Do you think France will stay amber plus and will more countries join it?

[solarlights]

Not really understanding the rationale behind this and how the decisions are made when the UK seems in a worse position than pretty much anywhere else at the moment.

The UK travel policy is a complete mess.

You cannot keep variants out if they have a spreading advantage over previous ones.

Cases don't matter anymore

Therefore all restrictions should be lifted.

@starfro you’re right as we’ve seen with every variant so far.
The thought of a packed campsite in the UK is completely unappealing and seems more of a COVID spreading ground than going abroad tbh.

The rationale behind the change in France I think is not solely to do with the virus. Cases are much higher in neighbouring Belgium and the Netherlands.

The charitable possibility (which I don't accept) is that the UK government does not understand that French 'colonies' in the Indian Ocean and Carribbean are treated as if part of France (they vote for the President, sent people to the Assemblee Nationale). The Beta variant cases are largely in Reunion, in the Indian Ocean.

The more likely reason is a form of economic sanctions in disguise, because of the belief that the French are the main obstacle to the EU agreeing to renegotiate the Northern Ireland protocol.

A third possibility is just being seen to do something about the increased number of Covid cases. Instead of keeping face coverings by law and restricting large gatherings.

I think the French quarantine decision is political rather than based on any genuine concerns about case numbers there. Keeping my fingers crossed that France might be moved back to the green list before too long.

Yes and yes

I am following this thread with interest as my parents are in France.

Work is being great and has agreed to change their leave policy to let me take all my leave at once (So I can see them and quarantine, which is great.) But I'd love to not have to, or only quarantine for five days.

Our flatmate had Covid last year, and selfish as it sounds, I found the isolation of our entire household really really difficult (I developed agrophobia afterwards, and think this was connected.)

Anyway, would love love love not to quarantine, though obviously the priority is seeing my Mum and Dad, as my Dad's not well.

There was lots of talk about Spain and Greece being next but that’s all gone quiet now.
I understand there won’t be any more additions until Aug 2nd at least but if you believe that you believe anything lol

That sounds hard, I really hope things change for you @theotherfossilsister.
I coped quite well with everything until a couple of months ago but feel I’m spiralling now. The uncertainty and constant change in messages is really affecting me badly.

They say the reason behind France being on the Amber+ list is because of the rise in beta (formerly known as South African variant) cases however France have said in response that the reason for the rise in beta cases is due to a French oversea territory called Réunion located near Madagascar reporting cases however mainland France has minimal amount of cases. Greece and Portugal have more beta cases however ministers have said it’s unlikely they’ll be added to the Amber+ list.

To answer your question, yes more can definitely be added but is it likely? Right now - doesn’t seem to be. I think France will come off by the end of August.

The rationale I’m sure is exactly as newnorthener says. It’s bloody infuriating. We can’t even be trusted to transit (I’m referring to travel in a private vehicle, then on to Eurotunnel) through France like we could last year without quarantine. To avoid quarantine when holidaying in France (if travelling in your own private vehicle) you either have to travel back by Hook of Holland, Bilbao or Santander. So there is a way round it, but not hugely practical and the cost of sailing back from Spain is astronomical.

Then there’s all the utter shite that those vaccinated abroad (even when they’ve had the same approved vaccines as those vaccinated in the U.K.) are classed/ treated as unvaccinated so have to quarantine.

I’m really hoping for a u-turn.

It seems everyone has forgotten that the issue isn't that they're a risk to us, it's that we're a risk to them.

@NannyAndJohn why do we have to quarantine when we get home if amber+ then?

NannyAndJohn that's not the reason for the UK quarantine policy though - nor the fact that the UK is not recognising Pfizer, moderna or Astra vaccinations done in the EU as real.

Amber plus is to do with high levels of sout African variant. Not cases I general.

@WhiskeryWoman

The rationale I’m sure is exactly as newnorthener says. It’s bloody infuriating. We can’t even be trusted to transit (I’m referring to travel in a private vehicle, then on to Eurotunnel) through France like we could last year without quarantine. To avoid quarantine when holidaying in France (if travelling in your own private vehicle) you either have to travel back by Hook of Holland, Bilbao or Santander. So there is a way round it, but not hugely practical and the cost of sailing back from Spain is astronomical.

Then there’s all the utter shite that those vaccinated abroad (even when they’ve had the same approved vaccines as those vaccinated in the U.K.) are classed/ treated as unvaccinated so have to quarantine.

I’m really hoping for a u-turn.

Yes this last point is ridiculous. My SIL is having to miss FIL funeral this week even though she is fully vaccinated and coming from a country with low rates.

The beta (south African) varient has been in the UK since early July - stable doors and horses which have already bolted spring to mind...

www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/covid-19/variants-concern

sorry wrong link before, this one:

www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-variants-genomically-confirmed-case-numbers/variants-distribution-of-case-data-16-july-2021

I'd be surprised if they moved it off. It appears to not be linked to the data that's supposed to govern the traffic light system and rather is;

a) Driven by politics
b) A cheap and lazy way of cutting down on the numbers travelling by basically making Euro Tunnel nul and void.

So if it makes little sense to be on there, you can't really expect them to take it off. I think they really wanted to red list but got told that it would be impossible.

If we have massive cases and then see them fall due to the vaccines/herd immunity then the traffic light system should be scrapped, but that would be being logical so...

I think the issue with France is that it's easy for people to travel via France using the channel tunnel and channel ferries, from other countries which aren't green, and not declaring their real country of origin, i.e. saying they've only been in France when in reality, they've been to Spain/Portgal/Italy etc. My neighbours did that last Summer. They'd been in their holiday home in Spain, but when they drove back into the UK, they dodged quarantine etc by saying they'd been travelling around France.

@NannyAndJohn

It seems everyone has forgotten that the issue isn't that they're a risk to us, it's that we're a risk to them.

There are places in Europe with higher infection rates than the UK.

It seems everyone has forgotten that the issue isn't that they're a risk to us, it's that we're a risk to them.
How are we a risk to them? And who is "them"? And why do you think we will have amber+ to protect them?

But yes, if France is Amber+ then it's only fair for Spain and Greece to go on that list as well.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/that-french-trip-may-be-back-on-but-spains-at-risk-sdmh2nj82

It’s behind a paywall, but you can get the jist from what you can see….

@WhiskeryWoman- thanks for article link. Interesting read x