Is it totally irresponsible to get divorced just because life isn't fun?

[quickquestionplease]

Sounds ridiculous, doesn't it? But my life is not fun. I used to be fun to be around and am not anymore. DH used to go out, see friends, have a life outside the two of us and so did I. He is depressed and has not been out socially for years. It is not that he particularly wants to spend time with me, it is just that he does not care about seeing friends or doing anything fun anymore.

I am so unhappy. But he tells me that I am lucky, that other men go out to the pub every night. I have tried to explain that there is a balance. I WANT him to go out. I want some time to myself, and I want to think that he is enjoying himself. It is draining being his only point of contact outside work. He says he doesn't feel like going out because he works so hard but I don't think it is true, I think he just doesn't care. If I go out, maybe once a fortnight and see friends, he points out that he is always at home with DC. As far as I can see, this is a choice he makes.

We have DC. So is it totally selfish and irresponsible to divorce just because I want my life to be fun? And I know that when you have children your priorities change, but I want to be with someone who can enjoy themselves, not just having fun myself.

If that's your only reason, then yes, it is selfish and irresponsible.

But I think you need to think more about your situation, either via counselling or self help programme; I recommend 7 habits by Stephen Covey, or some other way of examining your life, ie. meditation, prayer, goal setting or career focussing. It may be that living with you DH's depression means that the best way forward for you is divorce, but you need to put some work into where you are now.

Bumping because although my post is obviously what I think, it might help if you get some more advice.

Hope you're OK OP.

I don't think that wanting your life to be fun is such a bad thing, but perhaps rather than seeing the situation as either "stay married = no fun / divorce = fun" you need to work on the 'fun' part first and see what happens with the marriage (from a totally selfish POV you'll have a better chance of getting out and doing stuff on your own with DH at home to look after the DCs )

You may find that if your own life is more fulfilling you can accept DH being a home-body or he might be persuaded to join you for some fun. If you fill your life with exciting stuff and it pushes you further apart, then you can look at separating.

Either way, if you're not happy with life as it is, then yes, you have every right to change it and if DH won't help you and is holding you back you don't have to put up with it, but I'd see that as a last resort.

A close friend of mine went through exactly this.

It turned out that her husband was actually seriously ill. Once he was diagnosed and treated, things got a lot better.

Not saying this is true in your case, but have you considered that he might be clinically depressed, or have some other problem?

Thanks for the advice.

By 'fun' I mean seeing people. This could be a drink, meal, cuppa at their house, whatever. I don't mean I am out til all hours.

He doesn't like me going out, he complains about being stuck in with the DC. But if I bring DC with me, I am getting no time to myself. He doesn't want to come with me, to go out as a family.

I don't even need to go out, people are perfectly willing to come to me, but he doesn't like having people over. I feel isolated and stuck. I am the only person he talks to outside work, and everything he talks about is negative. Part of it is that I wish he had someone else to unload onto.

Also, I think if he had friends that he would not be so negative, talking to other people is what gives me perspective and he doesn't have this. If I make suggestions they are brushed aside because I don't understand.

I have tried lots of ways of doing things, going out when he gets in from work for an hour so I can be home for DC bedtime, but then he hsa no time to unwind. I have tried going out after DC bedtime but then he has to deal with them if they wake. If I do go out, the house is spotless before I go and dinner is made for everyone. But still I am made to feel guilty. But then maybe I am supposed to feel guilty, I know some people who never go out, but this is what I was like before we were married and so was he, and I did not expect it to change so much.

I realise this sounds like I expected DC not to change anything and that is not it, it is just that I can't understand what is wrong with having a couple of hours to myself to catch up with friends once a fortnight. Am I living in fantasy land? Should I just accept that other social relationships are over and I should only be devoted to DH and DC?

He is depressed but will not take ADs or have counselling. He does not think it is that bad. And it is very hard to explain to him that it is that bad because the points I make are the ones listed here, and it comes down to (how he hears it) 'I want to go out more and you don't and I don't like it'. He argues this is me being selfish and I think partly it is. It is deciding if I am selfish enough to leave him over it, whether other people and a life outside the two of us is that important to me. And it is incredibly selfish.

But yes, it does come down to fun. I don't care if I have fun going out or staying in. I just want to smile and laugh sometimes.

I think your problem is his depression then. Can you put a rocket up his arse to deal with it?

He sounds incredibly wearing to live with and I don't blame you, frankly, for considering how nice your life would be without him. I would seriously consider saying 'treat your depression or I leave'. Life is short.

Your post sounds frivolous and would usually have an instant - get a grip, life isn't always fun.

Your further explanation reveals a far, far deeper problem that has nothing to do with fun. Of course social relationships are incredibly important. You and your DH and especially your DCs cannot live in a bubble, isolated from laughter and spontenaity. It might work for some people, but the way you describe it it makes it sound more like a prison sentance than a marriage!

I think your life should be as happy as possible. It doesn't sound like either of your lives are approaching happy. You need to impress on him the need for counselling urgently, because I think if this carries on, you have every right to think of your own mental health, and more importantly - those of your children. A house without fun is not a good place to bring up children. Yes, stability is important but so is laughter.

He might, of course, be incredibly boring and wearing even without the depression, but it's probably worth seeing if he improves with treatment.

Also you can't live isolated like this - it's not mentally (or indeed physically) good for you not to have a social network of your own.

In conclusion - no, it's not irresponsible. The only mistake you are making is trivialising it by putting your problems down to 'fun'!

I hope you can find a way to get him to see sense.

Actually re-reading your post, I think he is being quite cruel to you. He is forcing you to stay in and cutting you off from your friends. I think you should ditch the guilt and go out anyway. He is behaving very badly, depression or not.

lambeth Would it be worth going to counselling on my own? He won't come so I haven't seen the point. Also, is it expensive? I thought he might be able to get referred through the GP for his because it is linked to depression but assumed I would have to pay for couples/my own counselling?

I even worry about what a counsellor would think of me, I am so ashamed to feel like this. 'I want to go out more, I want me time' is what it boils down to and I am ashamed of that but it is how I feel. I have ignored it for so long, have tried not going out at all, have tried going out despite the guilt, so I know that I can live with it.

I think you are feeling like this because he has made you feel like this. It is not normal, IMO to live in this weird bubble of domesticity. (My parents did but then my father is, well, not madly normal.)

FWIW my partner and I have separate friends, and separate things we do, and that makes us happy and nicer people to be with.

It's perfectly reasonable to expect to socialise with others and have people over to yours!

We are social creatures and I'm not suprised you aren't enjoying life much if you are not able to socialise or are made to feel bad about it.

Why not have an honest talk to your dh and let him know what you want and how important it is to you. If he feels he cannot accommodate your reasonable requests then yes your relationship is in trouble.

As for who is being selfish here, it is of course hard to be depressed. But it is also hard for your wife and children when you are depressed. If he will not go for counselling or take meds then how exactly is he planning on dealing with his depression?

QuickQuestion - you are boiling it down again to making it sound trivial. It's not a trivial problem.

Your problem is - my DH thinks it is acceptable through blackmail to isolate me and my DCs from any social contacts.

Frankly, your problem would terrify me. I NEED to see other people, several times a week. You can't get all you need from one other person. You could go to counselling alone, that would be a good start.
This is the first time I've ever said this, but I would seriously consider whether this marriage has a future. That's how serious I think your problem is.

If you've tried suggesting DH sort out his own problems and he's not willing then you have to disengage and decide to live your own life regardless of how he tries to make you feel.

This is the best advice I've been given on here - all the 'leave the bastard' comments are well-meaning, but when you're wavering it is hard to see it as that black & white. By deciding to live your own life without the permanent upheaval of divorce, you can 'try on' the single life to see if it fits you, before opting for it as a definite plan.

I have tried going out after DC bedtime but then he has to deal with them if they wake. If I do go out, the house is spotless before I go and dinner is made for everyone. But still I am made to feel guilty. But then maybe I am supposed to feel guilty

Don't accept the guilt - he can only make you feel guilty if you let him. You need to convince yourself that you have nothing to feel guilty about (I know this is hard!).

Explain that they are his DCs and that he has a responsibility to care for them occasionally, that you are a sociable outgoing person who is craving some adult contact and that you will be going out with your friends on xxday for a chat and a drink.

He is of course welcome to arrange his own time out of the house another evening (and you strongly encourage that he does) in the interests of fairness, but you won't accept that neither of you should have a social life whether separately or together, because that is his choice not yours.

Living with men like this, we lose ourselves. You need time away from him (physically and mentally, as his opinions follow you wherever you go, don't they?!) to recharge, find out who you are and believe that you deserve to be happy. Good luck x

He won't see a GP/counsellor because he doesn't accept that he is depressed, accepting that would be admitting weakness/failure. If he doesn't accept his own depression does he acknowledge how unhappy you may be ?

You are losing your zest for life.

None of this makes for a a truly happy home life for your dc as, bad as it is now, it will get worse the longer you suffer it.

You could martyr yourself, accept it and wait for your reward in the afterlife or I'm afraid the alternative is issuing an ultimatum and acting on it. He'll paint you as unrealistic in your expectations as to do otherwise would be to be to accept that he does have a problem. Have you spoekn to his parents at all ?

If you think you are losing your sanity, a counselling session may be useful to re-establish what is normal/acceptable to you.

qqp counselling for just you would definitely be worth it. Can you do some reading as well? I've found a few 'philosophies' really helpful- where do your interests lie? Political, spiritual, self help?

I'm so sorry you are going through this. I have been feeling very similar having married a wonderful man, but someone who unlike your DH has never had much of a need for socialising. This never bothered me while we were in the 'nesting and settling down' phase of our lives, but it does now. I've changed, hugely affected by the loss of my Mum when she was just aged 56. Ive realised how short life is and I want to be happy and have fun. DH has been depressed for the last 4 yrs and wouldn't do anything about it. It was work related and things have now changed and his depression has lifted but its done so much damage. I'm questioning our entire relationship and most definately wavering for similar reasons you have mentioned. What I am doing right now is...

"when you're wavering it is hard to see it as that black & white. By deciding to live your own life without the permanent upheaval of divorce, you can 'try on' the single life to see if it fits you, before opting for it as a definite plan."

...and sadly it is making the idea of separating all the more appealing. But I'm really scared that in reality being a single parent with two children wouldn't be the fantasy life that I'm imagining.

Can I ask how things are on an intimacy / physical level between you both? I have posted about this today on the relationships board along the lines of 'Husband feels more like a brother'.

Gotta go rescue him from bath / bed hell with the littlies but will keep watching this thread.

My father had mental health problems for as long as I can remember.

My childhood was miserable because of it. He refused to co-operate with any attempts to help him.

I couldn't bring friends home, couldn't have a social life, was constantly anxious because of his unpredictable and unreasonable behaviour.

The damage to my confidence and my self esteem has been significant. I don't have any happy memories of my childhood. None at all. I used to wish that my mother would leave him, but she stuck by him, ruining her own life in the process.

Your comments about not being able to go out struck a chord with me. When DS was little (he's 12now) my DH would do the same thing. A vivd memory I have is one of him sat in the chair with a face like a slapped arse holding DS when I went out to a friends house for a couple of hours. I came home expecting them both to be in bed and there he was, still sat there, same face & DS bright red from crying. Apparently I 'left' him to cope and it wasn't fair... He got a blasting of the type he had never seen before. I don't think I have ever been so angry before or since!
He did try it when DD was a baby, called me when I was out on a rare night out complaining that she wouldn't take her feed & DS was acting up - he got told to cope. We now have 3, I don't go out very often, but when I do, he manages & the DC's love time alone with their Dad.
My point is that you can't back down over this. Depression or not he needs to be told, firmly and succintly that he needs to get help and let you have a life. You can't keep living like this, in the state he is in he'll drag you down too.