Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Flip

1 2

Original poster

What age can a child choose not to see her father?

50 replies

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 23/08/2019 18:35

DD is 16, have been divorced from her dad for over 8 years. I left him because he was controlling and manipulative. I've always thought he was a relatively good dad despite his faults but this week I called her when she was there and they were having a screaming row. Last night she broke down in tears and basically said that he treats her like crap. Exactly the way he used to treat me. Constantly tells her she's disrespectful and ungrateful for all he does for her (which is basically fuck all as she lives off ready meals when she's there and does all of her own washing and most of his). She said she can't wait for the day she doesn't have to see him again. I can't stand to think of her being unhappy when she's there. I've tried calling him out on his behaviour in the past but he doesn't listen. He's one of those who is never wrong about anything. I really don't know what to do - if I had my way he'd never see her again. She's there 3 nights a week just now. I don't know whether at the age of 16 she can decide for herself with no involvement from the courts?

OP posts:

RandomMess · 24/08/2019 09:30

He can't force her to attend a private 6th form, if she went elsewhere he would have to take it to court. As a parent I didn't sign anything for mine to attend state 6th form.

You could speak to 6th form and ask what bursaries they could offer if he stopped paying. Have you signed a fee contract or would it be him they went after?

Give your DD the choice state school and she never has to stay again or at best she can reduce contact through various excuses/reasons...

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 24/08/2019 09:38

The fee agreement is with him. I don't think he would stop paying but I wouldn't like to risk it. I think I'll go for reduced contact to start with but I want her to get a job first so that we have an excuse as he won't be happy.

OP posts:

NotBeingRobbed · 24/08/2019 09:45

Well he wanted the private 6th form so he’d better pay for it. At this age the choice should just as much be made by the young person!

RandomMess · 24/08/2019 09:52

If it all kicks off about school during the year then she can start elsewhere in a years time so please be honest with your DD about her options.

Personally I would be empowering her to have choices and if going makes her that unhappy then I would be supporting her to reduce contact without their needing to be an excuse. He is controlling her and you are inadvertently setting her up to subconsciously choose a controlling partner and always appease the men in her life...

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 26/08/2019 13:35

Update: had a long chat with her and have decided to go for reduced contact. Texted him about an hour ago to say she would no longer be going to his on X day. Now feel sick waiting for him to kick off.

OP posts:

RandomMess · 26/08/2019 15:52

Well if kicks off you can simply state "if you carry on like this DD will refuse to see you at all"

Is DD prepared to go to state school if need be?

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 26/08/2019 15:58

He's just replied to say that he'll speak to her about it when he sees her. Which means he'll try and bully her into changing her mind.

I hope it doesn't come to that re the school but we'll see.

OP posts:

RandomMess · 26/08/2019 16:03

I would just turn around and say "No, she is too afraid to discuss it with you. It is her decision, if you push her further are you prepared to risk her not seeing you at all?"

You need to be her advocate and protector against her bully....

RandomMess · 26/08/2019 16:04

She holds all the cards he wants her there...

FamilyOfAliens · 26/08/2019 16:05

When is she next due to see him, OP?

How about she sends him a letter or email before she goes, explaining how she feels, so that he doesn’t get the opportunity to talk over her or stop her from saying everything she wants to?

avocadoincident · 26/08/2019 16:11

I hope she's prepared and strong enough to face seeing him. X

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 26/08/2019 16:19

She's due there Thursday. Good idea re the email.

OP posts:

RandomMess · 26/08/2019 16:22

I think email is a fantastic idea, get his bullying nastiness in writing

She could put that she wants it sorted before she next sees him and she definitely only wants to see him x and y and she's old enough to make that choice as she isn't 7 (it however old) anymore and she can phone him whenever she wants to chat..

Drum2018 · 26/08/2019 16:23

I don't like the sound of that tbh. The next time he sees her shouldn't be confrontational with her alone with him, and it sounds as though he may well bully her. Does she always go to his house? Maybe she could meet up in a cafe next time instead. He will probably try to blame you for putting ideas in her head but she needs to make him aware of the things that he does. Perhaps writing it all down in an email as suggested, or on paper to hand to him at next meeting, will help as he can just talk over her if she tries to explain in person. Poor girl, it's not fair, but at least you can reassure her that she really doesn't have to see him at all if she doesn't want to.

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 26/08/2019 16:35

I know, I don't like the sound of it either. I've also texted his girlfriend to try and get her to talk to him. He apparently upset her 11yo son on holiday so she knows he can be a bully. She made a comment to DD recently about her always being there for her even if she's not with him any more, which makes me think his days with her are numbered.

OP posts:

Drum2018 · 26/08/2019 16:48

While your ex thinks he may have the upper hand, it's your dd who actually has now. If he doesn't play his cards right and treat her with nothing but respect, he will have risked his entire relationship with her. Sounds like he's just an abusive bully all round and your dd may well be better off without him in her life. She needs to know that she'll be doing nothing wrong by reducing/cutting contact and any feelings of guilt she may have for not wanting to see him are normal. He may well try to manipulate her into continuing this dysfunctional relationship, but hopefully she will be strong enough to stand up for herself and what she wants. Maybe some counselling would help her to see things more clearly - recognise his bullying tactics and learn how to call him out on them. That's if she even wants to continue seeing him.

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 26/08/2019 21:04

The problem is I think he's so far in her head that he will make her feel guilty. He takes her on expensive holidays and basically throws money at her in an attempt to cover up his shortfalls. And then calls her ungrateful if she's not kissing his feet and thanking him for everything he does.

I had to tell her as part of the conversation the other night that he used to push me around and punch me when we argued. She was devastated. But I want her to know what he's capable of. I hope to god he never touches her as I won't be responsible for my actions.

OP posts:

RandomMess · 26/08/2019 21:39

You need to educate your DD on financial and coercive control fast. Can you speak to WA or research to find material to properly work through this with her?

She is highly likely to walk into an abusive relationship because of the dynamic she has with him, she will subconsciously seek to replicate it...

Ali86 · 26/08/2019 21:56

Sounds as if this has moved on a bit from your original question but just to be very clear on the answer to that in case anyone else is looking in the future.

Courts don't make child arrangements orders for 16 year olds unless the circumstances are exceptional. Once you get to 16 this goes beyond just listening to children's views, the legislation specifically says that the order can't be made except in exceptional circumstances Children Act section 9 If you look at the bottom of that page in section 9(7) it says:

'No court shall make any section 8 order [i.e. this includes child arrangements orders]... with respect to a child who has reached the age of sixteen unless it is satisfied that the circumstances of the case are exceptional.'

So if he tried to go to court he'd get nowhere. Even if the court had made an order it would probably have ended now anyway:

section 9(6) 'No court shall make a section 8 order which will end after the child has reached the age of sixteen unless it is satisfied that the circumstances of the case are exceptional.'

So she is fine on that.

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 27/08/2019 09:52

Thanks @Ali86, good to know where I stand.

OP posts:

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 30/08/2019 07:16

Quick update for anyone who gave me advice and is interested. DD had the conversation with her dad last night (v proud of her, she handled it well) and he apologised and asked her to give him a chance to change. So she said she'd give him a couple of weeks and if nothing changes she's cutting contact.

Slightly cynical as I don't think people really change but maybe he's had a wake up call.

OP posts:

Ali86 · 30/08/2019 16:25

Well done to you DD, sounds as if she handled it really well. Hope that he realises that he has to work at the relationship.

Original poster

chocolatesaltyballs22 · 30/08/2019 16:39

I hope so too but the cynical side of me gives him a week, tops, before he goes back to being a twat!

OP posts:

SoUnsettled2 · 03/09/2019 08:43

She needs to stop contact. I stopped going to my dads at 13. He’d spend the entire weekend sat in the local pub with me sat outside with a packet of crisps and a couple of glasses of lemonade! No relationship there at all! He died when I was 26 and I found out from someone in the town centre - the lady he lived with didn’t bother telling me or my brothers! He left a little money in his will for me but I instructed the solicitor to give it to her. It has not been money I wanted!!

FenellaVelour · 03/09/2019 20:12

At 16, the courts won’t be interested. It’ll be very much down to her what time she wants to spend with her dad.

Flip

1 2

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

Join Mumsnet Log In

This thread is closed and is no longer accepting replies. Click here to start a new thread.

Swipe left for the next trending thread