Confused by end of bubbles/self isolation rules

[BaffledBerluga]

Just catching up on the earlier update about the end of school bubbles and I am very confused. So bubbles are ending on 19th July, but the need for under 18s to isolate after a positive contact doesn't end until August 16th? I know many schools will have finished by this time, but many children will still be attending holiday clubs/nurseries over the summer.

So what happens if someone at a nursery tests positive between 19th July and 16th August? Is it just a case of PHE trying to ascertain who was a close contact? Hard to understand how that would be possible with nursery age children. I imagine they would still all end up isolating.

Anyone understood it any clearer than me?

I’m so pleased you’ve asked this because it’s completely baffled me too! Following along in the hope someone comes along with an answer soon!

Not 100% sure but yes I think test and trace identify close contacts and only those have to isolate.

And then after 16th August they won't need to isolate - only if they actually test positive

I also want to know this! DD is in holiday club for the first two weeks of the holidays, and if that bubble bursts there’s a risk we won’t be able to go away.

Bubbles and self isolation for being a close contact are different things.

Bubble just refers to the number of people that a child could come into contact with in a school day. For primaries this will be their class of 30, for secondaries it’s usually their year group of up to 250. In secondaries only close contacts (those sitting near to a positive case or in the same room for a long period) are asked to isolate. Not the whole bubble.

Bubbles won’t be needed from 19th July meaning all children can mix with other classes or year groups on playgrounds etc. If one tests positive then close contacts need to be traced. This will probably be their whole class still as,especially at primary, it’s not known who they have been near. Larger groups would only really have mixed on the playground so shouldn’t need to isolate.

@bookworm14

I also want to know this! DD is in holiday club for the first two weeks of the holidays, and if that bubble bursts there’s a risk we won’t be able to go away.

It’s not about a “bubble bursting”.

Between 19th July and 16th August of your child is a close contact of a positive case yes they will have to isolate.

Here is the DFE guidance for step 4 from 19th July:

Tracing close contacts and isolation

When England moves to Step 4 of the roadmap, we will be removing the need to keep children and young people in consistent groups (‘bubbles’) in schools, colleges and out-of-school settings and the need to reduce mixing in early years settings.

Also from Step 4, education and childcare settings will not routinely be required to undertake contact tracing for children and young people. We expect settings to continue to fulfil their contact tracing responsibilities up to Step 4 (or six days after term ends – whichever is earlier). From that point onwards, close contacts will be identified directly by NHS Test and Trace. Settings may be contacted in exceptional cases to help with identifying close contacts, as currently happens in managing other infectious diseases. Pupils and students who test positive will be subject to the normal test and trace process, which will identify close contacts. This is likely to be a small number of individuals who would be most at risk of contracting COVID-19 due to the nature of the close contact.

I'm confused too! Our school doesn't break up until 22 July - what if there is a case on the class between the 19th and 22nd? Presumably still self isolation for the class (primary age)?

@BlackLambAndGreyFalcon as the DFE guidance above states- after 19th July only close contacts should be traced, not an entire class.

I honestly don’t think that matters anymore, am afraid :-(
Earlier I’ve bumped into a neighbour with her primary age child, in plain sight of the local school…and she cheerfully tells me that his bubble is burst and he’s waiting for results of his test and for 10 days school is off….all this, in the middle of the road whilst they are happily going for a walk.

I didn’t think the concept of isolation was so difficult.
Imagine the rest

So @Santastealer my DD is at a nursery with less than 30 children anyway so they have all been in one bubble until now. So does this mean no real difference until August? As presumably nursery age children will all need to isolate anyway if they have been in together as you can't really monitor who is playing with who.

Anyway, I'm glad I wasn't the only one who was confused!

@BaffledBerluga technically the whole group should no longer be identified as the nursery wouldn’t be the ones sending home and instructing issues to isolate anymore, it would be down to track and trace to do that.

@Santastealer but how will they define close contact? OK the people sat near the child in question, but how on earth will they know who the child played with in the playground?

@cherin I entirely agree. Our school currently has 2 bubbles sent home. It was our bubbles' sports afternoon today. There were at least 3 siblings in the isolating classes with their parents there today.

I hope ds's sn school bubble stays until the end of term. I don't want extra mixing until self isolation of contacts ends. He is also now used to being with only a small group of children and I don't think the last week of term is the time to change that

My understanding is that it won't be the school or nursery who has the responsibility of identifying contacts after the 19th. Parents of positive child should tell test and trace that they were at xyz school or nursery and then they will contact the school or nursery. In reality, for young children who don't sit at a desk all day this will still be a whole class who are a contact.

[quote BlackLambAndGreyFalcon]@Santastealer but how will they define close contact? OK the people sat near the child in question, but how on earth will they know who the child played with in the playground?

@cherin I entirely agree. Our school currently has 2 bubbles sent home. It was our bubbles' sports afternoon today. There were at least 3 siblings in the isolating classes with their parents there today. [/quote]
They won’t care who they played with in the playground.

They know that in another 4 weeks time kids won’t be isolating anyway and so from 19th July to 16th August they’ve made it that barely any child will be asked to isolate anyway.