So much for herd immunity then.

[2boysand1princess]

I now know 12 people personally who have got covid (most likely omricon) again!
Most have caught it after a year or more, but some have caught it within a few months! I’m really shocked at how this new variant is invading any natural immunity.
Scary to think that perhaps in another 6 months time there may be a another new variant that repeats this cycle all over again.
Anyone else feel just totally defeated and feel like no matter what we do (vaccines etc) this is going to be the way of life now?

Hardly anyone used to bat an eyelid at flu killing 16,000 per year in the UK, or whatever

What a silly statement! We have had a national vaccination programme against flu for years, to try and protect the vulnerable.

Oh and I keep looking at all the t-cell research coming out of S.Africa and that cheers me up. Our immune systems really are very complex but we will develop some level of immunity and protection. Especially our children who have it mildly on the whole. I don’t think it will be an issue to them as they get older.

This winter looks very different from last winter where we were licked down, and next winter will look different from this winter.

@Overthebow

Well, no wonder there was such a struggle last winter! 😉

Are they actually ill with it though, as in can't get out of bed, full blown flu ill? My brother currently has Covid, he's fine. He had a bad cold late summer with a chest infection and was 10x worse.
I know lots of people with Covid now who fortunately, thanks to vaccines, aren't unwell, and to me this is what herd immunity looks like.

We have a Covid vaccination program too to protect the vulnerable.

The point being we don’t have a daily death total of flu published every year. Nobody has any idea how many people die of flu. Covid will eventually become like this. We’re. It there yet obviously.

I don’t know many who have been bed bound with Omicron. I had to lie on the sofa and was fatigued for a week or so but no other symptoms.

My DM (71) currently has omicron and painted her kitchen yesterday! Also encouraged by posts on here from CEV who have omicron and aren’t too badly affected. The vaccines are working. The issue is the amount in hospitals who aren’t vaccinated.

@MyGreenTutu
Hardly anyone used to bat an eyelid at flu killing 16,000 per year in the UK, or whatever

What a silly statement! We have had a national vaccination programme against flu for years, to try and protect the vulnerable

I guess the point being made was that of course reasonable measures were in place to deal with flu and all other illnesses. But we don’t
have 24/7 news hysteria which is playing absolutely havoc with the mental health of the elderly, schools being routinely closed which is ruining children’s education and well-being, and 1000s of vital operations for other serious illnesses being endlessly postponed.

@MyGreenTutu

Hardly anyone used to bat an eyelid at flu killing 16,000 per year in the UK, or whatever

What a silly statement! We have had a national vaccination programme against flu for years, to try and protect the vulnerable.

Ah, but were there endless daily death counts & hospital admission figures?

Was there a topic on mumsnet? With countless threads talking about it?

Was it a daily conversation in every household?

I rather think not. By a very long way.

Was there talk of nightgale hospitals?

Was there weekly bulletins?

Was it on the news every day for 18 months?

I could go on and on, but anything I say will be picked up and ridiculed, so why bother.

You get my drift though.

So no, hardly anyone did use to bat an eyelid.

There is nothing to say we can't have an annual booster for the CV and CEV patients much the same way as we do with flu. It would cost far less than mass testing and tracing in not only monetary value, but economic impact, educational impact, knock on medical impact and environmental impact.
I have a friend whose brain tumor would have been eridicated by now if she had the treatment she needed on time, now she could be fighting for years. So much chemo was cancelled due to COVID. Yes COVID kills, but so does neglecting other illnesses to control COVID.
The biggest issue is actually underfunding of the NHS. Had it not been in such a dire state, we wouldn't have needed to protect it, it would have protected us.

and what @Cam77 says! And probably better than I can.

@Diddytv

It is different from flu thought as it so so so much more contagious. Much more difficult to contain. And we don’t know the long term implications of catching it over and over. The fact it alters the taste and smell it worrying for me. It must alter the brain somehow to do this.

Other respiratory diseases like colds and flu alter taste and smell in many people. I lose both every time I get a cold. Our nose linings get congested. As our taste buds can only taste sweet, salty, sour and bitter the majority of flavour or 'taste' that we get from food comes from sensors in our noses. These cannot do their job if the nose is congested. Not all people with a cold lose their taste and smell, and not all people with covid lose their taste and smell. There is no frightening brain issue to worry about.

At this point, I will probably bow out of the conversation, as I do nowadays.
Years ago, when I was on mumsnet, I used to go on and on. But I dont think it is necessary now. I say my point and withdraw.
I am on other forums too. And say my points in real life. Up to others how they take them.

@cam77

yes but one of the reasons opperations have to be cancelled is because the hospitals are very very busy treating sick people and covid has increased hospitalisations (luckily with vaccinations this is lower than would have been but still causing alot of problems.

@lightand Had the flu pandemic happened in this era, yes, all of the above would have been true. But it happened post war and that was rather a different world to today.

@MumbleCrumbs

"...is the elephant in the room..."

I realise that this is off topic but this expression always puzzles me. I know that it refers to 'a major problem or controversial issue which is obviously present but is avoided as a subject for discussion' but one would have though that people wouldn't avoid it but are more likely to exclaim "Oh my glly gosh, there's a bleedin' elephant in the room" - even more so if it was a herd of elephants with immunity*.

Even if it ended up like the flu virus I would feel a little reassured as we have the flu vaccine for the vulnerable and it’s seasonal. Not many people catch the flu though, I’m 41 years old and I’ve never had the flu. Worked in high exposure settings for 20 years too. However, think I’ve caught covid twice already. First time confirmed in 2020 and now getting faint positive lfts and awaiting pcr results.

Not many people catch the flu though, I’m 41 years old and I’ve never had the flu

Yes you have! You just have fallen into the trap of thinking mild respiratory infection systems is "a cold" and not "the flu". Depending on the strain and previous infections and stuff you have up to 20% chance of having flu in any year, and the years you don't it's most likely due to pre-existing immunity from having a very similar strain before.

@tetleyteafan

Of course people can lose smell and taste with a heavy cold but to my knowledge this returns once the cold has cleared up. there are people that have not had there smell or taste return months after recovering from covid.

It is interesting how the virus and the response have developed - and this has clearly led to changing views. Initially I felt we should either have had a really full on lockdown and zero tolerance (as in Asia) or herd immunity and let the virus just run through the country. Now I am of the view that we should have just let it run through the country I have never felt this mixed approach to be the best - but I do accept that people's view are not based on malice and people genuinely want the best for the country. What I don't accept is that the decision making is reasoned and logical - I feel that not all the data is taken into account - the modelling is done by biologists not mathematicians. We need to let the virus let it run the course.

And yes there is the CEV argument as there will be some people who continue to be vulnerable, but unfortunately this is the same for all illnesses and this will be no different when testing ends.

there are some differences. I have lymphoma and am in high dose chemotherapy treatment. I’ve been very strongly advised to avoid catch Covid if at all possible. It’s not good if I get other things but not as bad. This is based on information from my
consultant. On the bright side there is a new treatment that I would be eligible for that they are learning more about every day. There are other treatments in development. So for me, every month that I can stay Covid free gives me a better chance of survival when I do get it (discounting for a moment varying effect of different strains) as things are progressing rapidly.
It will be the same for some other CEV people. I think it’s important to understand that as it really does change outlook depending when we get it. Also I’m lucky, I am vaccinated. For those that can’t be their outlook is far worse.

So I don’t agree that it’s ‘just the same as all illnesses and will be the same when testing ends’. Based on what my consultant has said.

For what it’s worth though I don’t agree with locking everyone who is not CEV down to protect those of us who are. The social, mental and economic effects would affect a far greater amount of the population and in my opinion outweigh the benefit for the CEV.

But I do get annoyed when people dismiss where we are. We’ve come a massively long way medically in a short time, but the more people who are willing to follow the guidance to try to limit spread, the more time it buys people like me to give us a higher chance of survival.

It's very mild. Move on.

Yes, it is a threat. But hardly anyone used to bat an eyelid at flu killing 16,000 per year in the UK
So just over 300 a week. Currently we're well below that. If the deaths stay where they are (under 200) can we continue to stop the world for it? Would also be useful to see what the combined deaths are for flu and covid (as in is it a case of if one of them misses you, the other will get you?). We don't even vaccinate v well for flu. Schools here didn't get it until DECEMBER

@SleepingStandingUp
yesterday data was 388 covid deaths within 28days obv. more after 28days. which is based on catching covid earlier in December. since then cases have gone far higher. About 50k cases a few weeks ago and now around 200k with anticipated rises to continue but not necessarily show in data because we are at the limit of testing capacity.

So just over 300 a week. Currently we're well below that. If the deaths stay where they are (under 200)

@SleepingStandingUp

Who are you talking about when you say 'we'? The UK? England? The planet? Your county?

Just to add - the flu deaths you say of an average of just above 300 a week and the 388 above is for a DAY - so the weekly figure is going to be far far higher than flu