Irish mn'ers, how much can you relate to UK mumsnetters?

[Anotherdayanotherdollar]

I read a lot of different threads on here, and recently I have come across so many issues/practices that I think just don't happen in Ireland. Now, I could be completely off the mark here, obviously there's local/cultural differences everywhere!

I don't know any parents who attend childrens birthday parties with their children (unless family etc),

I'm not aware of any dads who work "compressed hours" to care for their children. Although I know a lot of parents who work opposite shifts I suppose.

Funerals and the culture and practices surrounding death are all very different.

I don't have an abundance of parks/softplay/childrens activities nearby. If I did I'm sure they'd be too expensive to just pop in after school etc. 2 within 40 mins drive of me are €8-10 per hr.

Most children just go to their local school (baptism barrier dependent)

New mums here all seem to be inundated with visitors in hospital after their babies are born. I've never come across a new mum who isn't having visitors for the first week/fortnight etc so that they can bond.

Just a few examples there. So, are these typical observations of Irish people? Or just where I live/work? I know that local amenities are dependent on funding etc but it just seems that despite our close proximity to the UK there are big differences in day to day life.
I hope that all comes across ok. I'm just curious really.

tbh sweeping statements about nationality are just a bit silly.
There are tight folk of every nationality.

I think people are confusing individual behaviour with analysis of social norms. The Home Counties are about as homogenous as Ireland - which is to say, not homogenous at all, but sufficiently different from nearby places to warrant treatment as a whole in socio-historical analysis.

The idea of England having a cultural norm of valuing and rewarding frugality isn't new. It's been discussed as being part of the English national character, by English writers, since at least the 18th century. The thing is, most of these writers came from the counties surrounding London (i.e., the Home Counties), so they were really only referring to culture in that area (and were unaware how, for instance, industrial cities like Manchester often did have reciprocal generosity amongst its working class). You still get similar articles in papers like the Telegraph (whose biggest sales are in that area) to similar effect, describing frugality as an admirable national characteristic.

There's no value judgement in analysing differences in cultural norms. Every difference has its pros and cons. Generosity in Ireland is lovely to experience but some people find the expectation stressful or annoying. Frugality in (parts of) England is good for the sustainable management of resources but some people find it stingy or mean. Swings and roundabouts.

The Guardian is the newspaper of choice in my part of the Home Counties!
And that's a fact, as my daughter has a paper round .

@MarDhea I get what you're saying, even if some people seem determined to misinterpret your point.

And I agree. Irish culture does approve of generosity and certainly doesn't condemn disorder (maybe even shows slight approval for disrupting order??), and southern English culture does approve of orderly behaviour and frugality in a way it doesn't approve of generosity. Some of the examples above I wouldn't even characterise as generosity, just community involvement.

Could it be that no one wants to think of their culture as being anything other than generous?

But your exception proves the rule. Your mean family members are “ famous” for it. They stand out a mile compared to others.

.".....southern English culture does approve of orderly behaviour and frugality in a way it doesn't approve of generosity. Some of the examples above I wouldn't even characterise as generosity"
How does southern English culture NOT approve of generosity?

I have a horror of tightness, OH has no idea what I spend at xmas birthdays, any celebration or anything to be honest. He would be horrified, his idea is a budget price twice a year for each member of the family. Each year I promise myself I will cut back, but I just cannot. The Irish runs through my veins.

@Ophelialovescats I never said southern English culture does NOT approve of generosity. I said that it does approve of orderly behaviour and frugality in a way that it doesn't approve of generosity, but I appreciate that the phrasing could be ambiguous. To be clearer, I should have said that it shows overt approval for orderly behaviour and frugality to a greater extent than it shows approval for generosity. It's all about the relative extent.

Personally, I have many experiences of English friends being surprised by acts of generosity (like putting up friends of friends I had never met for a tourist visit) that my Irish friends considered normal, and my Irish friends being surprised by acts of frugality (similar to a pp's example of wildflowers in jam jars at a wedding) that my English friends considered normal. They were each coming from a different perspective of "normal", of course!

To quote from Stevie Wonder 's song, Ebony and Ivory ,
"We all know that people are the same wherever you go,
There is good and bad in everyone..."

The idea of England having a cultural norm of valuing and rewarding frugality isn't new

It may not be new, but it seems something you seem determined to push. What was observed 300 years ago may be of interest, but to label the English, or the southern English (or is it the Home Counties, you don't seem to be able to make up your mind) in this way is silly.

Southern England/Home Counties - take your pick, is made up of a huge range of people from all sorts of cultures from around the world whose concept of 'generosity' or 'frugality' will varying in many different ways, not solely related to whether a visitor is offered a slice of cake, or if they will be housed for a while.

Your lazy stereotyping just adds to the already growing trend of otherness which politicians use to drive a wedge between people.

Well said, Ifailed.
It would appear that some people are hell bent on keeping the old stereotypes going especially when it applies to the English.
To be happy living in England, as I am, seems to be a problem for some people on this thread .

No, it's social anthropology. It's an academic discipline.

There is a difference between Anglo Saxons and Celts. I think... Yep there is.

o be happy living in England, as I am, seems to be a problem for some people on this thread . We're all happy you're living in England as well.

Best not to let yourself get too worked up by people on an internet forum , eh Jane . 😉

As if I would

It would appear that some people are hell bent on keeping the old stereotypes going especially when it applies to the English.

^^Says Ophelia who is hellbent on trying to make us Irish out to be disastrous drivers as a stereotype

Absolutely MarDhea. And agreed on generosity as a side-effect of a history of poverty. I certainly see certain behaviours around generosity and hospitality in my parents’ generation as a form of insecurity. And they can of course be oppressive things.

I do love that ophelia's answer to anyone who challanges her is try not to get worked up by people on the internet. Its funny ophelia your the one thats coming over as a piss taker!

Your the one hell bent on making this a englands better than irelsnd tread thats not what it is at all! Its started put as a interesting discussion about the differences just cos there are differences doesnt mean one place is better than the other.

Does anyone care if there is a difference between Celts and Anglo Saxons?

Well if you do point them out!

Irish/Scottish here
So aye I do chuckle at the average mn dilemma
No visitors when you have a wean.Whit?there'd be a riot if you pulled that
Free bar at a wedding.fuck no the relies would fill their boots and bring a bottle too
My hoose, my rules err you’ll no have met my mammy,or family then
whits for dinner threads who gives a fuck get it cooked

My mum (lives in Ireland) was being given a neurological exam in the UK, count backwards from 100, what day is it etc. And was asked names of PM and Chancellor of the exchequer. She hesitated but answered and then asked thr nurse if she could answer the same about Ireland lol. (She couldn't)

I am very late to the party but I have just enjoyed reading this thread so much. I am a dub and I have never been to a wake or seen a dead body and I am in my 50s, and I wouldn't go to a funeral unless I knew a person well. I am also punctual so maybe I am an aberration. I am always amazed at how many people on here are nc with family, but I don't know if it's a mumsnet thing or a UK thing. I don't know anyone in real life who is nc with their family. Also taking in parcels for a neighbor, expected and reciprocated, no problem at all, and not answering the door if you are not expecting someone, wtf? I also don't know anyone who expects visitors to remove their shoes or who ask people to stay away when they have a baby. Where I live very few kids move away for college but tbf we are near some great ones, and the ones that do stay in digs and go home at weekends, where in Britain they seem to live independently earlier. I don't have any personal experience of the UK so as I say perhaps these are mumsnet things and not fully representative. Great thread!