Mask wearing legalities

[MistressoftheDarkSide]

Disclaimer - am not looking for debate about the benefits or otherwise of mask wearing - totally over that and resigned to the hedging ones bets for the greater good and all that stance.....

However, as a very small independent retailer finally opening my new premises on Thursday, and mindful of the prospect of fines, where can I find out if I as proprietor am in any way liable if someone in my shop refuses to wear a mask but is not exempt?

Quick glance at ye olde Guardian yields an article about fines etc, and another which addresses my concerns but doesn't really answer them, especially with the quote from a police spokesperson that it is expected retailers will be the front line of enforcement.

"https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/29/uk-shops-covid-mask-rules-abuse-omicron-variant

Any thoughts?

Sorry for the random quotation mark - active link is:

www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/29/uk-shops-covid-mask-rules-abuse-omicron-variant

I read this in the Telegraph-

Fines of £200 will be handed out to people in England who fail to wear masks on public transport and in shops. The fines will double with every offence, rising to £400 for a second infraction and £800 for a third, up to a maximum of £6,400

But no mention of who is issuing these fines. I feel for retail staff if they are expected to police this, the abuse will be unreal.

Exactly. Having this conversation with my DP right now. He is in favour of me telling non-mask wearers they have to, or they cant come in, but I'll be alone, we are in an area where people can be "challenging" regardless of pandemic, and I don't want to end up fined myself if I'm complying but my customers aren't. And of course there is the small matter of trying to, you know, make a living or at least cover my overheads....

I wouldn't just from a business point of view, you want to be known as welcoming not that woman who shouts if you don't have a mask on. They'll bullshit too and tell any prospective customers you were abusive to them!

@MistressoftheDarkSide

Exactly. Having this conversation with my DP right now. He is in favour of me telling non-mask wearers they have to, or they cant come in, but I'll be alone, we are in an area where people can be "challenging" regardless of pandemic, and I don't want to end up fined myself if I'm complying but my customers aren't. And of course there is the small matter of trying to, you know, make a living or at least cover my overheads....

Yes, it's coming up to peak trade. You don't want to become known as the place where they question you about masks, and put anyone off. I guess you could out some signs on the door and in the shop and have a supply of disposable masks should anyone ask for one. This will show anyone checking (whoever they may be) that you are acknowledging the new guidelines.

@MistressoftheDarkSide

Exactly. Having this conversation with my DP right now. He is in favour of me telling non-mask wearers they have to, or they cant come in, but I'll be alone, we are in an area where people can be "challenging" regardless of pandemic, and I don't want to end up fined myself if I'm complying but my customers aren't. And of course there is the small matter of trying to, you know, make a living or at least cover my overheads....

This sounds deeply stressful

I know nothing about the legalities but would just advise to make it as easy as possible - have free disposables at the entrance, friendly signs up

Make sure you and your staff are always wearing them, as people will very quickly not bother if they think you're lax on it

Welcome to my cosy spot between a rock and a hard place......

Iif it were my shop i'd put a poster in your shop window reminding customers it's currently a legal requirement, I wouldn't challenge anyone, and I wouldn't worry about policing it, it's not the retailers/staff responsibility. Shopfloor staff abusive is on the rise, and I think this will hit a sore spot with many. I'd wear a mask myself at all times on the shop floor. Don't worry, you won't be fined, just wear your mask and display a notice you'll be fine, and congratulations on your new venture!

Yes good luck with the grand opening on Thursday.

@ollyollyoxenfree

Oh I intend to be as friendly yet compliant as I can as per your excellent advice, thank you

It is stressful after the last couple of years to be starting out on the merry go round again, I guess I would just like to know if I have the leverage to say, look, you'll get fined and so will I so pretty please, here's a free mask you can wear while you try and sniff my incense.....

Thank you @Sparklingbrook and @Mrsfussypants1 your good wishes are very appreciated

www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/29/uk-shops-covid-mask-rules-abuse-omicron-variant

Should have googled properly first lol.

Good old FSB says I can't be fined, so that's a plus..... ah well, just have to see how it goes I suppose!!

@Sparklingbrook

I read this in the Telegraph-

Fines of £200 will be handed out to people in England who fail to wear masks on public transport and in shops. The fines will double with every offence, rising to £400 for a second infraction and £800 for a third, up to a maximum of £6,400

But no mention of who is issuing these fines. I feel for retail staff if they are expected to police this, the abuse will be unreal.

Fines are issued by the police in the form of Fixed Penalty Notices.

Fines are issued by the police in the form of Fixed Penalty Notices.

I gathered that. As the retail staff can’t. But in reality how does that even work. Unless you have police in every shop?
If the staff call the police because someone’s not wearing a mask they’ll rush right over will they?

Well they’ve just had the chief executive of Iceland on Good morning Britain saying he doesn’t expect his staff to challenge people. He said they will ask people to wear one but that’s it. So I think a lot of the big retailers will be doing the same thing. He said he doesn’t want his staff to be put in awkward situations.

I think that’s fair enough. It’s the busiest time for retail they wouldn’t even have time. .But its not fair to make the staff challenge customers about mask wearing and be subjected to abuse that will likely follow.

All of the independent shops near me have a polite sign on the door asking people to wear masks, and a little table just outside or inside the door with hand sanitiser and disposable masks on.

Hey OP

My mum has her own business, if I understand correctly, as long as you can demonstrate that you have done your due diligence then you cannot be responsible for those that enter the premises without a mask. You are not able to enforce the law as you don't have those powers.

I would say, ensure you are wearing a mask and that you put a sign up in the window asking that a mask be worn. That's all you can do.

We had a few days away in a UK city in the summer - a few indepedent shops there actually had signs asking you not to enter without a mask and saying you wouldn't be served. I suspect some of them had come up with this idea together, as I haven't seen it elsewhere.

It's a very hard one for you, OP. You need custom, but why should you have to serve someone who doesn't give a .... about others and is actually breaking the law.

We had a few days away in a UK city in the summer - a few indepedent shops there actually had signs asking you not to enter without a mask and saying you wouldn't be served.

Is that even legal? Isn't it discrimination? Mask exempt due to disability is a thing and those people obviously won't be allowed into the shop.

@Bagelsandbrie

Well they’ve just had the chief executive of Iceland on Good morning Britain saying he doesn’t expect his staff to challenge people. He said they will ask people to wear one but that’s it. So I think a lot of the big retailers will be doing the same thing. He said he doesn’t want his staff to be put in awkward situations.

I was just about to post this. And it doesn't surprise me, because there's nothing in the legislation about shops having a duty not to allow people breaking mask laws onto their premises. It isn't like eg alcohol, cigarettes etc in that respect. It's also different in that there's an easy way to determine whether someone is a particular age whereas no such system exists to ascertain genuine exemptions.

So essentially they aren't going to do the state's job for it.

Put a polite sign in the window, reminding people of the legal requirement to wear masks unless exempt. You are not expected to ask people if they are exempt, and I would not encourage you to do so. People with valid exemption will not mind, but those who are trying to be difficult would take any questions as a reason to kick off.

There were some shops fined and even shut down last year, but they were actively encouraging people not to wear them. You will not be fined if you're doing your bit.

Oh and to answer the original question - you are not responsible for policing the government's ban. The person not wearing the mask gets fined, not the shop staff.

It's not up to you to police it, really.

I am a volunteer in a charity shop - in Scotland - where the wear a mask mandate has never gone away. I just don't feel it's my place or duty to start challenging people. Some of my fellow volunteers do challenge people, customers will either immediately put a mask on saying they'd forgotten, or say they are exempt. Proof of exemption is not a thing so where do you go from there? Stand up shouting match with the customer? Frog march them out of the shop? Call the police and detain the customer until they arrive?

Nobody working or volunteering in a shop should be expected to do that. So you put a notice on the door reminding people they should wear a mask if they can, and leave it at that.