Advice on how to invoke POA

[ACatCalledPuss]

My Mum named me as her POA around 10 years ago. She was diagnosed with Alzheimer's 2 years ago and I think it is time that I invoked the POA as she is struggling to manage her finances. She gets really stressed when bills come in which results in lots of circular conversations. She doesn't have online banking or a cheque book therefore any bills which aren't direct debits end up being paid by me and I then have to get the money from her which is tricky because she needs everyone explained several times. Where do I go from here? Is the diagnosis from the consultant enough or does her GP need to assess her to determine whether she has capacity or not? She doesn't know/remember that she has Alzheimer's so will not be willing to relinquish financial control.

Does the POA state it can only be enacted if she looses mental capacity?

if it is unrestricted you can register it at anytime.

Go down to her bank with your POA documents and ask them how they handle activating it for your Mum’s accounts. Its usually helpful if you also have an account at that bank, so consider maybe opening one there too. Then just do what they say and then you can direct them to change the address on your Mums account to yourself and get online banking set up for yourself to manage the funds.

Then give her GP practice copies so they can include you on any health matters.

You can look on the website of each bank and they set out how to submit POA. You could also consider third party access?

If it's an ordinary LPA for finance there's no need for her to have lost capacity, or evidence that she's done so. Has it been registered? If not, do that. If so, just start using it.

If you have the legal document you just have to show it to people if you are dealing with them in person, so that’s a good starting point.

Thanks everyone. It hasn't been registered yet, I just have a copy of the document signed by mum and I and witnessed by the solicitor saying that she has nominated me as power of attorney. I guess I need to contact the solicitor to get it registered. Her solicitor mentioned they need to write to my siblings first to ensure there are no objections. I just wondered if medical proof was normally required? I don't know how to deal with this with my mum as she mostly insists there is nothing wrong with her memory and she can manage her finances fine.

@ACatCalledPuss as said above for a financial poa there is no need to have lost mental capacity or test for that before it can need used.

Who has the poa paperwork, if its all signed you can send it yourself. Does the financial section state whether it can be used anytime or when she loses capacity, if it's anytime you can use it as soon as it's registered and there are no objections, the opg write to your sister and ask if she has objections. Meanwhile could you take her to the bank to set up 3rd party access, explain you're waiting on poa, a capacity assessment from her GP or nurse will be useful.

My mum died two years ago but she had dementia and was in a care home as my dad couldn't look after her any more as she lost the ability to stand up or walk. My Dad was paying the care home fees but was running out of money so asked me to take over from my mum's current account with Nat West. Myself and my sisters already had POA for both our parents for health and welfare. Dad had sorted this some years before.
The point is I just made an appointment with my local Nat West and took the POA docs with me and my ID. They just added me to her account as a joint account holder and gave me a bank card in my name. I didn't have a Nat west account myself previously.
The process didn't take long. They didn't ask for evidence of dementia from a doctor. I think the fact that she had signed the POA in front of a solicitor was all the bank needed, as she had agreed to it then.

You can't invoke poa until it's been registered

So you did all the paperwork 10 years ago, but haven't registered it? I honestly don't know if that will be a problem. When you send the forms in, you should then get a letter from the Office of the Public Guardian confirming what it covers and asking if you object or have second thoughts. If you haven't had this, I'm afraid I'm not sure you have the POA. They could reasonably ask whether your mum has changed her mind since the time of signing the forms.

www.gov.uk/use-lasting-power-of-attorney

Are you sure it wasn't registered? It can take a few months. DFs took over 6 months and was finally expedited when we needed to use it.

Depends on the POA

if it’s LPA it can be registered and used at any time. Mil ended up in a financially abusive situation due to this as her attorney wouldn’t let her have access to her money, and the banks allowed it because of the POA.

if it’s an older EPA then they need to be assessed as lacking competency before it can be used.

You should have registered it at the time but there are steps you can take now to
get part way to taking control. The first thing is to take her to the post office to fill out a change of address form. That way all mail will come to you and you can take care of her appointments and bills. She will need to show I.D.

Next get her to t the bank. Get all her accounts changed into joint names. If they ask about PoA tell them she does not need it yet. Don’t say it’s applied for, as the busy body kicks in and they want you to jump through hoops, You can keep all the accounts as joint if you wish or add yourself in as PoA later.

As you start to deal with this you will find that you are asked for the same information over and over again. Quite often by the same person . Get a file ready for every time you make a phone call.
Name, address, DoB, DoM, NINumber and Nation Health number. Husband date of birth. Place of marriage.
Doctor details, list of prescription meds.
Note the time, date, name of the person you spoke to for EVERY phone call. Repeat back to them what they have promised

Contact AGE UK for their fact sheets. They are priceless

My parents gave my brother and I LPA and registered it in 2020. Just this week I have been to my dad's main bank and got things moving with them. (Barclays, they were fabulous by the way as I'd changed my name too since POA drawn up.) In England the POA has a number you can generate. POAs for finance can be used at anytime if that's the way they are set up. Depends which box is ticked but enduring POA are different.
My dad can do his finances but is getting slower and I'd hate him to lock himself out of his account. I saw bank Thursday and got email today saying card etc should be with me this week.

I think your best bet is to go back to the solicitor and find out why they didn't register the POA at the time with the Office for the Public Guardian. As that isn't the same as registering it with financial institutions and actually using it. Then I'd get it sent off pronto given that in my experience it takes a few months to be registered once sent off.
Good luck!

Is there a reason the POA wasn’t registered with the Office of Public Guardian when the paperwork was signed? Seems a bit strange, but once that’s been done you’ll need to book appointments with mums banks and register the POA with them. Some banks will do it over the phone, you’ll send a photo of the docs to them. Then they will send you a debit card, cheque book if needed etc. First step is getting it registered with the OPG and making sure the signed documents are still valid.

Hi, thanks everyone for your responses. Can I check if anyone is from NI as I think things are different here? My understanding is that when we signed the forms years ago,that was a precautionary measure which may never be needed. My grandmother had Alzheimer's which is why my mum was so keen to put in place the POA. I wanted to go down the third party authorisation process first so I could help mum pay bills. However when we went to her bank to discuss with them, she obviously went into some kind of panic mode and denied we had ever discussed it or that she had any memory issues and they couldn't do anything without her consent. I now don't think I have any other alternative and my siblings agree. I will phone the solicitor in the morning and start the ball rolling. I think they will then write to my siblings and my mum and give them the opportunity to object before it is lodged with the court.

I'm not in NI so don't know how it operates there. You can set up POA in England to come into force

. Immediately it's registered and confirmed, or
. When the person has lost capacity to manage their own affairs, later on

Either way though you have to register it with the Office of the Public Guardian and say which way you want it to work. Do you have the signed form still in your possession? Sorry but if you do I'm doubtful that you have POA right at this moment. I don't know how much of an issue the time between when your mum signed, and now, will be an issue. As you've said, the person and their attorney(s) should get letters from the OPG asking if you object. That is an option open to your mum 😬 I would ask a solicitor's advice about it all ASAP.

Check with solicitor why it wasn’t registered at the time, and whether those forms can now be used to register with OPG.

www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/managing-your-affairs-and-enduring-power-attorney
Mum and I are both NI but we live in England now

@ACatCalledPuss looks totally different in both setting it up and the process, as it often is in NI.
All of the above advice is English law as I have just activated ours even though mum is still perfectly capable.

I would telephone all the utility companies and get everything on direct debit

I bet they'll need doing again- another lot of solicitors fees