Moving from UK to Ireland and back again.... any thoughts?

[haresegg]

Hello,

any thoughts/ experiences welcome!

I'm Irish, DH is English and we moved from UK to Ireland 7 years ago. DC were just in early primary/ starting school then. We moved for many reasons, such as being closer to family, the more traditional Irish childhood, less intense primary school system and DH has been able to earn much better here compared to UK due to a niche area.

Things have turned out well overall. The primary school system has been nice for DC, there have been positives to me being closer to family but my elderly DP has since passed away and I don't actually live that close to siblings so don't see them any more than when we lived in UK. Due to DH income here and buying a house when we did, we now have about £300k equity compared with about £10k when we moved here.

Why consider moving back? I think the secondary system will be more suited to one of our DC in particular, especially at A level as the secondary curriculum here is much broader and traditionally academic/ less modern. I haven't ended up being any closer really to my family through the move. Neither DH nor I feel we fit in all that well here in terms of community. Although we live close to Dublin, there is less to do here and we miss the huge variety of things going on that we would have in England, due to the much bigger population. Lastly, since we now have £300k in equity, we could buy a house outright in UK and be mortgage free and while we would both still work over there, we would not be under pressure to earn the maximum possible amount.

Can anyone who is still reading share their thoughts? I suppose when I go through pros and cons lists Ireland and the UK tend to come out almost perfectly equal but recently we have just felt a bit bored with Ireland.

Has anyone gone through something similar?

Just bumping to see if there’s anyone who has moved over and back who could offer perspectives! Or anyone else

Well, if you’re bored, you’re bored, surely? If your children are on board with the move, and there’s nothing stopping you, why not if the idea excites you? I suppose the other option is to move somewhere within Ireland that bores you less?

I’m Irish, lived in England for 25 years and returned in 2020 with (Irish) DH and UK-born DS, and would never consider living in England again. We loved London, where we lived for a decade, and often revisit, but the Midlands area we lived for the last eight years before we left was dull, insular and xenophobic, and the combination of that and Brexit soured us both on the place. Where we live now in Ireland is far more culturally-vibrant, interesting and diverse. So I suppose it depends where you would move back to? To where you used to live?

Ireland is small and can be dull. Maybe better now we can leave the island? I miss nipping to London for a weekend out.

I don't love the English education system and brought mine DC here to avoid secondary. I felt the 5 years in secondary to GCSEs was too long and saw so many kids disengage with education in that long haul. And A levels are too limited if your DC has a range of interests.
Plus as an expat kid myself moving early secondary was the worst socially. And then there is a theory that every school move reduces your final exam school exam results by grade. So don't move because you are bored, make sure it right for your DC.

We are in the process of making the move back. We’ve only been here a year and love it. Yes there are less things to do but I can’t help feel more at home here. Both DH and I are English but both my parents were Irish.

For us is mainly financial, right now we are living month to month. Currently our rent is over 5 times or uk mortgage payments, I don’t work so to get a mortgage here it would be based on DHs salary. We could not afford to buy in the area we live, even looking at cheaper areas we would be getting ourselves into a large mortgage that we will be paying off well into retirement years. Then factoring in health care costs, I have a number of health conditions that cost us a lot of money to treat.

Moving back will mean we have extra money each month and be able to pay our mortgage off in 10 years. The only downside for us is the bureaucracy surrounding school places in England, plus I’m not a major fan of the English school system in general. We are moving back with 3 primary aged children, if we leave it any longer our oldest will be in secondary school and I’d worry about the change in school systems which is why we decided to do it this year.

I really do want to stay, Ireland is a fantastic place to raise children, unfortunately it’s just to expensive.

I was interested to read your post. I agree with the other poster about looking into the boredom issue. What exactly are you bored of? Would the same not happen in the UK, as in, if you've been anywhere long enough life becomes humdrum? The grass is greener etc.
Also the schooling thing, I was Irish educated, as were so many successful friends and it never stopped us (I studied undergrad in the UK and not having had the depth of an A Level in my chosen uni subjects didn't make any difference). As other posters said, it's a bit disruptive for the kids to move again, but perhaps they're very young?
I find the UK very clogged! Guess it depends where you live. But the congestion (cars and people); Johnson and Brexit isn't a fun mix.
Just food for thought!

Being mortgage free or nearly is a no brainer. Gives such freedom and options to enjoy life regardless of country lived in.go for it.

I was the DC in this situation.
Parents split when I was a baby and mum moved back to Ireland to be closer to her family.
She moved us back to England when I was 13. I've never really decided if it was the right decision or not but she did it for a number of reasons.

What I will say from my perspective, it was a huge culture shock. English schools are very different. The children here seem a lot more forward when it comes to relationships, etc.

I went from all girl school's playing sports, having lots of friends, to an inner city co-ed high school. Where I barely spoke to anyone because I was the Irish kid and everyone just wanted to hear my accent. It really grated on me. I can't say I loved it. I was on track for brilliant grades in Ireland and just got by in my GCSE's.

Don't get me wrong, I have a lovely life now. Two beautiful DC and a wonderful husband. We are very happy so I'm glad we loved or I wouldn't have had this.

But I do broach the conversation with dh about us moving to Ireland because I do miss it. But I'm not sure it would be right for us now.

We moved back to Ireland in the early 90s.
I am Irish, H is English. We had one child then.
As soon as we got there we knew we had made a massive mistake!
Cost of housing, narrow minded relatives that we couldn't escape, catholic church still looming (althought less so now)etc.....
All in all we gave it three years and came back to England not long the birth of our second child...no regrets.
Breast feeding support was much better (and encouraged in England)
I can still hear the Public Health Nurse's voice '' would you not give that child a bottle''in my nightmares. She was anti breast feeding!!
My mum's sisters picking the baby up when she had just been put down for a nap!!
And those behaviours can happen anywhere and in any family, I know but my H's family were more respectful of our wishes and much more helpful.

Me and dh are both Irish but lived in Enland for ten years before moving home in 2016. I'll list the pros and cons of living in Ireland.

Pros - safer and better education for our daughter. I know a lot about this because I worked in the Ed system in the UK and currently work in it in Ireland. I worked in both private and comps in England. Private school is excellent but at 30 grand a year, out of our price range. Too many behaviour issues in comps in England to put it bluntly. I wouldn't feel comfortable sending my child to one.
Another pro is feeling like I fit in, whereas in England I was always on the outside. I found it easy to make Friends with other immigrants but while English people were generally friendly, I found it hard to make friends with them. Also prices in Ireland - while the cost of living is generally high, we've been able to buy a large family home an hour from O' Connell Street for a couple of hundred grand. That would have been out of reach where we were living in England. Lastly, it's nice living near the few family members that I can actually bear and go to nice places in the countryside, the Merrion for afternoon tea etc...
Cons - I miss the excellent public transport in the UK. Trains everywhere and OK, it was expensive, but at least you're never completely reliant on the car. I miss the vibrancy and fun of London and the endless possibilities. I miss the beautiful countryside in Essex and the fact that there's more freedom to ramble in England. Even though I found it hard to make friends, I did become close to some people and miss them very much. I grew to love the light side of England - it's beauty and unique character, away from any dark side like colonialism. The price of living in terms of food and clothes is lower in England too.

Those are just a few of my own musings. On balance the pros of Ireland win me over because at heart, I'm an Irish woman through and through and I want to be part of our nation.

Obviously these pros and cons are completely my subjective view but that's my 2 cents.

Angryalot, would you say the behavioural problem are worse in English state secondary are worse than in state secondaries in Ireland and if so, why?

Hi SoyMarina. Generally, yes. Now obviously there are schools in Ireland which are pretty rough, I'm not denying there aren't. But I think because the population of the UK is about 13 times bigger, you're dealing with big cohorts of children with incredibly diverse needs. Many of whom really need one to one rather than a classroom. Throw in the fact that UK teachers are drowning in paperwork and are overworked and stressed out. Also a system where the staff is always held responsible rather than the student and it's very hard to expel kids even when they're making the other kids' lives difficult. It's an impossible situation IMHO. I trained in the UK and worked there for ten years. I have also taught in Ireland for ten years.

I know what you mean, the Irish national schools are fantastic, but tbh, to do four A levels would suit my son so much better than to have to do 7 leaving cert subjects including English and another language. His brain just doesn't lean towards languages but he sits around drawing three -d shapes and drawing bridges and he loves chemistry and physics and maths but he will do terribly in the leaving cert because he will fail English and Spanish - argh!

Other thoughts, it gets harder to make new friends the older you get. When I went to the UK I was in my early 20s and I had friends very quickly, temping, house mates, but then, when I moved back to Ireland as a 37 year old single parent with two small dc, I found it much much harder to connect with people.

So I'd be scared to relocate again tbh, although it's different if you're married.

This might be a mad idea but what about a boarding school in NI that does A levels? For your child who would do better in the fewer subjects A level system.

I'm clearly less adventurous than you are (!) but at this point in my life having relocated twice, I wouldn't have the energy to move back to the UK for a second time.

I think Columba's secondary school in Dublin does A levels as well as LC. Not an option for me financially but if my son could choose Maths, Physics, Technical Graphic Design (or whatever they call it now), he'd get great results. Having to do 7 subjects when he hates 3 of them. it's not going to go well

That's so interesting Angryalot.
I agree with your point about students not being held accountable.
I have seen so many managed moves break down too and the school is saddled with the pupil again, spending lots on APs and getting no cooperation from the pupil or their family.
However, I mush prefer A Levels to the Leaving cert. It would have suited me much better too. To have been able to concentrate on 3 or even 4 subjects that I loved would have yielded better results.
All my children did well in their A Levels (State 6 th Forms) for those reasons.

@SoyMarina you raise interesting points. I've taught my subject at A level and again at leaving cert. A level is a slightly more intense dive into a subject and I can really see how it would suit kids who have a predilection for one group of subjects like science, for example. Both are good exam systems. My struggle as a teacher is trying to get all the material covered in the time frame!

Hi Op,

I've done the opposite to you. Lived in ireland, moved to SE England, met dh, had dc and recently moved to Northern Ireland. If schools are one of the driving forces then the Education system in NI is fantastic. Students here massively outperform other parts of UK at exam time, and there's lots of grammar schools. Dc school in England was pretty poor, although we lived in a lovely area. Lots of behavioural difficulties- kids throwing tables at each other and hitting teachers as an example. I've worked in lots of schools in London and the SE, and this is quite common.

My English dh loves it here in NI. Dc have flourished in every way. We also sold our house and we're able to buy a fab house in NI mortgage free. The thing I notice most is the pace of life, less traffic and you don't need to pre book everything as it's less populated. There's not much in England that you can't get here in terms of activities. Cost of living here much lower overall. Only thing I miss about SE England is the weather!

Might be worth thinking about NI.

I'm Irish, lived in the U.K. for 9 years and then moved back to Ireland. I don't understand the "there's not much to do comment" there's loads to do where we live and we are no where near Dublin. I'm way more relaxed here...earning potential is WAY better here for both of us! I love the Irish education system. I wouldn't move back for love nor money.
I love not having council tax and water bills too...AND we actually get child benefit here.

For me a major issue was extended family in Ireland. I couldn’t get used or or accept the way my mother’s sisters behaved and spoke.
They are not rude just very entitled.
I’ve just been back for a few days which although, very pleasant, kinda ruined by having to visit a few aunts who think it’s fine to comment and criticise my lifestyle….just as part of conversation.
Can’t be doing with it at all.