Alternatives to AstraZeneca (not an anti vax thread) - Thread 3

[Mixmeup]

Just thought I’d start a new one as the last one is full and everyone on it was so kind and helpful.

After much soul searching I had my second AZ shot this week. I’m really anxious now as I’m in the ‘risk period’ but so far not as bad as last time because it feels like a steadier situation. Last time I had it was just before they stopped using it in various countries for under 60ish people and then here for my age group. I’m still scared though.

Latest MHRA report is out and seems to show things as pretty steady. I suppose most people now are getting second dose AZ or Pfizer if younger (eg my age )

www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-adverse-reactions/coronavirus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting

How’s everyone doing?

If it is all political, and a.z and pfizer have the same associated risks, why are certain age groups only getting pfizer? Do not come on this board and patronise. We are listening to the governments advice. They said that the risk of the a.z jab outweighed the risk of covid for all people under 50. Then the gave all under 40s the pfizer....and abandoned the 40- 50 range. I am not a scientist and I am going to listen to the advice of the government. But they then abandoned my age range....so I tried to get the pfizer. And stop with the 'sigh'

@Olliphant this is a new study. Out last week. Led by Spain with scientists also from the Netherlands and Britain. Scientists and government are learning as they go. I read the new studies in the lancet. The government will eventually catch up.

[quote Blessex]You do all know that the latest study out shows that the risk of blood clot is the same for both AZ and Pfizer……? Honestly it’s all politics and you are all falling for it. And not only that the ranking of vaccines is now affecting the developing world - notable Africa - because they think they are getting a ‘lesser vaccine’ and are dying in droves now. Sigh

Read the latest research. PFIZER HAS SAME BLOOD CLOT RISK AS AZ. Seems it also has a heart risk too. But jog on with the misinformation.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.euronews.com/next/amp/2021/07/29/astrazeneca-covid-19-vaccine-blood-clot-risk-similar-to-pfizer-spanish-study-finds

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/inews.co.uk/news/health/astrazeneca-vaccine-blood-clot-risk-pfizer-covid-jab-study-1127179/amp[/quote]
Yes all political- brexit, Europe snappy over our vaccine rollout etc.

German media was making up tales about the AZ vaccine right from the start: inews.co.uk/news/science/how-german-newspapers-got-verdict-on-oxford-vaccine-wrong-845411

Please can someone advise why the yellow card scheme for the UK is showing VITT risk only for the AZ vaccine?
Are the blood clots associated with other vaccines a different type? I have had a different vaccine now anyway myself, but others may still be trying to decide what to do. It was the VITT risk that specifically concerned me

I’m new to this but wish I had seen it a few months ago. I’m cv so had my first AZ in February. Before I was due my second the risk of the rare blood clots was revealed. I already have issues with my brain and didn’t want to risk it. I spoke to a doctor at my second vaccine appointment and they said if my first dose didn’t kill me the second wouldn’t.
I left without a second dose.
I spoke to my gp who thankfully, knows me quite well, and they booked me in for a Pfizer second dose.
I had that in late may and I’ve been fine since.
I am worried they may try and give me an AZ booster but I feel confident to ask for Pfizer and politely refuse the booster if AZ is all that’s offered.
I have also had covid and as of February (before my first vaccine) I still had a high level of anti bodies. That was 11 months after having covid.
I’m pretty confident my body has the antibodies to deal with any infection of covid in the next 12 months even without further vaccination.
I hope all who are trying to get an alternative vaccine are successful.

@RubyReigns read the latest science. You have as much chance of a clot with Pfizer as AZ.

@tintodeverano2 exactly. First macron. Then Merkel. Brexit blues. All very well if it not now affecting people in Africa and causing unnecessary deaths.

Why does everyone think the USA and the EU backed the USA- German produced vaccine Pfizer? Coincidence?

@Blessex
As you have the information on this, please can you point out where in the reports it says that VITT is just as likely with Pfizer as AZ? I can't see this information anywhere relating specifically to VITT.

@scarlettsunset

I posted it up thread multiple times !! Read the thread. Here are the links again.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.euronews.com/next/amp/2021/07/29/astrazeneca-covid-19-vaccine-blood-clot-risk-similar-to-pfizer-spanish-study-finds

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/inews.co.uk/news/health/astrazeneca-vaccine-blood-clot-risk-pfizer-covid-jab-study-1127179/amp

[quote Blessex]@scarlettsunset

I posted it up thread multiple times !! Read the thread. Here are the links again.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.euronews.com/next/amp/2021/07/29/astrazeneca-covid-19-vaccine-blood-clot-risk-similar-to-pfizer-spanish-study-finds

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/inews.co.uk/news/health/astrazeneca-vaccine-blood-clot-risk-pfizer-covid-jab-study-1127179/amp[/quote]
Hi.
Many thanks. I have read the links but I am clearly being stupid as I can't see where it says that the specific type of blood clot occurs with the same frequency. I can only see it mentioning DVT. I am genuinely trying to understand whether the specific issue reported with AZ is actually happening with the same frequency with other vaccines. And if so, whether it is occurring at the same frequency in the same age ranges etc. The yellow card reporting site doesn't seem to suggest that it is, and I honestly can't spot where this report says it either.

Blessex, your links don't say what you claim they do.

read the latest science. You have as much chance of a clot with Pfizer as AZ.

Blessex Why does everyone think the USA and the EU backed the USA- German produced vaccine Pfizer? Coincidence?

Just quoting a couple of similar posts above rather than singling out specific posters - I’d like to know why the different vaccines are being distributed by age group of there is no difference between them/it’s political etc etc? Anyone???

You do all know that the latest study out shows that the risk of blood clot is the same for both AZ and Pfizer……? Honestly it’s all politics and you are all falling for it.

Although there a few reports of a rare blood clotting side-effects after Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine, in the way that VITT has been defined – these cases appear to be only associated with the Oxford/AstraZeneca jab, the researchers also said.

“We’ve kept an open mind,” said Dr Catherine Bagot, consultant haematologist at Glasgow Royal Infirmary, and senior clinical lecturer at the University of Glasgow. “The Pfizer vaccine has not – for the cases that we are aware of – been able to meet the definition either of a confirmed case or a probable case.”

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/11/oxfordastrazeneca-vaccine-rare-blood-clot-syndrome-has-high-mortality-rate

www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/08/10/clot-a10.html

Here is the science again.

@milkyaqua I strongly recommend to read the data and not some Guardian journo!

www.wsws.org/en/articles/2021/08/10/clot-a10.html

Who is quoting a professor who has clearly also read data...

@Blessex
Are you referring to this actual paper which is a preprint and still has to be peer reviewed?
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3886421
This paper does not address Cerebral venous sinus thrombosis (CVST). This is a specific different ‘blood clot’ which has a proven link to AstraZeneca. The paper does not account for CVST diagnosed in hospital which considering that this is a life threatening illness would account for the majority of cases. On reading the paper you will note that they actually acknowledge this.
CVST currently has a 1 in 50,000 incidence in the 18-48 age group with 17% fatality rate. This is not anti vaccination propaganda or politically driven but actually published on a weekly report by our own MHRA
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-adverse-reactions/coronavirus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting
Just to bring balance, CVST is still an extremely rare event but it should not be dismissed. In order to maintain public confidence in all medical treatments going forward it is so important to be open and transparent about any side effects which should always be presented in a balanced way that explains risk v benefits.
I believe that the way this was presented in a televised press conference with Professor Jonathan Van-Tam back in April with charts from the University of Cambridge Winton Centre for Risk and Evidence Communication was the correct way to communicate risk v benefits.

@Blessex it would be worth reading back through the threads to gain a full understanding of the concerns of regular posters on this thread. The concern hasn’t been regarding the incidence of generic blood clots but the risk of VITT, which is a very serious type of blood clot resulting in a 17 percent fatality rate. The weekly yellow card data published by the government very clearly shows that the risk of VITT is substantially higher with AZ. Standard blood clots are much more easily treated with less risk of long term implications. VITT has a high fatality rate, can cause long term implications for those effected, surviving it doesn’t mean the individual doesn’t have life changing damage and the risk of serious clots remains for sometime after the initial clots, due to low platelet levels remaining so it’s very different to more generic clots. The risk of VITT also increases in younger people and females are believed to be at greater risk. I don’t think anyone is saying that Pfizer is risk free but these threads haven’t been about the risk of more generic blood clots.

I hope everyone else is doing ok. I’m finally past the 42 day mark, after my second AZ, it feels like the biggest weight has been lifted after five months of stress! These boards were my saviour during that time, so a huge thank you to all of you who shared information and offered support.

Woo hoo! That is great news and a huge relief for you! I too have relied on this board for support, a tiny space where we could explain our fears in peace. So happy for you Rainbowsandstorms!