Clean break - no child maintenance

[LegoCity2021]

Does any one have any info or experience with opting to split assets more heavily in favour of the resident parent and agreeing there will be no child maintenance payments (instead of starting with a 50/50 split and child maintenance payments from the non resident parent to the resident parent) ?

Is this what a "clean break" means ?

Not sure whether this is a good or bad idea.

That is not what a ‘clean break’ means.

I do not know if a parent can legally refuse liability for child maintenance although some certainly get away with non payment of their liabilities.

I would imagine that, if it were possible at all, it would require a watertight legal agreement, perhaps written as advance payment of child maintenance?

I am not a solicitor. You really would need proper legal advice for this.

You do need a solicitor. Even a couple of free appointments with different ones.
It's not set in stone that assets get split 50/50 for a start.
Child maintenance should be settled, as should contact arrangements.
Pensions and other financial assets need to be considered.

You can agree to more of the asset in return for no child payments in Scotland. Not sure where you are op or if this can be agreed elsewhere

I'm not in Scotland @77wasmyyear. I'm probably going to wish I was though...

For various reasons, the biggest of which is a predictably stressful nightmare of a post divorce financial scenario with stbxh if I can ever get our divorce to the finish line, I'd rather consolidate things financially for the kids (and indirectly therefore for myself) instead of ending up very bitter by being messed about over child maintenance in the coming years.

That way if he wants to "go and find myself by travelling the world before I'm too old to enjoy it" he can do, but not at the expense of paying child maintenance for our increasingly expensive teenagers.

It's almost like he's just letting me know in advance that he intends to have no income from which to pay any child maintenance.

I am engaging a solicitor but from what I've seen so far in these provincial parts there's no concept of anything like requesting a bigger share of assets despite my info that he's planning on not paying any CM (by not working).

I've been told that splitting the assets comes down to what each partner needs, which I do understand, but none of the kids are keen to spend overnights with stbxh despite him telling me he'll be needing a matching 4 bed house if I'm planning on staying in the 4 bed family home.

A friend of mine did a complete and final split of everything with no monthly payments.
She, like you, did not want to have child maintainance on the table, dealing with him about the day to day, and the possibility of being jerked around.
She worked out a lump sum of child maintaince payable in advance, with a discount if he agreed/paid at time of divorce. etc. His work is very travel orientated so she had the flexibily that he would need as a negotiating tool. (Use his desire to fuck off and find himself as a clever negotiating tool. ).

There were some tax implications I think but it meant a clean break, and she was able to invest the money, and (crutially) plan financially.
I must add that she worked out the financial offer with an accountant (not a solicitor), it was not crazy expensive and was really worth the money. The whole thing was very smart I thought.

Similar reasons to why we agreed to it Hope it's possible for you. It's worked out well for us both

Clean break means no ongoing spousal support. Child support is government mandated and I don't know if you can legally opt out. Hard to say if its worth making an agreement like that without knowing the figures involved, equity in property and pensions particularly, and also how old the children. But if the children are teens and don't want overnights he'll have a hard time justifying his 'need' for a large house in Court.

Can you get him to put it in writhing.
Then you can show it as evidence.
It should be split 60/40 or 70/30 to you.
Remember often the Pensions are worth as much as the house, it could be worth taking it as house vue, if you think he will stiff you.

I don't think you can opt out of child maintenance legally (fairly certain of this).

It is compensation for the extra time one parent spends with their child. You cannot do a 'clean' break and then not pay for your child. In addition, child maintenance adjusts with the time spent with the child. So, for instance, if a teenager elected to spend more time with one parent than in the original agreement, the child maintenance payment would adjust.

How would it work if the parent with more time lost all their money, for instance?

Yes, I did this, my youngest was 16 though and I got a lump sum in consolidated maintenance as I simply didn't want to have to see whether he would pay each month and he is an abusive dickhead who dragged the divorce out for 5 years! However, I also had it written into the Order than if she goes to Uni then I can go back to Court to request further contributions from him towards that.

English and Welsh courts have no power over child maintenance. That’s all the CMS. Parties do agree between themselves that they won’t go down the CMS route.You don’t have to have a court order for child maintenance.

Clean breaks means no ongoing spousal Maintenance or ability to come back an vary an order (s1A bar).

I should add this is on presumption parties both residing in England and Wales, different rules if one party out of jurisdiction
.

I'd love him to put it in writing @Bollindger - he won't even respond to the solicitor/petition at the moment.

I suspect I'm in for a protracted battle involving courts and solicitors swallowing plenty of our joint funds so that he can make a point/stand on principle/refute the unreasonable behaviour etc etc.

@77wasmyyear - how did you do the sums regarding the value of the foregone child maintenance ? Was an accountant involved ?

Paying tax on the up front maintenance value seems a little unfair compared to not being taxable income when received monthly @CanIPleaseHaveOne

You need a SHL, sounds like.

are you in Scotland @redastherose ?

Thanks @FlowersinJune

Yes, @BlackIsQueen but how does one find a SHL willing to try and protect the kids and I financially as much as possible instead of just taking us through the divorce procedure like a bog standard solicitor.

I've made sacrifices over the years which have more than helped put us in a good financial position heading towards university years (kids) then retirement (us) and stbxh seems intent on trashing everything.

Despite us always both working full-time, my earning capacity/job opportunities were compromised by being the default/go to parent for anything children related, enabling stbxh to progress career wise and now it seems he prefers not working at all.

If I'm still working and he's still not working post divorce I'll maybe end up paying him CM in respect of any nights the dc might spend with him (although I really can't see them wanting to even if he does want them overnight).

@LegoCity2021 if children spend 50/50 with parents then no child maintenance will be awarded either way. Anything over 50 per cent then the parent who has the kids gets child maintenance. So say if kids did every other weekend with your ex then you would still get child maintenance it would just be reduced for the 2 nights he was with them. You wouldn’t have to give him money for 2 nights.

I think it sounds like you are more worried you’ll have to pay him spousal maintenance as he is choosing not to work. Spousal maintenance is becoming increasingly uncommon and is really for only the very wealthy/young children. You can choose not to work, but courts will expect you to (that works both ways) .

Why don’t you give an indication of where you are in the country and guarantee MNs can give some good recommendations.

There is a poster on here called pollyandherdollies or something, she has a long running post in relationships - her solicitor sounds exactly what you need. Hang on let me see if I can work out how to tag her

At the moment it'll be 100% of nights with me and just a weekend day with him, assuming he stays in the local area initially.

Paying him spousal maintenance hadn't even crossed my mind, I certainly hope it hadn't crossed his

@StuckInPollyannaMode

A lot of this is going to depend on why he doesn't work.

If you made a joint decision for him to be a stay at home parent, or if he has a chronic illness, the court may actually find that he needs more than 50% of the assets in order to support himself.

Why doesn't he have a job?

Lawyer sorted it all out so I don't know how it worked tax wise etc We just agreed percentage of the house in exchange for no maintenance. I don't think enough money was involved for tax we aren't high earners

@AndSoFinally

"Despite us always both working full-time, my earning capacity/job opportunities were compromised by being the default/go to parent for anything children related, enabling stbxh to progress career wise and now it seems he prefers not working at all."

He's been the higher earner in the family by a long way for many years Covid19 eventually resulted in him being made redundant and he hasn't been inclined to look for any work since then.
I work full time and do 90% of domestic responsibilities and 100% of child-related responsibilities.

Then arrangement you describe is something that Some separating couples agree between them. It is fairly high trust agreement because it won’t remove an ongoing liability on behalf of the non resident parent for CMS at some point in the future.

You could pay an awful lot to the fabled SHL to argue this in court but all he needs is a half decent one to argue it down.

The contention you need to be making is that he can work and is choosing not to. That being the case the split should be based on what he could earn.

At some point he will take legal advice that will put him straight. If he is willing to listen to it. If he isn’t then he will make an idiot of himself in court at a great deal of expense.