Long covid rare in children

[Bobholll]

Contrary to mumsnet, where long covid is RIFE in children & everyone knows at least 5 who can’t get out of bed, a new study is showing that it’s thankfully rare & most children recover in a week.

The professor also mentions that most those with on-going symptoms recovered over time.

Nice to see they are keeping an eye statistically on this stuff & that it’s very reassuring.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58071898

Post viral fatigue is a well known phenomenon - I don’t think rebadging it as long Covid does anyone any favours

We know this is a risk of viruses. My son was left with Sydenham's chorea after a throat infection 4 months earlier. He missed loads of school and will likely have flair ups until he is 18. I think we need to try to keep things in perspective.

At least research is ongoing and it's current. My son's condition is very rare he was virtually paralyzed down 1 side of his body for 4 Weeks so speech and mobility was affected. No one I know knew anything about this condition

@CatAlice

2% doesn't strike me as rare. That would be several children in every school.

If someone told me that 1 in 50 children could be ill for months after covid I'd be wanting my child vaccinated asap. Several childhood illnesses are less risky than that and we vaccinate.

My DC have suffered from post viral coughs after various viruses. They’re not unwell to the point of me being particularly concerned.

Long covid incorporates the above. I’d obviously be more concerned if they had disabling symptoms months after.

My consultant friend told me he sees lots of people who think they have it but there's nothing wrong with them.

Anyone who is experiencing symptoms long lasting and serious enough to eventually get seen by a consultant should be taken seriously. This kind of dismissive attitude by the medical profession is why people suffer with chronic pain, menopause, chronic fatigue etc in silence with little help or relief.

@AlpineSue

It is 2% of children with Covid symptoms, not 2% of all children, according to that report. That’s presumably where the word rare comes in.

still likely to be more than 1 in 1000 of all kids

"rare" is an unfortunate journalist tag

Re type 1 diabetes, I have it and it was, according to my consultant at the time, most likely triggered by a virus. This was 20+ years ago when I was in my early 20s. The way it was explained to me was that, something in my immune system, probably caused by its genetic structure, reacted to the virus by attacking it, then continuing to attack the insulin producing islets in my pancreas after the virus was fought off until there were none . So to me, if lots and lots of children are getting a virus all at once, some of those are going to be those who are susceptible to t1 diabetes, and its going to be triggered in them so there's a increase in new diagnoses. Almost certainly these are people who would have developed diabetes at some point in their lives when they encountered something that caused their body to react in that way. Appreciate that doesn't make it any easier if its you or your child and I know I would have personally preferred to encounter it much later.

@SinisterBumFacedCat

My consultant friend told me he sees lots of people who think they have it but there's nothing wrong with them.

Anyone who is experiencing symptoms long lasting and serious enough to eventually get seen by a consultant should be taken seriously. This kind of dismissive attitude by the medical profession is why people suffer with chronic pain, menopause, chronic fatigue etc in silence with little help or relief.

They have something else just not long covid.

Smart Alec

Nothing wrong covid wise

Yes but not including those who get long term complications when they had no original symptoms- like the misc children.
I dont think this data can be relied on.
My friend had covid around jan.
She didnt seem to think dc had it.
However since then her dc1 (9yo) has had a lot of stomach ache and vomitting and diarrhoae.
(For context due to restrictions weve had 0-1 possible d&v). Compared to him having like 5. And several trips to gp. So hes missed say 10d extra school in just 6m. Now this might not be covid. But all things like this wont be counted.
The main reason some of us want kids vaxxed is the unknown long term effects.

Imagine if all those who lost smell etc got parkinsons (possibly unlikely but very expensive).
Sars 1 for eg even affected hip joints. We didnt have it here but you notice the countries that did have tried hard to keep out covid.

My consultant friend told me he sees lots of people who think they have it but there's nothing wrong with them

Every single hospital consultant/academic medic I hear on the radio on this topic has suggested, in very kind, carefully phrased and sometimes slightly convoluted language, that long Covid exists but is nowhere near as prevalent as some would like to think, and may often be psychosomatic or related to lockdown trauma.

My consultant friend told me he sees lots of people who think they have it but there's nothing wrong with them.

Define “nothing wrong”. One of the challenging things about chronic fatigue etc is that they defy easy diagnosis. I’ve had numerous blood tests which say there is “nothing wrong” with me. Fortunately my GP is not so dismissive as to believe that just because they can’t find evidence of a problem it doesn’t mean there isn’t one.

Whether or not it’s helpful to call it long covid, covid-19 clearly causes a high prevalence of symptoms that last longer than the initial illness. But there’s such a huge range of symptoms and severity that it’s probably not that useful to lump it all together. Someone who has still has a cough after a month or two but is otherwise well is in a very different situation to someone who is unable they out of bed many months later.

you all shake in fear & worry about propaganda

I'm not shaking or worrying.

Are you cross because we didn't react to the trigger word correctly? If so, you do need to leave mumsnet because there are too many clever people here.

@TempsPerdu

My consultant friend told me he sees lots of people who think they have it but there's nothing wrong with them

Every single hospital consultant/academic medic I hear on the radio on this topic has suggested, in very kind, carefully phrased and sometimes slightly convoluted language, that long Covid exists but is nowhere near as prevalent as some would like to think, and may often be psychosomatic or related to lockdown trauma.

And if people could also remember that there are parents on here with children who are going through the very real effects of long covid, and not apply the above “it’s all on your head/you’re making it up” every single time someone mentions “long covid”.

Yes, it’s not widely prevalent, thank goodness. But honestly @TempsPerdu your post is pretty dismissive of the people that are going through this, who are seeing consultants who are telling them that, for eg in my son’s case, his symptoms are very real and related to his original covid infection.

Sure, “some” cases “may” be due to other causes, but the actual physiological effects are quite hard to mistake. Blithely stating “all the consultants I’ve heard think it’s in your head”, when that’s not at all what “all consultants” think is a bit puzzling. Would you do that for other illnesses?

@Bobholll

Oh god. I need to leave mumsnet. You all shake in fear & worry about propaganda & schools being terribly unsafe 🥴 meanwhile, the in the real world, everyone I know is getting back to normal & praying schools run as normal next year. I was merely posting a positive study.

You guys all enjoy your fear 🙄🤦🏼‍♀️

who is shaking in fear? What a weird reaction to people pointing out inconsistencies in the research. It doesn't mean there isn't good news within that research, but it does mean that the figures are not necessarily what they seem from the headlines.

But if you're happy to 'pray' that things will get back to normal then you don't believe in science anyway, right?

Good news

@SomeKindOfFloppyWeirdo I’m not making any kind of personal judgement whatsoever. I just happen to listen to a fair bit of radio, and am reporting what the medical experts I’ve been hearing are saying. The consensus of those I’ve heard seems to be that there are many factors at play, not just long Covid, and that some cases are psychosomatic/mental health related. But of course other medical professionals would disagree; it’s far from being settled science yet.

And I do wonder why the accusations of ‘dismissal’ can only ever work one way. Why are people so keen to believe that children must routinely suffer terrible consequences from Covid? That ICUs are stuffed full of kids and teens? Why is every piece of worrying evidence jumped on, retweeted and pored over on social media, while encouraging studies (of which there have now been many) are ignored or furious attempts made to discredit them? It’s like no one can ever be allowed to be optimistic about anything Covid related.

So overall children are not the group most affected, thank God.

However, they CAN catch covid, CAN transmit it, CAN have long term effects and very very occasionally DO die from it. (This might seem obvious but all of this was bitterly disputed at different points, including by supposed experts).

The long term effects (and I really dislike the term long Covid actually as it is so vague) are not "rare", if they affect 1 in 50.

It's just the reality.

@TempsPerdu

My consultant friend told me he sees lots of people who think they have it but there's nothing wrong with them

Every single hospital consultant/academic medic I hear on the radio on this topic has suggested, in very kind, carefully phrased and sometimes slightly convoluted language, that long Covid exists but is nowhere near as prevalent as some would like to think, and may often be psychosomatic or related to lockdown trauma.

Indeed. So many on mn either have it or have children with it, some exaggeration perhaps 🤔

@TempsPerdu I would just hope for a bit of balance, you know? Like “I’ve heard consultants say other factors are at play, but it must be tough for the children who are suffering from ongoing physical problems.”

Apologies if I misread, but the tone of “every single hospital consultant/academic medic” is really quite strong and dismissive, isn’t it.

And while I do understand and agree with the second part of your post, it doesn’t make much sense to level at me, when I’ve consistently said it’s thankfully very rare (but awareness - not panic - can’t hurt).

No one on this thread has said that icus are stuffed full of children, or all children are going to get sick or any other such nonsense. Honestly I can’t even see any “furious” rebuttals here. I’m sure you’ve seen that elsewhere online, but it’s certainly not the case on this thread.

Whereas the constant dismissal of long covid as a thing that can (not will and not lots) affect children absolutely is a mumsnet “thing”. Sadly.

But this study says it is 1 in 50 children. So that isn’t rare at all. Regardless what consultants think they have seen in hospital. The study shows it is 1 in 50. Probably never even been to a hospital.

[quote TempsPerdu]@SomeKindOfFloppyWeirdo I’m not making any kind of personal judgement whatsoever. I just happen to listen to a fair bit of radio, and am reporting what the medical experts I’ve been hearing are saying. The consensus of those I’ve heard seems to be that there are many factors at play, not just long Covid, and that some cases are psychosomatic/mental health related. But of course other medical professionals would disagree; it’s far from being settled science yet.

And I do wonder why the accusations of ‘dismissal’ can only ever work one way. Why are people so keen to believe that children must routinely suffer terrible consequences from Covid? That ICUs are stuffed full of kids and teens? Why is every piece of worrying evidence jumped on, retweeted and pored over on social media, while encouraging studies (of which there have now been many) are ignored or furious attempts made to discredit them? It’s like no one can ever be allowed to be optimistic about anything Covid related.[/quote]
This.
You are not allowed to be optimistic about the effects of covid on children. Only worse possible scenario allowed. The ITC are not stuffed with children with covid and the vast majority of children don't have long covid either

Indeed. So many on mn either have it or have children with it, some exaggeration perhaps 🤔

Oh and there it fucking is again. Beautifully timed example. Do you say that to cancer patients as well @TheTallOakTrees or do you just save your disbelief for covid? Pathetic.

You know some have long covid with just a diminished smell a few weeks later. Any lasting effects count doesn't have to be major effects at all to qualify as long covid

The locum at my GP surgery is convinced I have long covid. I am convinced I have long lockdown.

His concern started when I answered the phone for a telephone appointment very breathless - he asked me all sorts of questions about whether I'd had covid, how long ago etc. I did try and explain that the reason for my breathlessness was that I'd run up two flights of stairs to get the phone. He wasn't having any of it - I shouldn't be so out of breath just moving around the house. Well yes. But I have basically sat on my butt since March 2020 working from home and have developed an unhealthy obsession with Pringles and Haagen das (in my defence, not at the same time). So of course I'm breathless.

I was promptly sent questionnaires to fill in to see if I could join a long covid study. The questions were ridiculous - it was all about my health now but nothing about what my health was like before covid. And nothing to pick up if there were other reasons for a change in health (eg, I used to cycle 20 minutes to and from local station and then walk 30 minutes to and from office every day and now I don't do any exercise).

I am obviously very pleased the GP locum was thorough and thoughtful. And I'd love to blame the state of my health on a virus as opposed to laziness. But I really don't think I have long covid.

@TheTallOakTrees wow I really hope you don’t say that out loud to anyone you know. So dismissive! I think if you look at the thread properly, nobody is saying that ICU wards are full of children - am I mistaken? So why are you arguing against something that’s not even happening? What is this obsession with it having to be every single child affected or it’s not a problem? It’s so strange.