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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Original poster

Basic concepts of child maintenance/contributions.

67 replies

FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 07:40

DH and I are separating and aiming to do it in as amicable way as possible. Obviously I will be getting legal advice but we are trying to agree the outline structure of any settlement ourselves, to minimise legal costs.

I’d appreciate some advice on the general principles of child maintenance so I can get it straight in my head before talking with others.

Background is this:
Together 20 years, married 18
DC 14 and 12

Pensions are roughly equal
we have agreed the house is basically 50/50
I have a reasonable ISA (as part of retirement planning). DH using his ISA to put a deposit on a house.

We earn on approx 60/40 split with DH earning more. we currently split bills roughly along this ratio too.

DH is proposing that he continues to pay the mortgage on ‘our’ house and pays the mortgage on new house. We then effectively own these both jointly and split proceeds equally when sold. When DC leave home this would enable me to downsize etc.

What is next to be discussed is the split of bills on both houses. Ie whether I will then be responsible for all bills on the house I live in. Frankly this is not affordable for me, with other costs such as food etc.

Pensions stay as they are.

So, with this sort of arrangement on assets, what would be expected in terms of child maintenance, both ways?

DH currently is around mornings with DC to enable me to start work early. This would continue.

He is also also proposing one overnight in the week and every other weekend.

whilst we are trying to do this amicably, I also need to make sure it is fair. DH has fairly complex business arrangements so I do need to be alert to anything he might be doing to minimise salary (and therefore minimise payments towards DC ‘running costs’) and maximise his capital/savings.

I work 3.5 days currently and will increase to 4 days at end of year.

Any thoughts? Would I be expecting a contribution towards bills on the house the DC live in and towards their food and other living costs eg activities, clothing etc. This, I suspect, will be the tricky bit.

OP posts:
SheilaFentiman · 21/02/2023 08:44

you say your ISA is bigger, so why would his go into the “pot” and not yours?

Original poster
FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 08:45

So, salary split currently is probably nearer 70/30.

But there are moving goalposts here. If DH reduces his salary that we could be 50:50. He will have other income tho.

I guess child split works out about 75% with me

OP posts:
Original poster
FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 08:49

@SheilaFentiman good point. He owns part of another property which is roughly equal in value to my Isa so I was effectively treating them as evens.

Essentially, each of have assets outside he house at the moment that are roughly equal.

pensions are def equal. Then he has ISA plus property, and I have Isa.

OP posts:
SheilaFentiman · 21/02/2023 08:49

You say it is amicable, but you also think DH will deliberately reduce his salary?

FWIW, the mortgage company will be looking at his income and his CM outgoings etc as part of assessing affordability for a new mortgage.

SheilaFentiman · 21/02/2023 08:50

Is the money tied up in the other property accessible to him? Ie could he “force” it to be sold?

MintJulia · 21/02/2023 08:53

And when he meets his next wife and wants to share a mortgage with her? And have children with her? Or you do?

You need a clean break.

worried4698643 · 21/02/2023 08:53

Never ever rely on child maintenance as a source of income, or means to pay the mortgage.

It's well known to be a terrible system, incredibly easy for NRP to pay a minimal amount.

SheilaFentiman · 21/02/2023 08:55

If you both cashed in your ISAs (not saying to do this), would the proceeds be enough to pay off the mortgage on your current house? Trying to get a feel of assets v debts

Original poster
FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 08:57

@gogohmm thanks, this is the concept I had in mind.

What is spousal support and how might I calculate that?

Basically I do need to maximise what support I can receive from him, as you would expect.

Also, and I realise this is quite privileged, but I would like to be able to save little and often for DC if they chose to go to uni. DH will not think this far ahead whereas if I can maximise what he contributes, I can manage that for them too.

Which is realise is not really in scope but is me being pragmatic.

OP posts:
Original poster
FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:02

@SheilaFentiman I could pay off the mortgage (or my half) if I cashed in my ISA.

He could do same. Although he has earmarked this for deposit on new house. Mortgage agreed in principle.

my main concern (now) is that he will be able to minimise regular support therefore retain much more displosible income. Do I just have to suck this up?

Other property is in a complex situation. Not likely to yield cash soon. His plan is that this is potentially a source of support for kids post-18 but it’s not entirely on his gift.

OP posts:
Newnamenewme23 · 21/02/2023 09:09

FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 08:57

@gogohmm thanks, this is the concept I had in mind.

What is spousal support and how might I calculate that?

Basically I do need to maximise what support I can receive from him, as you would expect.

Also, and I realise this is quite privileged, but I would like to be able to save little and often for DC if they chose to go to uni. DH will not think this far ahead whereas if I can maximise what he contributes, I can manage that for them too.

Which is realise is not really in scope but is me being pragmatic.

You won’t get spousal support.

with dc 14 and 12 they are secondary school
age so you have no reason not to work full time. Why is dh expected to do the early mornings? Why aren’t they getting themselves to school?

honestly you’re asking for way too much. You have 6 years until your kids are adults.

you will be earning well in a year and able to support yourself and kids on 55k, plus cms.

i can’t see a court or mediator agreeing to your proposals. A 50:50 split is reasonable. You both keep your Isa’s and pensions, you buy him out the house.

how big is the mortgage?

you’re asking way too much.

why can’t you delay a year until you’re earning well then buy him out of the house.

but yes, you’re expected to pay your own bills. You’re getting divorced, he has to support is kids, but not you.

Newnamenewme23 · 21/02/2023 09:13

FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:02

@SheilaFentiman I could pay off the mortgage (or my half) if I cashed in my ISA.

He could do same. Although he has earmarked this for deposit on new house. Mortgage agreed in principle.

my main concern (now) is that he will be able to minimise regular support therefore retain much more displosible income. Do I just have to suck this up?

Other property is in a complex situation. Not likely to yield cash soon. His plan is that this is potentially a source of support for kids post-18 but it’s not entirely on his gift.

Dividends are declared to hmrc and will form part of his income, so he can’t get round it by reducing his salary and increasing dividends.

he could of course leave the money in the company, but he’d have to live on his salary and savings for 5 years. Not very tax efficient, and not really practical to live on 12 k a year or whatever.

are you a director of the company? Or is it his company alone?

quietnightmare · 21/02/2023 09:19

Sell the house and split then cms on top

Or your stay in the house, he continues paying his part of the mortgage instead of cms unless cms would be more then he pays he's mortgage part and whatever is missing from the cms payment is paid to you such as £350 to the mortgage and £150 to you as 'cms'

Original poster
FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:26

I’m not a director.

OP posts:
ArcticSkewer · 21/02/2023 09:27

You probably can't afford to stay in that house if you can't even afford the bills. It may be in your better interest to sell and downsize.

I'd expect a starting point of 50:50 on assets, maybe slightly more to you, with child maintenance calculated separately.

If he is also offering to pay the full mortgage, great. If it's instead of child maintenance what's the difference in amount payable?

Original poster
FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:31

With half the mortgage and some maintenance I can probably do it.

It’s at least £20k to sell which is just sunk costs for both of us.

OP posts:
DrMarciaFieldstone · 21/02/2023 09:33

Realistically you’re going to be advised to sell the house, split the proceeds and all your savings, then he’ll pay CMS if they spend more time with you.

Anything else is unlikely. Staying in the house and he pays the mortgage in lieu of CMS is less likely to be approved as after one year and one day, either party can go to the CMS, and any child maintenance portion of a consent order is negated.

At your kids ages, you’re going to be expected to work full time, you won’t get any long-term spousal.

Original poster
FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:33

@ArcticSkewer what’s the logic on slightly more to me as a starting point?

OP posts:
DrMarciaFieldstone · 21/02/2023 09:33

Or use your split of the savings to pay the mortgage off and buy him out

Original poster
FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:36

@DrMarciaFieldstone there’s more equity in the house then I have savings,
I can’t buy him out that way.

OP posts:
ArcticSkewer · 21/02/2023 09:39

FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:33

@ArcticSkewer what’s the logic on slightly more to me as a starting point?

Really I think 50:50, but you are having the kids more it sounds like so may need a slightly larger house.

Madamecastafiore · 21/02/2023 09:49

Half of 'his' savings are yours so put everything in a pot and split it.

LemonTT · 21/02/2023 09:49

MintJulia · 21/02/2023 08:53

And when he meets his next wife and wants to share a mortgage with her? And have children with her? Or you do?

You need a clean break.

This is the most fundamental issue. It’s not even limited to meeting new partners. What if you want to move for work or to reduce costs? These should all be decisions you can make without his interference.

You are divorcing so you both gain independence from one and another. Maybe one of you doesn’t want that but at least one of you should.

There is absolutely no need for this convoluted nonsense. Split the assets in whatever ration is considered fair. Get a bigger capital share if you earn less. Go back to work full time as soon as you can.

LemonTT · 21/02/2023 09:53

FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:33

@ArcticSkewer what’s the logic on slightly more to me as a starting point?

If you earn less and have bigger housing needs to meet as the resident parent. Lower earners cannot borrow as much and resident parents need more space.

But if the pot is big enough to sort both of you out with three bed houses, then it will edge back towards 50:50. You may have to use your ISA as well to sort yourself out

Springintoabetterlife · 21/02/2023 10:01

FallenFigs · 21/02/2023 09:36

@DrMarciaFieldstone there’s more equity in the house then I have savings,
I can’t buy him out that way.

Legally they aren’t just your savings.

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