12-15 jabs: do they ask about previous infections anymore?

[hellomrsmagpie]

Current situation: DS13 is on his third COVID infection. Mild cold symptoms and a positive test on Saturday, now recovered and showing only a faint positive this morning (Day 5). He had his first jab as soon as he was eligible after a previous infection. His appointment for jab #2 is Monday.

The invitation letter we received says that "ideally" there should be 12-week gap after a previous infection. However if he doesn't get this vaccination, we will have to cancel our trip in August to see my family overseas for the first time since 2018 (we used to see them 2/3 times a year with trips in both directions). For this destination, over-12s must be double vaccinated or are required to quarantine for 14 days.

The stakes are high: everyone on both sides is absolutely desperate for this trip to go ahead. And even if we make up some excuse, DS is a clever and well-informed boy and may figure out that it's down to him alone. We knew this was a risk when booking the flights but even so I'm distraught that with days to go he got COVID yet again.

So my question is: now that testing is not advised for under 18s, what exactly do they ask on the pre-jab medical questionnaire? I can't ask DS to lie if they ask him directly "Have you tested positive for COVID in the past
weeks"? Or do they just ask if they are fit and well on the day? If they ask "Have you had COVID symptoms in the past week"? and he says yes, will they follow up with a direct "Did you test positive?"

The guidance acknowledges that some (most?) will no longer know if they've had COVID due to the lack of testing, so medically speaking appear it appears to be acceptable to have the jab as long as you're symptom-free and don't know you've had COVID. Of course we could have followed the guidance and not tested him and thus maintained plausible deniability. But we wanted to keep the rest of us safe and to the responsible thing to also avoid spreading it further in school.

If he is well we are considering keeping the appointment and trying to get the jab (have done a lot of research on side-effects and spoken to several HPC friends off the record). But we are worried if they ask directly and we don't outright lie that we will be refused.

Does anyone have any insight/advice to share specifically on what we're likely to be asked at the appointment? Thank you.

According to the NHS:

You can have your vaccination or booster 28 days after you had a positive test for COVID-19, or 28 days after your symptoms started, so you may need to wait.

Thanks pinklavenders. When you actually go to book an appointment, the guidance for 12-15 year olds says (slightly different to what is on the letter invitation - ie "need to wait" rather than "ideally wait"):

If you or your child have tested positive for COVID-19, you need to wait a number of weeks before having the vaccine. You need to wait:

4 weeks (28 days) if you're aged 18 years old or over
12 weeks (84 days) if you or your child are aged 5 to 17 years old
4 weeks (28 days) if you or your child are aged 5 to 17 years old and at high risk from COVID-19, or live with someone who has a weakened immune system
This starts from the date that symptoms started, or the date of the positive test result, whichever was earlier.

If you or your child have symptoms of COVID-19, but have not had a test, wait until the symptoms are better to get a COVID-19 vaccine. You can talk to a healthcare professional at the site about this.

So here's my dilemma: if you've not taken a test, no problem, you're good to go as long as symptoms are better. If you've taken a test - wait 12 weeks.

They did when ds had his booster a few weeks ago. I think it was 4 weeks they asked though rather than 12, but I can't be certain.

Thank you

It was a 4 week gap last year but it changed about November to a 12 week wait for kids after covjd

hiwver without pcr no one would know

I didn’t do pcr for this very reason

Both mine had vax 3 weeks after covid as we just said no when questioned

If you take a big step back from the emotion of the trip, you're treating it as if the 12wk wait is for administrative reasons, and trying to "beat" they system. I understand why and empathise with your situation.

My understanding is that the 12ww between infection and innoculation is there for safety reasons to lessen the likelihood of cardiac side effects.

It depends whether you're willing to accept that risk for the sake of the trip. Only you can make that decision.

worth noting that every other country except uk allows vax straight after recovery

only uk has a set gap betwern

Thanks to all who chipped in. DS now has no symptoms other than fatigue, and he tested negative on Day 5.

But it doesn't matter as it's out of our hands. The appointment was cancelled with no reason given (has the school informed the NHS perhaps?). And it was clear from talking to the booking service and our GP that anyone we asked simply referred to the guidance and said it would be a flat out "no". We weren't prepared to lie so I don't think we ever really had a choice, even if we had decided we were OK with the risk.

Now dealing yet again with more disappointment, and looking at other options for rescheduling travel. Trying to be positive, I'm grateful he came through infection #3 OK, and we managed not to spread it to anyone else.

Op given this isn’t a normal holiday - you haven’t seen family for four years why wouldn’t you just lie? You don’t compete a questionnaire they simply ask you. A child of 13 is going to know the fallout is because of him which seems very unfair. If you were anywhere else in the world he’d be fine getting his jab.

why did you test him? Do you know gov advice is only to test under 18 if advised by a doctor? He shouldn’t have been put in this situation - no one else would because the gov are not asking kids to test so in theory the 12 week gap won’t happen for most kids.

Unless

If your child took a test and it was registered positive (a PCR or a lateral flow) then the system shares information and the doctor/health centre would see the positive test I think.

Kids can’t get pcr now so it relies purely on you giving them the info

but like I say nhs and gov advice now is not to test under 18 unless told by a doctor

My understanding is that the 12ww between infection and innoculation is there for safety reasons to lessen the likelihood of cardiac side effects.

This. The risk of myocarditis is highest among young males!

Why did we test? Good question. Honestly - I don't feel we had a choice. We needed to know if he was positive. There are other members of the household to consider, including some with conditions that make them vulnerable, and one that has already experienced months of Long Covid. We needed to take precautions to avoid spreading it, and knowing when he was infectious allowed us to contain it.

He also was due to go on a School residential this week. They're in the midst of a big outbreak, which is how he caught it. Even if he'd been well enough to go, how could I have sent him knowing he might be infectious? Risk the health of other children and teachers, and potentially ruin other peoples' holiday plans as well? The guidance not to test is at best irresponsible and at worst bloody dangerous, and part of the reason we're in this awful wave.

And finally, if my child is experiencing multiple infections with unknown long-term side effects, I want as much knowledge of his medical history as I can get.
If we had decided to try to go ahead with the jab, we'd want to be making an fully informed decision given the slightly elevated risk quoted above for myocarditis (though the risk is much higher from COVID itself).

And why not lie? Well when he went for the first jab he sat with the nurse and she went down a checklist of questions and asked him for the answers, not us. Given his temperment, he simply wouldn't be able to lie to a medical professional if they'd asked him if he'd had COVID or symptoms in the last four week. Nor would we ask him too, that would be contrary to how we've raised him.

I'm truly grateful to everyone who's commented, it's helped me work through events this week. I was very very upset and frustrated, mostly because it felt like we'd been unlucky and fallen through a very narrow crack where the guidance from two countries didn't match up. And I was angry that he'd been infected yet again.

I've now moved on to the resilience phase and we're investigating how to make the best of it. There are actually other options on the table: requesting a medical exemption, going through with the quarantine period, meeting in a third country. What's done is done and the important thing is that he's healthy and we'll look forward to reuniting with our family however we can.

Can he not get a recovery from Covid cert? Would that be acceptable instead of vaccination?

Sadly not for our destination - I wish!