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Darkstroke books...are they a form of self-publishing or an indie press?

16 replies

blackrabbitwhiterabbit · 08/08/2020 13:38

I can't seem to work it out.
Thanks in advance.

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QuestionableMouse · 08/08/2020 13:39

Iirc they're a vanity press.

blackrabbitwhiterabbit · 08/08/2020 13:46

Thanks for reply.

I just returned to their site, and it says in bold "We are not a vanity press. You will not pay for our services."

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Witchend · 08/08/2020 16:52

I don't think they're totally vanity press, which to me implies you are paying to publish-however I think they're not doing anything that you couldn't do when self-publishing and then probably take a cut.

I suppose it slightly depends on whether they accept anything, or whether they're a bit picky (that's picky on the book not on your SM presence). If they are picky, then you may find that publishing through them gives a little bit of kudos if you submit later to traditional publishing.

blackrabbitwhiterabbit · 08/08/2020 17:49

Ok, thanks Witchend. You do have to submit and wait for them to make a decision on your work. I reckon I'll end up trying them once all my queries have failed!

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Witchend · 08/08/2020 17:55

It depends on whether the submission is basically a tool to make you think they're considering it carefully-like those children's writing competitions where you are thrilled to find your child is a winner until you find that 29/30 of the class are and it is just a ruse to get you to buy the book.

Or if it is a genuine look at book and consider it. Only way you can test that is by submitting some rubbish though. Grin

themental · 08/08/2020 18:36

I just had a look at the website and searched for some of their authors.

Honestly? Couldn't find a single one that indicated they were doing well.

Sales ranks in the millions in most cases.

A debut author who released two weeks ago in the 300ks, only five reviews which were ARCs (advanced review copies). That would suggest they've sold a handful of copies at best.

For comparison I also launched a brand new pen name two weeks ago and am still chilling in the top 1000 with 50+ reviews. It's not difficult if you understand marketing.

I guess it depends on what you are looking to get out of publishing? If you just want to be a published author then there is absolutely no harm in approaching them, as long as it's not going to cost you any money. Though honestly I can't see how they're staying in business if they're not charging authors (based on the sales ranks).

If you want to either sell books, or get people to read your books, I wouldn't hand my book over to them. It looks like they're not doing anything helpful on the marketing side, so all they are offering is the cover and editing which are the two easiest and cheapest parts of publishing and could easily be done by hiring freelance professionals yourself.

If I was looking for a publisher my priority would be ones who know their shit when it comes to marketing, and you can get a gauge of that by searching for their previous results.

blackrabbitwhiterabbit · 08/08/2020 20:42

Thanks very much, themental. I didn't think they did well in sales! I am just getting nowhere with querying (despite 3 full manuscript requests in the first 2 weeks) and I have no idea about marketing. I know you are on the self-publishing thread but I can't seem to make head nor tail of what you have to do!

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blackrabbitwhiterabbit · 08/08/2020 20:49

Sorry, meant to say, looks like they are affiliated with Amazon. So you get published by them and then do the usual selling (like self-published selling?) on Amazon?

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themental · 08/08/2020 22:43

Oh yeah I hadn't actually read their submissions page which seems to be where they hide all the small print.

"We offer publication exclusively to the Amazon network."

Not exactly a red flag but not really great either. Staying exclusive with Amazon has lots of benefits for a new author - mainly being that you can put your books in Kindle Unlimited, it's the biggest online retailer with the most traffic and a complex set of algorithms that actually wants to help you sell books, and you only have one customer base to market to (compared with multiple if you choose to 'go wide')

However.

Those same algorithms heavily favour authors who are getting books out every 30 days so it doesn't seem the best choice to put all your eggs in the Amazon basket if you're going the slower trad route.

It seems to me like the advantage of going with a publisher is getting into stores and outlets that just aren't available to most indie (be it self or small press) publishers? I.e if I got an agent I'd want to be in brick & mortar stores, I'd want to be in German, and I'd want them to be selling my audio rights etc.

But I could almost get over that if it wasn't for....

"You are in charge of the marketing and promotion. The process of publication, promotion, and marketing requires an understanding of and experience with social media."

So... they expect you to spend your own money to market your books in return for a fraction of a fraction of royalties Confused yep, avoid!!

It seems to me like their business model is based on throwing spaghetti at the wall and hoping some of it sticks. And some of it will stick, of course, because like I said Amazon wants to sell books. Lightning will strike for them every once in a while. They'll also have authors who do spend the money to promote because they want to do well and sell books, so they'll probably make enough to recoup their costs.

But please don't get involved with a 'publishing house' whose model is based on throwing spaghetti at the wall.

ALL THAT SAID

IF they prove to have some benefits that you personally think are important to you, and you couldn't afford yourself, then you might want to consider it a worthwhile sacrifice. For example, I have friends who did a little stint in trad publishing and they said there was one benefit and that was the team of developmental editors, line editors, copy editors etc. They've never replicated that model in their own business because it's a poor return on time / cost investment, but I imagine it's probably really useful to go through that whole process at least once.

Some other benefits might be working with a cover designer (if they allow you to have any input) a copywriter (again, if they have one and allow you to get involved in that process) and to start getting your name out there (although doubtful, just checked a lookinside on Amazon and all links are pointing to them, NOT the author).

I hope that helps in some way. Best of luck with landing an agent 🙏🏻!!

blackrabbitwhiterabbit · 09/08/2020 09:25

Thank you so very much for your time and level of input in your response. I shall leave them as a very very last resort!

Thanks again.

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GhoulGirl78 · 28/10/2020 09:05

Hey I’m a DarkStroke author and I can vouch for them, I’ve only had good experiences with them.

GhoulGirl78 · 28/10/2020 09:10

If you want any more info Rabbit, just let me know I’m happy to help! It’s often better to get info from someone who has experience of a specific publisher x

ProfessionalWeirdo · 28/10/2020 12:32

Darkstroke is an indie press - and a very good one at that.

Zilla1 · 28/10/2020 13:03

Hmmmm

Jessicathauthor · 30/10/2020 06:12

Hi! I just recently published with Darkstroke if you want answers from someone who has experienced their process.
(The highlights are that I've never paid them a dime and they have accepted 400ish manuscripts out of thousands of queries. The hardest part about working with them is the time difference 😏)

melanielowe1968 · 12/01/2022 14:15

Hi themental, interested by your knowledge of publishing/marketing. Do you recommend any 'hybrid' publishers, who actually offer a proper support package to writers?

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