DD doesn't want to go to dad's

[Quistis]

It's been going on for a little while now... mostly the handovers are after school, so I don't get to see how she responds. But during the holidays, there's always a handover that involves both of us. This week, she (age 10) made very clear that she didn't want to go. She doesn't get angry, just upset, and when I try to get her to articulate why she doesn't want to go, she simply says "I don't know" and "I want to stay with you". Her sister (6) has no issue with going.

Me and the ex aren't on great terms. We separated 5 years ago, and have been living apart since then. We have a child arrangement order, but even though he agreed the 60/40, he's been dragging me to court ever since to get it changed to 50/50 until he was finally banned from doing so without permission. I try to avoid speaking to him at all when necessary, because he will always find a way to twist every conversation into an attack on me.

This week, DD clung to me at drop-off, sobbing because she had asked him if she could stay with me and he said no. He got angry and tried to pull her off me. Not violently or roughly, and he didn't hurt her, but just trying to use force to sort of manhandle her off me. I said that that wasn't a good way to handle things, but he turned on me, accusing me of pandering and mollycoddling, at which point she finally let go. But as he carried her in, she was just staring at me with such sadness and desperation, but I couldn't do anything because we have a court order.

I feel wretched about the whole thing. How do I find out what's bothering her? I have a few ideas, but I know I can't really say them to her as suggestions as I don't want to put things in her head. How do I help her articulate the issue? What do I do about this whole manhandling thing? I really don't want that to happen again, but I'm bound by a court order and I don't want to give him any ammunition to use against me in the future, as I'm pretty sure he is trying to find a way to get the court to grant him permission to apply again, though I don't know how that works.

Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

I really feel for you .
I think it's atrocious the way that fathers are suddenly so interested in these 50/50 arrangements ,which conveniently mean they don't have to pay any maintenance .

I have been in the same situation although it was years ago and my ex only had our sons EOW.
They did occasionally kick off ,but I knew that there was no problem at my ex's house and I was worried that if I kept them with me when it was his weekend he would take me to court .
It was heartbreaking at the time so I know how you feel.

Why do you think she doesn't want to go?

Is it that she doesn’t want to go or that she doesn’t want to leave you, two different things. Loads of kids don’t like leaving their mums but still ok when they are there.

My DD - age 9.5 - doesn't want to go to her dad's sometimes.

Sadly, I think she's recognised that she is not a priority with him.

I try to reassure her that mummy will be ok without her, in case that's a concern for her.

Pickups are also done straight from school so that I won't be there in case that unsettles her.

She is in a "feelings group" at school to encourage children to talk about emotions & help with regulating that.

I might consider buying her a basic phone so she can keep in touch with me from her dad's.

A few things... I think he treats her like she's younger than she is. She's an intelligent, able girl, but he still cleans her teeth for her (which she hates), and thinks she shouldn't know about things like dating (as in me dating, not her!) and the cost of living crisis. These are all things that I have discussed with her in an age appropriate way as and when the moment arises, like if she asks me. He's very controlling, and I think this has something to do with why he treats her this way. And it may also be that he has no experience with dealing with girls of this age, whereas I do (as a woman) and I'm also a teacher.

I also think he deals out the Spanish Inquisition every time she is there. He is constantly (according to her) asking her if I have a boyfriend. He always has an opinion about things I say and do, and things I let the girls do (such as I showed the 10yo a cool Stranger Things clip (nothing too scary!) and he is convinced that I have let her watch the whole series, which I haven't). I think it makes her uncomfortable.

And then there's the issues she has had with his girlfriend. She has said in the past that she doesn't think the gf likes her, and this was due to some discipline issues, during which DD is convinced that the gf lied to her dad about something she (DD) did. According to DD, everything is ok in that area now, though.

With all these things, I always simply listen and I don't pass judgement; I only offer advice if she wants it. If I think I can speak to him about an issue without him turning it around on me or turning on her, then I do - but that's pretty rare.

If her father actually spends time with her when she visits, then it is just a phrase. My DP has been through it and so have lots of separated parents we know. It happens around puberty.

Unfortunately due to her father not listening to her it can't be resolved.

The way to resolve it is to allow her to say she doesn't want to visit him and both of you, her parents, accept it without question. After up to 12 months of doing this - lots of children take less time - they happily go back to their arrangement of seeing their other parent.

As her father is uncooperative I would suppose you would need to get legal advice to confirm whether your 10 is now old enough to say how she wants her arrangements for contact to go. (Shame she isn't a year older.)

If she is old enough then it would be worth getting the solicitor to write him a letter to remind him that contact is for the benefit of the child and she is now old enough to decline seeing him even though you have been encouraging her to see him.

Just keep sending your 6 year old to see her father as per your arrangement.

The last 2 parts are to make it difficult for him if he asks for permission to apply to Court.

I think you have to make it very clear to her that you will support her however you can, but you absolutely HAVE to know exactly why she hates going so much so that you can do this. Maybe she could write it down for you and I guess there is the possibility you'll need to go back to court and have it made official

That's really interesting; I had no idea that this sort of thing happens around puberty. So it possible that there is nothing bothering her, and it's just a phase? I didn't consider that because she's always been so resilient, and this has been the arrangement since she was 5, and she's never had a problem with it.

I'd ask EXH if he would like you to delve deeper (obvs you already have), but that he and you need to be prepared for some truths that you both may have to change to make dd more comfortable in

Oops

In his home. Clearly there are good reasons why she doesn't enjoy it, but presenting it ahead to him that he needs to want to make things better for her.

If hebdoesnt go with this suggestion, and isn't interested in any constructive criticism then Id say that she's old enough to visit at her leisure.

Then, if he does say he wants feedback, tell him. The teeth thing is ridiculous, hod give her some bloody privacy! And hounding her about you is tantamount to bullying - I'd feedback what she's said on those, as things for him to work on to make his child more confortable there.

Ask the school to monitor how she feels on dads pick up days if she is still upset then clearly there is something wrong and if he does take you back to court they will be able to support the facts that there is an issue its NOT just you

That's really interesting; I had no idea that this sort of thing happens around puberty.

OP most parents don't until they talk to other parents who are/have been the same situation.

So it possible that there is nothing bothering her, and it's just a phase?

Yep. She is trying to assert some control over her life. She is at the point where her peers start being more important then her parents.

I didn't consider that because she's always been so resilient, and this has been the arrangement since she was 5, and she's never had a problem with it.

She is still resilient she is just not 5 anymore. She needs to be encouraged rather than forced to do things. (Even if that encouragement includes doing boring things like shopping, housework, errands, etc on the weekends she should be with her dad.)

As I said in my next post as her father won't listen you need to get legal advice to see if she is old enough to decide not to visit even though you are encouraging her and her sister will continue to go.

If DD doesn't want to go to her father's, it would be cruel to make her. Just stop making her go or she is likely to suffer with her MH. Father can apply back to the Court, social workers will interview dd, and make a recommendation to the Court dependent on what dd has said. You'll have to stand by your dad. No one else is!

My daughter is the same, but luckily we don’t have a child arrangement order as far as I’m concerned if my child doesn’t want to go then she doesn’t have to. I am very surprised at the court not taking your child’s wishes into account, I would go back to the court and explain that your child does not want to spend 40% of her time with him. She is 10 not two and should be given a say in how much time she spends with him.

Have you also explained this to him? I would make it clear to him that she doesn’t want to go when she’s there. It would also be helpful to get to the bottom of it. Does he leave at home all day and she’s bored? Or is it something else or someone else she doesn’t like ? How is he with her? Is he kind to her? you need to ask these questions