New Australia/New Zealand (and other "eliminationist" countries) thread

[Kokeshi123]

www.executivetraveller.com/news/overseas-airlines-consider-cutting-australian-flights-until-2022

This is a bit worrying: "International airlines will be forced to re-evaluate flying to Australia for at least the next six months, following today's decision by the federal government to halve the number of overseas passengers allowed into the country. Prime Minster Scott Morrison said today that international arrivals to Australia will be limited to just over 3,000 passengers per week – down from a current cap of 6,000 – until early 2022, although home quarantine would be trialled for vaccinated travellers later this year. While Morrison said the measure was a necessary response to containing the spread of the COVID-19 Delta variant, it could see several foreign airlines cease flying to Australia entirely until those caps are lifted sometime in 2022." It's not surprising in a way (commercial viability of half-empty planes etc.) but if this goes ahead, it's going to be hard for those who have to leave for truly essential reasons, such as immigrants relocating back to their own countries. I mean, what would you do in such circumstances--take a boat to Indonesia and fly out from there?

I saw the below article this morning. Peter Gluckman is a well respected scientist, and well known in NZ, so it will be no accident or coincidence that he's been interviewed.

It seems that expectations are now being managed for not "zero covid", but "some covid", and a heads up for everyone to get vaccinated when called, as opening is coming.

Yay. 🎉

i.stuff.co.nz/business/the-monitor/125318890/covid19-how-new-zealand-might-reconnect-with-the-world-after-nearly-500-days-locked-down

Opening is coming in about 2025 for Australia based on the amorphous plan announced today. Nothing to celebrate for those of us trying to get home.

It’s disgraceful. Yet another betrayal of citizens.

If you really need to leave the way to do it is to fly to NZ and go out from there. Ofc you run the risk of getting stuck abroad - but at least you can get out. Ludicrous situation all round.

At least the vaccinations seem to be picking up. 30% of adults have now had one jab and apparently the % with both will massively increase over the next few weeks as we’re only leaving 3 weeks between doses.

I’m hoping with the new outbreaks more people will get their vaccine.

The next stage of opening up can’t happen until so many people have their vaccines, im also hoping there are enough people who want to get back to norma who are willing to vaccinate.

I do think it's picking up, and businesses are going to end up driving demand, especially once we have the Pfizer availability. The company I work for is updating HSE guidance, so no international travel can now be approved without proof of vaccination, and looking into what we do for domestic and site visits. That's likely to be common across most, if not all resource companies.

^ So basically they will get out of it by coercing people into a vaccine under threat of losing your job or being able to travel? Lovely, Australia are super authoritarian despite their image.

@Jiboo2

^ So basically they will get out of it by coercing people into a vaccine under threat of losing your job or being able to travel? Lovely, Australia are super authoritarian despite their image.

No, not authoritarian. We like to function as an ordinary country does.

@Jiboo2

^ So basically they will get out of it by coercing people into a vaccine under threat of losing your job or being able to travel? Lovely, Australia are super authoritarian despite their image.

They may end up with one of the lowest deaths per 100,000 in the world so there's that.

Well yes, if you want to go to an offshore plant, in the middle of nowhere, with very tight living quarters, then yes, I think HSE will say you do need to be vaccinated, and not sure there's much wrong with that. And I should have specified it's international business travel on behalf of company as from an HSE perspective then our company would be responsible for any health issues that arise, so they will be extremely cautious.

Australia has basically mandated vaccination for children for years without much of an outcry. It’s vaccination for goodness sake - a thing that keeps both the vaccinated and the selfish fuckers who don’t want to be vaccinated, safe.
And yes, I’m perfectly ok with healthcare workers and those who work in ages care being mandated to get this safe vaccine.
People are choosing the weirdest hills to die on. Lifesaving vaccinations? Come on.

@Jiboo2

^ So basically they will get out of it by coercing people into a vaccine under threat of losing your job or being able to travel? Lovely, Australia are super authoritarian despite their image.

Yes - and the majority of Australian support this.

There is existing precedence with mandatory vaccines for school, government benefits, travel into certain countries, and some jobs.

People will have a choice not to vaccinate however there should be restrictions on what they have the right to do in putting at risk our population. This includes access to the workplace - not this is workplace not job. Likewise once borders do reopen, anyone inbound must be vaccinated.

Rather than authoritarian I would define this as utilitarian.

I would say the a nation that forbids its citizens to leave the country is borderline authoritarian.
Borders closed since March 2020 and not prospect of opening any time soon.
People are very keen to be vaccinated, the problem is lack of vaccines since Pfizer will arrive in October and the Astra Zeneca is having a lot of confusion talks around it.

Australia bought vaccines way after the other countries , in October last year, and was of course put at the bottom of the queue.

It is horrible to feel a prisoner in a country.

@GordonPym

I would say the a nation that forbids its citizens to leave the country is borderline authoritarian. Borders closed since March 2020 and not prospect of opening any time soon. People are very keen to be vaccinated, the problem is lack of vaccines since Pfizer will arrive in October and the Astra Zeneca is having a lot of confusion talks around it.

Australia bought vaccines way after the other countries , in October last year, and was of course put at the bottom of the queue.

It is horrible to feel a prisoner in a country.

I'm getting my Pfizer vaccination next week so I'm not certain why you think they don't arrive until October?

My husband and I are both having our Pfizer next week as well. 30% of adults have already had one jab. It’s not quite as dire as it initially looked.

The challenge is supply after 1b - thanks to our wonderful PM's total bungled Pfizer negotiations. we're running very low on stock (QLD to run out this week), and the next bulk batch is not due. Despite urging from State Premiers and medical bodies, Liberal Government will not confirm when this stock will be delivered. This is a key reason for a lack of vaccination campaigns to get on top of vaccine hesitancy.

We also have supply deals for Moderna and Novavax, which is great, but only if those vaccines are approved by regulators. And it's taking time. Next year (+12 months) should be better with Victoria building a new facility to produce mRNA vaccines locally.

I'm lucky that I my work was re-prioritised into 1b, friends my age (early 30s) are choosing to have AZ despite advice. A group of 20 made it a day out the morning after approval was granted for under 60s. No wonder last week was record breaking number for jabs.