How did you agree finances with your ex?

[bananasplit07]

I’ve recently separated from dh after 19 years of marriage and want to apply for divorce this week.
I’m looking for advice/experiences from those of you who’ve been through/are going through the divorce process on how you agreed the Financial Order. Did you agree it between yourselves or online discuss through lawyers? How did it turn out?

More detail:
dh has moved out of our family home and we’re currently only communicating via text/email, albeit fairly neutrally at the moment. He is continuing to pay for all our living expenses incl. mortgage and bills although the resentment about this is building.

I was intending to suggest meeting up to discuss finances. However, my godmother thinks this is a terrible idea and has said under no circumstances should I discuss finances with dh in case he gets aggressive if I tell him that a ‘fair’ split under the law is more like 70:30 or 60:40 not the 50:50 he has always assumed. She says to leave it all for the lawyers. But I’m worried about the costs mounting up if I do this. He has access to plenty of money but I have very meagre savings. He has already suggested we should meet up to talk about finances - he’s much more financially astute than me as he works in finance. So maybe I should assume he actually already knows the implications.

I want my due and I need the majority of equity from the house in order to be able to afford a new place for me and my kids but I don’t want to antagonise dh or have things drag on longer than necessary.

What do you mean by a fair split being not 50:50? Me and my ex agreed all the financial splits in advance, and then only dealt with lawyers to make sure the consent order was completed correctly and was legally watertight. We were really civil from the beginning of the breakup (even if his mum tried to change that, evil woman!) so it wasn't too difficult. I moved out of the flat we owned and continued to pay my half for a set period of time. When we came to sell, my ex got the money back for the additional months he had paid the mortgage for (capital only) before we split the proceeds of sale 50/50.

Nothing is ‘fair’ as regard divorce finances, both parties come out worse off.

How old are the children? If you have been married 19 years - I presume they are older?

A fair division of assets is based on needs, not wants.

If you can agree a financial split between you or in mediation that’s going to be much cheaper than lining the pockets of solicitors.

I can understand him not wanting to pay his living expenses as well as yours. You are going to need to start paying for yourself, contributing. Do you work?

Why do you think a fair split is 70:30? How did you get to this number? The starting point will be 50:50.

You may ‘need’ the majority of equity from the house, but that doesn’t mean you will get it. You both need suitable accommodation (especially if he will have overnights with the children).

Personally I would sit down with him & work up a solution (taking into account savings, property, pensions etc). Always best to do it between you rather than involve expensive solicitors.

That’s good that you were able to agree things between yourselves and that is was straightforward. That’s what I’d like ideally.

I had a free consultation with a lawyer and they advised that due to the length of the marriage, the fact that we have children and the disparity in our earning power that legally what’s ‘fair’ in terms of splitting the finances is that both parents are able to afford houses of equivalent standard of living that are adequate for the children and that the children are able to maintain their standard of living within reason. So because I’m the person the kids will mostly be living with and because his earning potential is so much greater than mine, I’ll need more equity from the house and a certain proportion of his income as maintenance while the children still live at home. Which the lawyer said usually works out at between 60/70% of assets.

I’ve also used that wikivorce calculator to get a rough idea and it came out similar.

If you think there is any chance of him seeing your point and agreeing a split more in your favour then have a face to face discussion. If you think he will be hostile then there’s no point. I’m sure you know him better than your aunt does - do you think he will get aggressive?

Talking with you ex is perfectly reasonable and could save you thousands

the % will depend on assets available inc oensions
ages of children
housing needs ( not wants)
-both parties ages

absolutely understandable he’s resentful
how old are the children
do you work full time?

What’s your mortgage raising capacity ?
what’s his?
why should you get house but he’d had a large mortgage?

I'm not sure about that calculator at all. I've just tried it, and it says I should also receive 70% of assets. I don't actually know anyone who received that. The two most contentious divorces I know ended up with around 58% to the wife.

The starting point is 50/50. I'm currently trying to negotiate this with a stbxh who thinks that's too much!

It’s absolutely fine to ask what his proposal is.

Lawyers are ££££ and it’s money that better in your pocket than theirs

What other assets are there? It’s unlikely you’ll get 70% of all assets inc pensions tbh, you may offset equity etc but getting more equity would mean less pension but depends on pit availabile

and if 50:50 split allows you to be housed then you might even see only that

Of course 50-50 is not fair if OP has the kids most of the time and has sacrificed her career to facilitate his.

People on here sometimes seem to think no one owes anyone anything- the whole point of marriage is that you are committed to support the other person and if you choose it lets you act as a team where one works more and one focussed on family. What does PP mean the OP will have to "start contributing" WTF do you think she's been doing for 19 years with kids, eating bon bons and lying on the sofa?!

Sorry I have no useful advice

Oh and wikivorce is usually far removed from reality

Oh and are you referring to spousal maintenance or child maintenance??

If you can agree it between yourselves then you save a lot of money. The law applies the same whether you use lawyers are not. Doesn’t mean you can’t get some legal advice to confirm what you both decided is fair or in relation to anything complex.

The most immediate thing you need to talk about is the finances during separation. Expecting him to pay your bills when separated is as you say going to lead to resentment. If he asked me for advice this is certainly what I would advise against.

It is better if you start to separate finances. In most cases this happens after a few weeks of adjustment and he then starts to pay child support. Maybe part of the mortgage if necessary. Why do you need so much financial support from him?

My advice is not to start with saying what % you think is right. You should start with agreeing on what the marital assets are and then begin defining your respective needs. Most married couples know what their assets are and their post divorce needs are usually about the same. If assets cover needs then you will be close to 50:50. If then don’t then the lower earner usually gets a larger share of equity.

Thanks for all your replies and advice so far. My kids are teenagers. I have always worked - I currently work part-time 4 days a week and one evening, and have had to change my whole career and working hours over the years to fit around the kids because my husband has been extremely hands off the whole time and it has been down to me to do everything child-related. He earns over 4x as much as me. 12 years ago we were earning almost the same. For the last 2 years he’s been away half the week, nearly every week, ‘on business’ and on several week-long business trips abroad. AKA sleeping with whoever he wants while away, it turns out.

He has been in charge of the finances for
our whole marriage (rightly or wrongly) and has rarely taken my views into consideration. We live in a nice house but with a mortgage which is more than my whole monthly salary. For the last 9 years, I’ve paid for everything child-related - clothes, hobbies, days out, school trips, my own costs - car, phone, clothes, all Christmas and birthday present for everyone including extended family and I contribute to the cost of holidays. He pays for everything house-related - mortgage, utilities, food etc.

Realistically the only way I can see that I can support myself more is for us to sell the house as soon as possible. It’s not that
I don’t want to support myself it’s just that i can’t see how I can possibly do that with our current outgoings. I would love to have my own place but that’s not a quick fix really.

He does get verbally abusive during these kind of discussions normally and can be aggressive so we don’t get anywhere and that’s why I’ve had to leave the finances to him over the course of our relationship.

You’ll be expected to work full time to support yourself as your children are teens

what equity is available
what does a 3 bed cost
what mortgage can you get with full time earnings plus equity plus cms ?

are there pensions ?

I don’t mind working full-time, I want to be independent and support myself. I enjoy my job. We both have pensions although his is much larger than mine and I’m looking forward to building up my career again as the kids get older.
We have equity of about 350k in the house and a 3 bed would cost c.£315-350k, to be near enough to the kids’ school. I could only afford a mortgage of about £50k I think though.
Do banks take CMS into account when giving you a mortgage? I didn’t know that. Do you need an official document to prove the CMS payments if you’re separated rather than divorced?

your needs through settlement will be assessed on your full time earning potential

what mortgage can you get with that? 50k mortgage seems very low

some lenders will take cms into account

Now you are separated he can’t and shouldn’t control your finances or work options. This is not good for him or you. You need a plan to become financially independent until the house is sold and the settlement agreed. If you got 70% of the equity or savings you still have to pay housing costs, bills and living costs.

The best divorce outcome you can hope for will give you a larger share of the capital. Unfortunately because housing costs in the UK are so high you will end up sinking into paying for a home. The large capital payout is a clean break meaning you will be expected to survive on your own income.

I personally think he will stop covering your living costs soon or he will use it as a means of control. You immediate priority is to secure an income. This will be your salary (which can surely be improved to FT working), Child support and Universal credit.

If your children are teens then they are older and it’s time to improve your income. You will be entitled to UC and CMS.

What are your actual incomes? By the sounds of it 4x your salary doesn’t make him a high earner. Meaning the current situation is untenable.

I agree - I think I need to separate out the divorce and divorce financial settlement from our immediate financial situation and needs now that we’re separated, which I hadn’t thought about before but makes perfect sense thank you.

I would chat to him about finances, but dont mention how much you want/need. Find out what he is thinking whether 50/50 or if he would consider more and quietly take it all in.

You dont want to get him fired up and it become banging your head against a wall.

Once you have a rough idea of his thoughts then discuss with solicitor and hash out what tact to use and will work.

Honestly the more you anger him the bigger fight and higher costs. If he would happily be persuaded higher, it may be better to cut your losses on a bit then have a hostile relationship and lose the money on fees.

Hi op

This was me 5 years ago. Married 18 years, teen children and he moved out. He earned 4 x what I earned. He was paying all the bills. (Very different when we first met). We only and still do communicate over text and sorted all our self. He agreed 70/30 split to help me get a place with the kids. He was in a stronger position to get a bigger mortgage than me.

I think he would have liked more but he was fair because I needed a place for the kids. I took on a small mortgage of 40k.

He is always having holidays etc and I haven't had one in 5 years but he was fair with the equity but we haven't sorted pensions and he won't discuss it 🤷🏻‍♀️

Good luck

Hi it’s so interesting to hear your situation was quite similar to mine and that is very encouraging that it has worked out for you.

Is there any point in a meet up? Are you just going to argue?
would mediation be better?
I think I’m my experience a lot of men get bitter. I don’t know how you remedy this. Perhaps bear this in mind. Things are always amicable until money is involved.

Sometimes 50/50 isn’t always fair. If money is tight, maybe see if this might help you in the process - https://iamlip.com/help-guides/the-court-process-of-dividing-your-marital-assets-finances-and-pensions/

It might make the process a little easier to do, also there’s a section in pensions.

Also this might help as it says what the court must take into account when making financial orders e.g. length of marriage, financial needs, responsibilities etc https://iamlip.com/help-guides/legislation-governing-your-divorce-and-cases-you-can-refer-to-in-your-divorce/
Hope this can help!

Placemarking.