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Original poster

CEV employees, Covid and Disability Act

32 replies

treeflowercat · 21/01/2022 13:28

I've read a number of stories about managers seeking to require those who are CEV to stop working from home even though they have been doing so adequately so far. As a manager myself, I can't imagine being so cruel and uncaring to do this, but it seems some people are...

It got me thinking whether those employees may have recourse under the Disability Act and whether continued "working from home" could be considered a reasonable adjustment.

Any thoughts welcome...

OP posts:
ColettesEarrings · 21/01/2022 15:17

There is no Disability Act, did you mean the Equalities Act 2010? That provides for rationale adjustments but doesn't prescribe what they might be.

Original poster
treeflowercat · 21/01/2022 15:47

Sorry, yes Equalities Act.

I understand it can't prescribe what they would be as each situation would be different. The test presumably would be whether the adjustment was "reasonable".

OP posts:
Original poster
treeflowercat · 21/01/2022 15:49

And it feels like a job that has been demonstrated as one that could be done from home would be a situation where "home-based working" was a reasonable adjustment.

OP posts:
Wingingit15 · 21/01/2022 16:06

Equality Act
Depends on things like whether it’s a genuine occupational requirement and whether wfh is going to overcome substantial disadvantage.
Very individual and unable to generalise but some form of flexible working might be reasonable in some circumstances but not all!

SmellyWellyWoo · 21/01/2022 18:41

Not everyone can work from home- what do you propose then?

WorriedGiraffe · 21/01/2022 18:44

What about those who can’t work from home? It can’t cover some professions but not others.

TheNoonBell · 21/01/2022 19:01

The Equalities Act would cover those classed as disabled. CEV is a different matter and would probably have to be dealt with via risk assessment which would most likely include revealing your medical history to your employer so they could assess your risk if infected.

psychomath · 21/01/2022 19:09

@WorriedGiraffe

What about those who can’t work from home? It can’t cover some professions but not others.
Surely it can if it's 'reasonable' for some but not others?
WiseUpJanetWeiss · 21/01/2022 19:11

@TheNoonBell

The Equalities Act would cover those classed as disabled. CEV is a different matter and would probably have to be dealt with via risk assessment which would most likely include revealing your medical history to your employer so they could assess your risk if infected.
No it isn't a different matter. Anyone with a long term health condition is covered by the Equality Act.
Wingingit15 · 21/01/2022 19:21

Bmi over 40 is classed as CEV and wouldn’t be a disability in terms of protected characteristics under the EA2010

flashbac · 21/01/2022 19:31

@WiseUpJanetWeiss no, it doesn't work like that. Not everyone with a long term condition is covered.

WiseUpJanetWeiss · 21/01/2022 19:35

[quote flashbac]@WiseUpJanetWeiss no, it doesn't work like that. Not everyone with a long term condition is covered.[/quote]
Really? AFAIK anyone who has a long term condition that affects or may be affected by their work is covered. Whether WFH is a reasonable adjustment is moot. For some jobs/people it will be and others it won't.

nether · 21/01/2022 19:43

It's also depend on why they were classed as CEV

If they are among the 500,000 or so critically vulnerable (4 jabs, might not form an immune response) then I think there should be support to WFH. Those who can expect normal protection from the vaccine then the balance of risk is different

Beekindbeehumble · 21/01/2022 22:47

CEV teachers are all in school, with no masks now in classrooms in England.

Original poster
treeflowercat · 21/01/2022 23:39

@Beekindbeehumble

CEV teachers are all in school, with no masks now in classrooms in England.
There's a spectrum of vulnerability that would need careful consideration. For instance an otherwise healthy person who's morbidly obese who's vaccinated and boosted would be at far lower risk relative to someone who was severely immuno-compromised.

As for teachers, if one was so acutely vulnerable that vaccines continued to mean they were at a high risk of severe disease, it implies they were at high risk before Covid from the myriad of germs children bring in to schools. I'm not sure there are any reasonable adjustments that could be applied in that circumstance... and mask wearing, whereas it may take the edge off infection risk, would hardly reduce risks to acceptable levels for such a teacher.

Sufficiently effective mitigation against Covid, or bugs in general, in a classroom of 30 children for someone who is severely immune-compromised is probably impossible..... So, harsh as this might sound, a teacher who becomes severely immune-compromised should probably look for alternative employment, in the same way a taxi driver who was going blind would need to.

OP posts:
Sunshineboo · 22/01/2022 00:14

i think in part it depends on how adequately they work from home to be honest. I manage people who are vulnerable - we had to find them bits to do and others covered the stuff that had to be done in person. think setting up experiments or supervising people doing a physical activity. luckily their vulnerabilities were such that they pushed to come back when double
vaccinated, but had they not i think we would have had to consider whether we could keep accommodating this arrangement.

i also have some staff whose jobs can technically be done at home, but there is a marked determination in performance. what do we do there? not everyone has a good space to work - and some people just work better with people (and without this morning on in the background).

For me, i would want to weigh up how effectively they could work from home and balance with risk.

MaybeHeIsMyCat · 22/01/2022 00:16

From what I can gather I am staying WFH. Haven't had my 4th vaccine yet, my performance isn't affected as we are so heavily monitored whether WFH/at work, and work is rife with covid

JaceLancs · 22/01/2022 00:40

It’s difficult
Trying to manage the needs of the business and support those who are CEV
The last 22 months have proved to me that my staff cannot work effectively from home
I’ve allowed people to work from home mostly at their request - but it means they only get allocated certain tasks
If this becomes long term we will have to re write job descriptions etc and it may be that those who wish to WFH have lesser responsibilities in which case they will be paid less
As an employer I will be taking legal HR advice as I would like to adjust where needed but also have to manage the needs of the business and consider salaries and other costs

PastMyBestBeforeDate · 22/01/2022 00:45

if one was so acutely vulnerable that vaccines continued to mean they were at a high risk of severe disease, it implies they were at high risk before Covid unless their condition became apparent or worsened necessitating a change in treatment during the last two years.

kittensinthekitchen · 22/01/2022 01:55

@Wingingit15

Bmi over 40 is classed as CEV and wouldn’t be a disability in terms of protected characteristics under the EA2010
BMI over 40 isn't classed as CEV Confused
wishfuldreamer · 22/01/2022 02:26

@WiseUpJanetWeiss - to fall with it disability as a protected characteristic the individual must show a physical or mental impairment which has a substantial and long term adverse impact on ability to carry out day to day activities. So many long term health conditions will fall within this definition but not all.

In terms of whether it would be a reasonable adjustment to allow to continue to WFH if they have been doing so up until now…I think there would be a decent case, though complicated in the face of govt guidance etc, because of discrepancies in how covid risk is being seen and who is vulnerable.

It would be interesting litigation certainly and it wouldn’t surprise me if we see some.

WiseUpJanetWeiss · 22/01/2022 09:05

[quote wishfuldreamer]@WiseUpJanetWeiss - to fall with it disability as a protected characteristic the individual must show a physical or mental impairment which has a substantial and long term adverse impact on ability to carry out day to day activities. So many long term health conditions will fall within this definition but not all.

In terms of whether it would be a reasonable adjustment to allow to continue to WFH if they have been doing so up until now…I think there would be a decent case, though complicated in the face of govt guidance etc, because of discrepancies in how covid risk is being seen and who is vulnerable.

It would be interesting litigation certainly and it wouldn’t surprise me if we see some.[/quote]
Yes, that's what I was getting at but you said it much more clearly Smile

Gladioli23 · 22/01/2022 09:15

Worth remembering though that that definition of a long term impairment is I think without medication.

e.g. I have a long term health condition which for years at a time impacted my ability to carry out daily activities. Often it would be controlled by medication but not always - but the test my organisation applied in assessing whether they classed me as disabled was how disabled by it I would be if I didn't have my medication - which was significantly moreso than with medication.

gogohm · 22/01/2022 09:17

If you worked in person prior to March 2020 with all the normal bugs around, why is it any different going to work now with vaccination? Its worrying but the flu is a killer if you are immunocompromised. My boss is immunocompromised and has worked throughout in person because her job requires it.