Going back to school .

[Sallydimebar]

Feeling really uneasy on DS 12 returning to school , Just feel this omicron is going to rip through and although I’m told it’s mild 2 people currently with covid are vomiting, stomach pain and feeling dreadful , barely moving out of bed. I’m thinking it’s probably omicron they’ve got .
I feel with out the vaccine I’m sending him in with no protection. Not feeling 100% on the jab but don’t want the risk of long covid and he really seems to suffer quite badly with illness . He had it in October was quite poorly with it , can’t get jab till end of jan . Was poorly 2 weeks ago with headache and temp for four days then cough lft negative . Just don’t want another 8/10 days of omicron . It’s being described as highly contagious so very likely to be in school again in jan .

Are parents going to lft kids twice a week (if test-kit available as I can’t get hold of any at moment) ? Not heard about masks yet , but they were only needed in corridors not in class .

Was hoping if you had delta maybe that would protect you for a bit, if he had antibodies but I’ve read delta gives you no protection from omicron.

Really don’t want schools shut again and so vital for his mental health to be with his peers as well as education.

183000 cases today....
We have had nothing like it.
Bring on school :(

We had Covid in 2020 and my kids have been around Delta and Omicron close contacts and not caught it again, or at least didn’t have symptoms. My eldest is vaccinated and was a very close contact recently eg sleepover with more than 1 positive teen, did not catch it again and we did multiple tests as we thought she would.

I do now think that you do get immunity after repeat exposure either multiple vaccines or multiple natural infections.

183 000 cases

Thinking about health and safety - Heads (as employers) have legal responsibilities under H&S at work laws to put measures in place to ensure the safety of employees, visitors and others in the workplace.

At what point should this legal responsibility come into play in schools? When are they unsafe as workplaces due to lack of mitigations?

"I do now think that you do get immunity after repeat exposure either multiple vaccines or multiple natural infections."

Oh, you must send a message to the CMO and Government scientists and epidemiologists right away. You've clearly picked up on something they've missed.

@PrivateHall

Masks are compulsory where I am for staff and pupils (secondary schools) - I don't know why that isn't the case all over the UK. That being said, transmission rates are still extremely high, so not sure it actually helps much! Windows always open here too. Unfortunately I don't think anyone can hide from this virus!

Masks have been compulsory in Scotland constantly. And yet we've had some of the worst infection rates in Europe throughout 2021. Anyone who thinks reintroducing masks in English schools will make a jot of difference is absolutely deluded.

can'tkeepawayforever - I don't know but I would say it's when they aren't doing things which are possible without affecting your ability to do your job effectively. So your head would not be meeting their responsibility because they won't allow masks even for those who want them, despite it not really being an issue.

In my mind - optional masks in classrooms, open windows, air purifiers, limited bubbling are yeses.
But - strict bubbling, limiting what can be done in lessons or stopping certain subjects altogether, stopping extra curricular activity, distancing and forcing people to wear masks in classrooms are nos.

But if a factory machine is unsafe, with no other way of doing the task ‘effectively’, then the legal duty is to stop the machine even if the task cannot be done without it.

Why is there a getout that says ‘if the job can’t be done except in a dangerous way, you just gave to do it the dangerous way, the law doesn’t apply?’

I guess it depends on the danger? A dangerous machine is clearly a very big issue. Catching Covid is very unlikely to be a problem. And it's a problem for the whole of society - higher in school than out but it's not like anywhere is safe. I don't think it's the same thing.

To me, it's more like saying hospital staff need to continue to treat people, even though they might catch what the sick person has. They can't just say it's too dangerous. Now it's the same with educating children. The difference is that that danger to health has always been an occupational hazard for HCP. It hasn't for education staff. Now it is and that takes some adjusting to. But it will probably be that way forever now.

@Bobholll

Mine will be in with bells on unless covid starts being very concerning for children. Which it def isn’t for the vast, vast majority!

Haha yes! Exactly this! Life has stopped for long enough, the children need to interact with other children and be educated in a school setting. No need to be so cautious ( unless they are vulnerable) it's basically a cold, no way will I stop my child going to school for a cold.

@CallmeHendricks

Well, sorry to break it to you, *@PrivateHall*, but it seems that you're mistaken, as there ARE people who are saying their children will be attending. On this thread and many others.

And parents who send kids in with symptoms while awaiting PCR.

Nobody said that school staff think parents are stupid (the example above is in the minority).

Regardless of vaccination status, this virus will carry on causing chaos. Hopefully it'll burn itself out.

But then if your child is positive,even if they are feeling well, they'll be spreading it to other youngsters and school staff.

@blameitonthecaffeine

I guess it depends on the danger? A dangerous machine is clearly a very big issue. Catching Covid is very unlikely to be a problem. And it's a problem for the whole of society - higher in school than out but it's not like anywhere is safe. I don't think it's the same thing.

To me, it's more like saying hospital staff need to continue to treat people, even though they might catch what the sick person has. They can't just say it's too dangerous. Now it's the same with educating children. The difference is that that danger to health has always been an occupational hazard for HCP. It hasn't for education staff. Now it is and that takes some adjusting to. But it will probably be that way forever now.

Are you aware there is already a significant crisis in retaining teachers? A huge shortage. So if they couldn’t keep teachers before because their working conditions are so poor, how do you think that plan will work?

Now it is and that takes some adjusting to.

Or we could 'adjust' by doing something about it.

Yes, I know itisasecret But, in terms of the things that are making teachers leave, I don't think covid is high. There seem to be a lot of teachers on here who are very worried about Covid. It's not something I see in real life. In my experience, we're much more likely to quit over not being allowed to do things that we are over lack of restrictions. If we go online again for example, I will leave. I don't need to work for the money, I do it because I love it. But teaching online is not teaching.

Also, it's not really a plan as much as a reality? That is what has been happening for over a year now.

But what could you do about it that would actually make a big enough difference woodenfoot ? Physical, on site, 'normal' education is a risk. There's nothing we can do that will change that. Masks, ventilation and cleaning probably help a bit. But not enough. We can't in good conscience go much further than that.

@blameitonthecaffeine

Yes, I know itisasecret But, in terms of the things that are making teachers leave, I don't think covid is high. There seem to be a lot of teachers on here who are very worried about Covid. It's not something I see in real life. In my experience, we're much more likely to quit over not being allowed to do things that we are over lack of restrictions. If we go online again for example, I will leave. I don't need to work for the money, I do it because I love it. But teaching online is not teaching.

Also, it's not really a plan as much as a reality? That is what has been happening for over a year now.

I haven’t seen any teachers on here scared of Covid. That line is quite old now. Sadly, I’ve known many who have left as it’s been the final straw.

Maybe, just maybe the reality of doing nothing is why they have no teachers and didn’t hit their ITT recruitment target, as reality dawned.

I didn't say scared, I said very worried. Big difference. There are lots and lots of posts from people saying that they are anxious about being at school. Lots of people saying they feel unsafe. Lots saying they feel nobody cares about their health. To me that suggests they are worried. That's not a bad thing. How someone feels about Covid doesn't make them better or worse than anyone else. An opinion about your working conditions is neither a strength nor a weakness.

@theemperorhasnoclothes

I have to say there are two groups of people who I think no-one can reasonably criticise for attending massive crowded indoor events like nightclubs - HCPs and teachers.

It would be the height of hypocrisy to expect teachers NOT to mix indoors with hundreds of people now within minimal mitigations just so they can go to work to - erm - mix indoors with hundreds of people with absolutely no mitigations.

I strongly feel there should be more protections in schools (ventilation, air filtration etc) but there are essentially none for an airborne virus right now and that should be acknowledged. They've been right in the firing line throughout and worked tirelessly. If anyone deserves a good time it's teachers!

Nightclubs arguably safer because the clientele at least has the option to be vaccinated with up to 12 year olds don't.

Here, Here! School staff take risks at work most people don’t have to take Covid- wise so maybe it’s understandable if they aren’t as anxious as better protected individuals about mixing with large groups of people outside the workplace!

“in secondary, equally, those subjects where a teacher is absent, a warm body - from another subject, or support staff - sits in front of the class and the class does busywork.”

Exactly what happened at our school last term geography taught by who was available ,one lesson was maths teacher another lesson was someone new who told them to work out of textbook . 3 weeks no follow on work and that’s year 11 .
GCSE PE was also a wide variety . Ds also had same geography teacher so 3 weeks of different people for him also .

from a safety perspective, I don't think schools should reopen other than for keyworker children. GCSEs and A Levels should be cancelled again.

Whose safety? Your safety?

I think the majority of children and teachers will be more than safe!

And to suggest they exams are to be cancelled for a third year in a row? Are you serious? The poor year 13s have never ever had the chance to take real exams?!

@Blubells

from a safety perspective, I don't think schools should reopen other than for keyworker children. GCSEs and A Levels should be cancelled again.

Whose safety? Your safety?

I think the majority of children and teachers will be more than safe!

And to suggest they exams are to be cancelled for a third year in a row? Are you serious? The poor year 13s have never ever had the chance to take real exams?!

People need to stop offering up to cancel important stuff for dc

I should say I agree Blu

I don't think exams should be cancelled. Despite my concerns about how schools an their staff will limp on, I think we just have to grit our teeth and crack on.

“in secondary, equally, those subjects where a teacher is absent, a warm body - from another subject, or support staff - sits in front of the class and the class does busywork.”

Similar in our 6th form college. Teachers did their very best to set relevant work if absent and most lessons were covered really well. Just being in school and having access to computers is really helpful.

A million times better for their education and mental health than being stuck at home alone!