenance

I understand it’s not overnight mid week but you’re ok for them to stay eow and him to have them a few times, despite saying safe guarding concerns

i think you’d be looking simply get

50% house equity
equalise pensions

of course this depends on ages, length of marriage, any other assets etc

Hence devil in the detail

If the core issue is that you are divorcing a narcissist then you are likely to end up in a high conflict divorce. You are there already with the CAO.

Nominal spousal maintenance is going to be another bone of contention that will take you into court. Given your salaries a reasonable person would oppose it and a reasonable person would drop it.

The pensions are not worth fighting over in court. Given your respective salaries they should be way higher. Says to me neither of you were that bothered. Why bother now? The cost of fighting over the difference would probably equate to the value you gain.

I don’t know the value of other assets so I don’t know if it is worth fighting over. He has a larger salary but two dependants. That’s a reason for him to need a bigger home.

A clean break and spousal maintenance is incongruous.

If your ex is a narcissist you are giving him the conflict he wants. Nothing in your post tells me you will get a lot for a high financial and emotional cost.

What other assets are you splitting? House equity?

There are no other assets apart from equity and pension (certainly not on my side)
would 24 year old adult child be classed as dependent?
im aware that I don’t want to spend good money found after bad so wondering what a reasonable settlement would be - I’ve been given anything from50-75 % by lawyers

Don't wrestle with a pig, you'll both get dirty and the pig likes it. I'd not get too hung up on getting a "fair" outcome, focus instead on what you need in order to move on reasonably with your own life. Someone truly disordered can drag you to depths you wouldn't fathom and the system is not set up for it. He will be unreasonable until the day he goes into the ground.

It doesn't sound like you're dealing with excess assets, and as such it's a needs case, what do you need in order to get him behind you?

The strategy is to make them feel like they have ‘won’. Are you a litigant in person?

I would offer him 50:50 of assets and leave pensions alone. Forget what his salary might increase to, cut your losses and walk free. You won’t get spousal maintenance. You may be entitled to more (esp pensions) but the emotional and financial toll of a drawn-out battle which could cost you in the region of £40k and another 12-18m is not remotely worth it. Save your sanity.

I think some posters here (and maybe you) are getting confused about the term nominal spousal maintenance.

NSM is a clause that gets put into most consent orders when there are children involved.

A nominal spousal maintenance order - is an order that one spouse should pay to their husband or wife a small sum on an ongoing basis (usually 1p per annum) either for a fixed term or indefinitely. Should the receiver fall on VERY hard times (when the children are under the age of 18) they may go back to the court to request maintenance.

It is extremely rare to be awarded this (just because your EH gets a pay rise you won’t be awarded it). You have to have fallen on hard times.

My now DH’s EW tried this and was advised that ‘hard times’ would be examples such as she was confined to a wheelchair and was unable to provide for herself.

I therefore wouldn’t bank on receiving any nomination SM.

With regards to contact of the children - he cares FT for 2 children of a previous marriage and sees the child from this marriage EOW and 2/3 x per week. Therefore your argument of ‘safe guarding’ issues won’t wash with the court. If you had genuine safe guarding issues - why are you allowing such frequent contact?

I don’t see anything based on your post to justify a 75% split in your favour

i think you’ll be lucky to get more than 50% or near there

Unless the 24 year old has special needs of some description then he doesn't need to house them (via this settlement), and is not 'caring for them'. Did the 15 year old and 24 year old live in the marital home before?

@NorthernSpirit hé only spends 2 hours after school there 2 days a week. I not against contact as long as it is safe. I don’t think the 50/50 is in our sons best interests. Not going to go into it further on here.
i don’t know the ins and outs of the cao for his other kids but it wasn’t 50/50 , it was EOW and before she left, I am aware that she had safeguarding concerns too. Shd left very suddenly and the cao was not varied .She too was a victim ex’s abuse now looking back.

The things that helped.

When he first saw a solicitor, he dropped his most idiotic demands. But then decided to stop using her.

Hes using magical mathematics to claim he is offering 50% when he is not.

I have decided I may accept a lesser amount if I can afford to find the right house to buy, but my solicitors 50/50 offer is ready to go if need be.

Time and love. He now has a girlfriend who has moved in. I think because she can share costs, he doesn’t feel so ‘poor’. It’s been 18 months so far, and he now wants to get on with his new life. He has admitted he was too concerned about the money.

In your other post I think you said your son spends 1 overnight/week with ex?

Ultimately, how much do you need from the settlement to buy a 2-bed for you and your son? Find out what your maximum mortgage capacity is. I would focus on this with his personality type because he has more money than you to spend on solicitors and will drag this out and drain your finances. They feed off the drama and use the court system to abuse you. That’s my experience, anyway. Change your mindset from the idea of ‘fairness’ and focus on winning your freedom which is priceless. You can focus on earning more money once you’ve gotten rid of the dead weight.