Help me find ways to save...PLEASE

[Pennybubbly]

Both my DH and I work full-time.
We have 2 DCs, 7 and 4.
Our salaries are not great, but not appalling either.
We should be able to save.

We had a small debt (incurred when we moved house - rented property into another rented property) which we have paid off with one of the DCs savings, which we now, of course, have to pay back.

We also want to save for a deposit, for the children's futures and for (ideally yearly) flights back to the UK (we don't live in the UK).

The trouble is, we spend every penny of what we bring in.
I've changed certain things that I thought would help us save money but so far I've noticed no difference.

I think if I'm honest, it boils down to the fact that I often spend out of stress. We have no family nearby to ever help out with the children, my DH works 8:30am and rarely comes home before midnight, often 6 days a week, which leaves 95% of the childcare and housework to me. I am far away from my family and although I have good friends here, they all have their own families and stress and my DH is not from a culture that relies on anyone other than close close family to care for your DCs.

I don't drink, I don't smoke, I don't indulge in 'luxuries' like manicures, massages, gyms etc. I get my hair cut 2 or 3 times a year, dye it myself.
My spends are always on my children (books, clothes, dvds etc).

How can I cull my spending and save without going insane / becoming miserable?! Any ideas appreciated

Hi,
have u thought about trying to save money on ur bills such as switching gas/electric/phone?

Switching supermarket is always a good one so you spend less or look for coupons?

I find you feel better about these kind of savings than missing out on actual goods.
However have you thought about maybe buying dvds toys etc at car boot sales/markets or on ebay? then once your DC have finished with them you could put them back on ebay! :D

Ebay is also a really good way to make money I added up what i have made in the last 6 months just putting a few bits on each month and it's earnt me nearly £700! and honestly these are only things that have gone from 99p-£30 nothing big! this might be a way to save up for your flights. If you set up a pay pal account you can just leave any money you make in there! then re use a small portion say £10 each time you sell a few bits to buy things on there for your DC's that way you arent spending your cash!

Keep a written record (receipts, notebook) of all spending you do for the next month. You'll soon see where it all goes if you are sure to write down every single thing.

Do your kids need so many new clothes and books? You can buy books second hand or borrow them from the library. You could sell the old clothes on ebay to make money to buy the new ones. I can understand dvds if you live in a country where you don't have much english language tv for the kids, but you could set a limit on what you buy and then sell them on afterwards if they turn out to be fairly mediocre and not ones that are likely to get watched again.

If you are spending too much because you are not happy with your family set up and the fact that your DH is never there and you have no support, then it would be better to address that issue!

Do you have a DVD rental place were you are? I also used to buy loads of DVDs here in Chile until they opened a Blockbuster. Books are extremely expensive here, but sometimes needs must. Can you do things with the children that don't require sending money? Go out after lunch at weekends to take the children to a park, beach, or similar? Take drinks with you and snacks if your children will need them.

I've also struggled with the isolation of living abroad with no family support, OH who expected me to do everything and still have time to bake cakes in my spare time. I spent like it was going out of fashion and ate constantly. Could you leave credit and bank cards at home when you go to work? Take out enough money for the week's costs and no more?

Maybe go through the children's wardrobes to see just how many items of clothing they have, not trying to rub your nose in it but I had a friend who did this and was astonished at how much she had bought. Show yourself that they have enough clothes and when you are next tempted visualise those piles of clothes. If you really can't resist, I've been there, get yourself a lipstick. Again, more spending, but probably less than clothes for both children, and DVD or two and the other thing that catches your eye.

By keeping a record of everything you spend as suggested by kitandkat you may find that you can begin to save just tiny amounts at first. Put those savings where you can see the money grow, either in the bank or a box at home. Or maybe decide that you are going to save £5 next week and then increase as you go along.

Is basic food expensive where you are? Are there ways to reduce your grocery bills, or travel expenses?

Take care

Thanks for your replies.

In terms of utility bills, the main companies here are not privatised, so we pay what they decide we pay! We are both out at work all day, but Japanese housing is not particularly well-insulated (no central heating) so our bills have been high over the winter period (under-floor heating in our main living area and electric 'radiator-style' heaters in the bedrooms) - despite not being in during the day.

I've switched from supermarket shopping to a home-delivery service which is cheaper and saves me a) the stress of two separate journeys at the weekend to the supermarket (I have to go by bicycle and can only carry so much on the back) and b) the worry of where my fruit & veg is coming from - lots of radiation worries since the earthquake/tsunami/nuclear disaster a year ago.

When I do go to shops, I always use point cards (have a whole purse full of them) which then usually get redeemed for vouchers.

DVDs etc. Yes, we have a rental place nearby, but I generally buy on Amazon (uk or jp, depending which is cheaper) or occasionally there are DVD sales at my place of work (International school, lots of rich expats) where I can pick up 10 DVDs for a couple of pounds. I guess I rely on DVDs as entertainment for the kids - plus it's extra English that they are hearing (both DCs are in Japanese education all day).

Sadly, no e-bay here, so I have things I'd love to recycle (and have used a website to sell a few things) but end up giving away a lot of the kids' things - clothes, toys to friends who have kids. Perhaps I should be meaner and sell more kids stuff on that site too?!

I try and meet friends in parks etc (when it's not so bloody cold!) and we bring food and drink from home, although I admit to being a Starbucks addict on those occasions! When I do buy there, I feel like it's my one selfish pleasure/treat....

My travel expenses to work are paid by my company. We don't own a car and we use a car-share instead of car rental when we do need one for any reason (half a dozen times a year?) (A car-share is similar to car rental, but cheaper). Otherwise, I go by (clapped-out) bicycle when the journey is not far, or we use the subway, which is not horrifically expensive.

I will try and write down exactly what I spend and see if I'm shocked into what goes where. I did draw up a budget spreadsheet with honest in-comings and out-goings, but that showed we should be able to save, so something went wrong somewhere!

Thanks for your suggestions though (I guess they show that there's not one gaping area that I've missed!....although that's kind of depressing too).

How about deciding on an amount, maybe half what you think you should be able to save, and put into a savings account as soon as you get paid? If that seems too daunting then start much smaller and build up to half. For buying on Amazon, maybe limit yourself to a small amount, or work out a monthly/quarterly budget as way of limiting what you allow yourself to spend. Defo sell more stuff, unless the friends you give to are too poor to buy. I donate all our old stuff because there is a large section of the population who can't afford to buy what many view as essential items. That's my choice.

We've also experienced paying sky high prices for the privelidge of freezing while we sleep. Here the building codes centre around earthquakes rather than fuel efficiency. I can't imagine what it's like buying food where you are right now, at least with the earthquake here our worst problem was the rioting in nearby towns with houses being looted as well as shops.

We bought fleece PJs for the children, and for me too after the first winter, can you get those there. I also used to wrap up in a fleece blanket to watch TV in the evenings. If the housework is getting you down too have you seen the Fly Lady website. The author makes a lot of good points, one being that perfection is not necessary.

Oh, and Starbucks is not a selfish pleasure, it's YOU'RE treat, don't let anyone make you feel guilty about it.

Hi, in this house we swapped from this approach to a cash only, budgeted approach. So each week I take out a fixed amount of cash, divide into separate envelopes to cover food/cash/petrol etc and then when it is gone it is gone.

Every week transfer the money you have decided to save into the relevant account BEFORE you do anything else.

I operate this system every week and I very rarely go over budget now, now I do almost every transaction in cash I rarely overspend as I can feel my money more.

If you want to online shop, you just have to be strict and say 'I have £60 this week, when that is gone my shop ends or I swap items - I can not go over my limit'.

Make a pledge to go cold turkey on DVDs and other kid spending etc for a month. The kids can just watch all the old ones again this month. This is non-essential spending so can easily be stopped. They probably won't even notice.

Things like starbucks - stop looking at it as a treat, it is simply a money choice. You can buy that or you can put the money somewhere else.

Good luck! You mentioned in your post that you do spend out of stress. I totally get that, used to do that too, and spend just because buying new things felt nice. But I had to stop and the buzz I now get from being in charge of our money and knowing we can afford x, y, z is better.

YNAB is a fantastic tool for getting to grips with your money. It's a computer programme based on envelopes so you work out what where your money is going each month and slowly build up a surplus. There's also a phone app so you can track your spending as you spend it meaning that you can check your budgets before you spend to see how much money is in the kitty. There's alsol

Whoops! Also loads of online help, videos etc to help you get to grips with overspending. Now I'm sounding like I work for YNAB or something, but it's just I've been using it since the beginning of the year and I have found it so helpful. There's nothing like having to track every transaction to make you stop spending ;-) But also, if there's a Starbucks/treat budget there, no matter how small, you know you can spend that money without feeling guilty...

I agree that you need to transfer however much you think you can save as soon as you get paid. If you leave it there to be spent then it will just go.

Can you try and focus your mind when you feel tempted to spend and think about the bigger goals you are aiming for? Stick a picture in your wallet to remind you?

My tips for you would be

1. Understand your income and outgoings in detail. Keep accurate records of spending as this means you'll spend less. Recommend the free download of Microsoft Money Plus Sunset for this. Link
2. Don't walk into shops or browse internet shopping sites for recreation or stress-relief. They are designed to be tempting and make it easy to spend money. Find other ways to relax and other things to keep you busy.
3. Work on cash only. Credit cards are an invisible painless way to spend whereas you can physically feel the cash in your purse getting less and less.
4. Pay yourself first. Set up a savings account and create a regular debit into it each month straight after you get paid. You'll get used to budgeting around what's left and you'll build up some savings at the same time.
5. Set yourself a no-spend challenge. Allocate yourself a small amount of cash, be creative and see how long you can last before you really have to spend it.
6. Challenge the children to think of fun things to do that don't cost money. You may be surprised what they come up with.

I read a book - but can't remember the name - it was about a family, not unlike yours, that just refused to go on the treadmill any longer: 50/60 years of being a wage slave if you're lucky but now, with no guarantee of the cottage round the door, grandchildren playing on the sunny front lawn.

Why buy 'their' message one moment longer?

Anyway. They just refused to take it and promptly took off, complete with children. Went through Asia, Africa, then onto south America, where they ended up running a school and home made medical centre, and as far as I know all are blissfully happy.

Makes you think doesn't it? When you wearily listen to the helpful advice to keep you enslaved to others in exchange for a few crumbs that might never arrive any way..

Sorry. For the nonsense. Had a cr*p day, all went wrong so I'm wallowing in self pity. Hope it all works out for you - it will, you'll see.

Sorry. Just re-read your situation, re living abroad. We did it too. (19 yrs). Only ended when the other half went off with someone else.

So sorry that I jumped in without reading.

I wish I could add to messages I've writen before. You said you never treat yourself to this/that the other. I'm sure your Husband/partner, working his arse off feels the same too but i do know how important just treating yourself is.

You're both two rebels who deserve better. Bin an' done it all. Now 'safely' back in what now passes for Engerland but don't i weep or you!

I think I would be assessing your lifestyle in all aspects. If you live abroad because you love it and would hate the thought of being back here - great.

But if you live abroad for career reasons, is it worth it? You're both working incredibly hard just to pay the bills basically. You can do that here (haha) but perhaps with family support which sounds from what you say, as if it might stop some of your 'emotional' spending.

why are you spending so much on the kids? Are you trying to compensate for something? I'm not saying you are, just posing the question.

I could be reading between the lines at stuff that isn't there, but you don't sound too happy with where you are at present?

Actually only wrote this because I'm just thinking after today, WTF am i doing? Faffing about, trying to jump through OTHERS hoops before i die. (not your problem).

Eff em' all off. Get your old man to read this. Get him fired up. Dumping the Sh*t for real stuff you'll both need. Loading up to move out.

Whoever (whatever, ripoff, big bank crook), you owe money to - it's nonsense trinket money to them but it will kill your spirit if you let them tell you that paying back your loan shows you have no honour. (quite right?) Oh really? your sht/ripoff interest rate? F*k off you sharks.

That's the view of a weary cynic with no imagination Petunia12.... Banks are not sharks or ripoff crooks. Without a bank financing the deal, most of us would never save up the full cost of a home of our own and some of us would have never got started in business or got through higher education. Keep it affordable and it's not enslavement in the slightest.... it's enabling. If someone's lifestyle has been 'shandy money and champagne tastes' and they've borrowed to sustain it, more fool them and they need to grow up. If they've taken on too much debt because they've had a run of bad luck they've also got to have a major rethink and get as much help as they can.

But the idea that you just stick two fingers up at your creditors and run away is stupid, frankly. I know someone that tried it, funnily enough. Locked up the house, didn't leave a forwarding address and thought the £88k he still owed on the mortgage would magically be forgotten. It wasn't.

What works for us is a having a set goal in mind and a spreadsheet. Get really obsessed about it like it's a hobby iyswim. Open a easy access savings account that's linked to your bank. When you get paid, try and work out how much money you will need for the month and then save the rest. Log it into your spreadsheet and hopefully you will not want to move it back to your spending account. When you get to an amount that you do not 'need' anymore. I.e. a surplus amount, move it into an ISA (or similar if abroad) and don't touch it.

Make every penny you spend count. I get cross if I can't find a good deal and will often wait until the product I want is on sale. If you have cashback websites/ discount code websites in your country, try and use them if you need to buy something. Keep a record of what you spend to see where it goes. In your head, think - oh this magazine is £2.50 for example - if i buy one a week that's £120 a year on something which is most likely going to end up in the recycling bin.

If you're stressed try and work out cheaper ways of relieving the stress. A nice walk etc. Easier said than done though I know.

MoneySavingExpert is good, but maybe limited info if you are abroad. You could read the forums/ articles for ideas though.

Sorry, I've just blurted out a load of stuff that works for us, but we find it works really well. Good luck!

Theres a great book called Your Money Or Your Life by Joe Dominguez and Vicki Robin. I read it about once a year to keep me motivated! You can get a lot of the info from it online for free, but the book is def worth it.

Theres a summary here : ymoyl.wordpress.com/summary-of-your-money-or-your-life/

Its worth reading it all, but to get the jist of it, scroll about a third of the way down to "NINE MAGICAL STEPS TO CREATE A NEW ROAD MAP " Step 1 was pretty shocking to me actually..

Mousey, just wanted to say thanks for that link. Have not heard of that book before, but it sort of echoes the way I think and live on a subconcious level. Will have to get the book from the library/ amazon and have a read in full.

OP, just to let you know - our household income at the moment is not the highest it's ever been, but our lives are relatively stress free (ish!!! not always) and we are saving more than we ever have done as we can focus some time and energy on it.

So I wouldn't always assume that always - Higher Income = Higher Savings. I think perhaps it's more complicated than that, somehow similar to that book that Mousey links to.