I fear the "craic" is gone from Ireland forever

[afternooncuppa]

Just that really. However, I would love to be told I'm wrong so would love to hear your views.

My parents are Irish living in England and I spent a lot of my childhood and youth there and still visited at least 4 times a year pre-Covid. To me, my heart belongs in Ireland and I was hoping to move there at some point. When I was younger (in my late teens/early twenties) my group of friends consisted of English, French, Spanish and Italian backgrounds and EVERY holiday they always wanted to go to Ireland because the "craic" was so great and could not be matched in their countries. Ireland had everything (apart from the weather) - music, life, bands, dancing, laughing, joking, wildness, patriotism, Guinness, more Guinness and CRAIC. Living and enjoying life to the full.

Now Covid has hit and although it has changed countries everywhere, I can't help but think that Irelands draconian reaction has destroyed the country beyond repair. Not only economically (as everywhere) but the very things they are famous for, the very soul of the place has gone. They seem hell-bent on zero-Covid (which is impossible) and are running the country into the ground to achieve this. My own healthy and young cousins are too scared to step outside the door due to the "deadly" virus (which it is not). I know wet pubs have been shut for about a year with many unlikely to re-open. I've heard of the staggeringly ridiculous actions of the Garda to prevent humans being humans and I despair.

St Patricks Day last week watching old videos on my phone in crowded bars with live music, drink flowing, dancing and craic made me want to cry at the loss of everything Ireland was and the fear it will never return.

Does anyone think it will ever come back?

saw this earlier and thought of this thread

I love the Dirt Birds.

@TheVeryThing

Love that @TheVeryThing

Spot on, very!

Glad you enjoyed it, maybe the craic isn't gone after all

Of course the restrictions are draconian. I believe some of the strictest and longest in the world, certainly in Europe. It’s funny (but not in a good way) how people in Ireland are disputing that.

Cop on. Do you get your news from Facebook or something?

France has a curfew from 6pm daily - not allowed outside your house until 6am. Spain, Netherlands and parts of Germany (federalised so different rules in different places) also have curfews.

Many, many countries have mandatory FFP2 masks in public places - none of your cloth marks, nose dangling face coverings, or plastic face shields allowed instead.

Belgium, Czechia and parts of France are back in hard lockdown again. Half of Italy has shut down again, including schools.

Portugal has been shut down since January, much like Ireland, just reopened primary schools a couple of weeks ago and is considering opening up secondary schools in mid April.

Parts of Greece with infection rates similar to Ireland have a 2km limit as well as hard lockdown.

Really, the only reason Ireland looks strict in a European context is when countries are compared on their national rules only, ignoring federal/regional rules. Ireland has consistent restrictions for the whole country because it's small. Bigger countries have different restrictions in different places, and some places have much stricter restrictions than Ireland.

But that's too much complexity and nuance for people who like to bleat about the draconian restrictions that are infringing on their human rights etc etc. Usually while nose dangling a mask if they're wearing one at all. 🙄

If you live in Dublin, you have been only legally allowed to leave for 6 days since last September. That’s draconian, and of course if it’s an infringement of constitutional rights - the only debate is whether it’s a proportionate and justifiable one. The country has been in level 5 lockdown since last October, with the exception of the 3 weeks at Christmas (insane timing)- one of the earliest countries to do so. It’s probably the October lockdown that I think least justifiable and which likely contributed to the mess that happened at Christmas. We were one of the last countries to open up last summer. In a lot of those countries with curfews, restaurants and shops are open during the day - I don’t think that’s more draconian than us and certainly better for business owners - where do we have to go after 6 anyway (admit that might just be me!)
I note a lot of countries are back in lockdown, but is it really preferable to stay in permanent lockdown?

So good @TheVeryThing!

There is nothing I love more than other people telling me how to be Irish.

the craic will never be gone out of Ireland as its not the pubs that make the craic, it the people. i do agree that the government have made an absolute balls of things here. i am in Leitrim where there are nearly no new cases in the last 14 days and i hear rumors' about the government shutting down the schools again, everywhere! it just doesn't make sense. i don't know how small business' will be able to open whenever all of this is over due to the amount of money the have lost, its a joke.

To the people who are saying that Ireland's response is not draconian - have you actually left Ireland during the Pandemic? How would you know, if you haven't?

I am Irish. I was in Ireland for Level 5 last year.
I left Ireland, when it went into level 3 in Autumn last year - we were allowed to leave at that time. It then went back into level 5 and it became illegal to travel.
I have been in three countries since then(working remotely). Ireland is having far, far more restrictions than most other countries.

In comparison,
When I was in Ireland last year, all restaurants and coffee shops were closed. It was mandatory to wear masks in shops.
Public transport was very limited.
We were told to stay within 5km.
We were told not to have people in our houses.

I first went to Mexico.
There - public transport was not limited in any way. There were no restrictions on movement- I could travel all over the country freelt. We did have to wear masks in shops. Restaurants and nightclubs and coffeebars were all completely open. We were allowed to have as many people in our house as we wanted. People were partying like normal in nightclubs. I spoke to many americans there, who told me that bars and restaurants were open in the States too.

Next I went to Sweden. It was even freer than Mexico. Everything was open, restaurants, coffee shops were all open. It is not required at all to wear masks anywhere. I saw no one wearing a mask. There is No restriction on movement. You can travel all over the country freely.

Now I am in Albania. Masks are not mandatory. I see a few people wearing them, but most people are not. All restaurants and coffee shops are completely open. I can go all over the country wherever I want.

Ireland IS having some of the strictest restrictions in the world. A recent study said that Ireland had the third strictest lockdown in the whole world.

Mawi - she is Irish. She said that both her parents are Irish.

@Sarahtrue

Mawi - she is Irish. She said that both her parents are Irish.

I'm not sure that the op is Irish.

None of my business though.

@IsFuzzyBeagMise well I think nationality is very fluid anyway. I don't think we are just from one country. Many of us have parents from different countries, and many people were born abroad to two full Irish parents.

I just don't like what I saw on this thread.

I have seen people born in Ireland, look down on people born abroad to two Irish parents, many, many times , and I think it is the nastiest thing ever.

@Sarahtrue I don't like that either and it isn't in my nature to look down on people. (In fact, I'm on the small side and generally looking up at people!)

I did reply up thread to the op and apologise if I caused offence.

@IsFuzzyBeagMise that is a nice post. I hope that you have a nice evening

And you too @Sarahtrue!

Just to reiterate:

Ireland IS having far more severe restrictions than most other countries. It is important that you know this. If you haven't left Ireland during the Pandemic- you won't know this!

I was in Ireland for part of the Pandemic, and I have been in other countries. Ireland had the most strict and severe restrictions by far. It had way way more restrictions than other countries. Ireland's reaction to the Pandemic is very strange. It is not like that in other countries. It has definitely shown me what a controlling government there is in Ireland.

And that people don't even know that Ireland is having far more severe restrictions than other countries is very scary!

It reminds me of a book I was reading by a woman who left North Korea. She said "we didn't know we were isolated, if you know you are isolated, you are not isolated".

If people in Ireland don't know that they are having far stricter and more severe restrictions than the rest of the world, they will go along with it.

Jesus Sarah give it a rest. Yes, I have left the country during the pandemic, more than once for work. And I also have friends and close family members living in several other countries where we have discussed the minutiae of various lockdowns. Stop assuming we're all holed-up insularists.

I've had friends in Hong Kong who weren't able to leave their apartment at all (with a young child) for 4 months. I had family in Spain who couldn't bring their children outdoors for 6 weeks. Others in France who have a 10 km travel limit and have to race home to make curfew every evening or face being fined. Another in Germany who has to spend 10 hours a day in a FFP2 mask, which has messed up her facial eczema quite badly, because she works in a public place (and she's not a healthcare worker). And one of the people I just mentioned has in-laws in Greece who are in a 2km limit that they can't even leave for food shopping.

Ireland's lockdown has been long, and hard on businesses in particular, but not the most strict on a personal level. Just because you have apparently been to some of the most lax countries in the world (I mean Sweden, seriously?) doesn't mean what's happening in Ireland is draconian by international standards, particularly when you look properly at regional rules and not just national rules (which tend to be minimal in large countries with federalist regions).

Take a wider perspective. And a deeper one.

@MarDhea don't tell me to give it a rest. The rudeness of you! What is wrong with you

@mardhea why are you so rude and aggressive? Are you able to talk to people with politeness? It is a good adult trait to learn. Try it.

Studies have shown that Ireland has had the third strictest lockdown in the world. So yes, Ireland is draconian by international standards.

I took exception to you repeating your assumption that the opinions of people on this thread were based on ignorance of what was happening in the world outside Ireland.

That assumption was far ruder than me telling you to give it a rest.

Why did you feel the need to post the same condescension a second time?

[quote Sarahtrue]@mardhea why are you so rude and aggressive? Are you able to talk to people with politeness? It is a good adult trait to learn. Try it.

Studies have shown that Ireland has had the third strictest lockdown in the world. So yes, Ireland is draconian by international standards.[/quote]

You think it's aggressive to disagree with you and counter your ill-informed opinions? Where the strongest thing I said was "give it a rest"?

Please.

You come across as very immature. In the nicest possible way, take a step back and grow up.

@MarDhea I was trying to help people in Ireland who haven't left during this time, and seem to be under the assumption that what they are going through is normal, in regard to the wider response. It isn't. I wanted to help people to see what was going on.

I just looked at the most recent statistics.. Ireland currently has the strictest lockdown in all of Europe, and the fourth strictest lockdown in the whole world. This study was released in February 2021.

"IRELAND's Covid-19 lockdown is the strictest in Europe, and the fourth strictest in the world, a new study has revealed.

Experts at the University of Oxford have compiled together data from the pandemic responses of 180 countries around the globe.

They've examined how strict the rules are in each nation, and created an index to determine which countries currently have the toughest lockdowns, called the Coronavirus Response Tracker.

Ireland ranks fourth on the list, with only Cuba, Eritrea and Honduras having tougher measures in place."