Deaths after 28 days

[Tealightsandd]

What are they recorded as? Cardiac issues? Stroke? Sepsis? Pneumonia?
Or still Covid but just not included in the official death count - including the daily report?

I've been wondering if there's more dying after 28 days now that it's younger and/or vaccinated people in hospital? They might take longer to die.

Death rate too low for your narrative and you’re trying to think of ways it simply can’t be true?

Yes, there’s loads of young people in hospital with Covid but they’re all dying on day 30 so it’s not being counted. As if! Get a grip.

Individuals can get covid as cause of Death > 28 days, on the death certificate. ONS reports these data, maybe 10 days after the 28 day statistic is released, might be weekly or fortnightly.

To assemble statistics sooner & in a consistent way when death certificates aren't available, and to avoid bias introduced by a doctor scratching head to decide if covid was what really carried someone off, within 28 days is useful way to attribute recent relevant deaths.

ps: all the treatments that work well to prevent covid deaths, are more effective for younger people than they are for older adults, so basically, young people who survive at least 28 days with covid are the group least likely to progress to death from covid.

No idea what Delatron is rambling on about.

Thanks for the replies lljkk

I was thinking more of the daily death announcement. If - and I say if it's artificially low, it could encourage dangerous complacency. We need accurate data to be able to make informed decisions.

Is that definitely the case about the treatments? Work better on the young?

I heard they worked well with all ages? Although I'm thinking of treatments like Regeneron, that's been in use in America for a while but only just been approved here. It's very expensive so I guess might not be widely used?

The death rate is ‘artificially low’. Well that’s a new angle for you I guess!

@Delatron

The death rate is ‘artificially low’. Well that’s a new angle for you I guess!

Definitely if quoted out of context...

You forgot to include in the quote my emphasised if.

Talking of stepping. I'm buying a new stepladder at the weekend.

As you can see the current difference between 28 and 60 days is negligible

I can't read that link clearly. I was thinking of recent weeks - so people recently hospitalised, particularly with the Delta variant, rather than cumulative (from the start of the pandemic). It's good news if it is indeed only a small difference.

I suspect if anything it's artificiality high as it's any cause of death within 28 days of a positive test isn't it? That captures people who test positive but then have a heart attack/car crash or who were end stage terminally ill of something else. So they died within the timeframe but perhaps not "of" Covid.

Regeneron is the drug given to Trump. We recently approved it for NHS use on seriously ill patients. That's good news. It definitely seemed to help him recover well.

@GU24Mum

I suspect if anything it's artificiality high as it's any cause of death within 28 days of a positive test isn't it? That captures people who test positive but then have a heart attack/car crash or who were end stage terminally ill of something else. So they died within the timeframe but perhaps not "of" Covid.

To quote another poster. Negligible numbers. We know that because of the excess deaths data.

The daily rate is not a very accurate rate to look at. You need to look at the ONS statistics to get a true rate as this is based on death certificate figures. It takes out car crash but had covid etc...... as a car crash victim would have massive trauma, internal bleeding etc.... and that is what would be written on the death certificate.

We know that it is not uncommon for Covid patients, particularly but not only younger healthier, to take longer to die. Hence why I wondered about the 28 days cut off.

Another related issue is the fairly high number of patients who seemingly recovered, were discharged from hospital, but then suffered a relapse and died several months later.

I've been wondering if there's more dying after 28 days now that it's younger and/or vaccinated people in hospital? They might take longer to die

People always did take longer to die. I was talking to a consultant I know who said that typically a death in ICU happened more than 28 days after diagnosis.

www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210423/covid-study-deaths-months-after-infection

Long-haul COVID-19 patients face many health threats including a higher chance of dying up to 6 months after they catch the virus, according to a massive study

This is from America but the same thing happening here too. Someone posted a BMJ link yesterday on another thread.

doi.org/10.1136/bmj.n693

I think it was this one.

That's the one.
Thank you @Backofbeyond50

@Tealightsandd

Another related issue is the fairly high number of patients who seemingly recovered, were discharged from hospital, but then suffered a relapse and died several months later.

Maybe it's because the average age of a death is around 82, or higher than the current life expectancy in the UK? They have had it, recovered (or been asymptomatic and not suffered) and then died naturally. I'm not saying that is the case for all. I know of a few people who have been at death's door with other serious issues and ended up on end of life care in hospital to be suddenly diagnosed with covid (estimates of the previous waves say that 30 to 40 % of all cases were caught in hospitals). That is then mentioned on their death certificate and it gets included in the stats.

@Backofbeyond50

doi.org/10.1136/bmj.n693

I think it was this one.

Well that puts me in my place.

@Tealightsandd

Another related issue is the fairly high number of patients who seemingly recovered, were discharged from hospital, but then suffered a relapse and died several months later.

I do know 2 colleagues that sadly died of COVID after a long delay, both paramedics with no other health issues.

One was constantly in the news as he was very well thought of among his colleagues, every week the Thursday clap outside the hospital he was in you could see banners with his name on. He caught Covid in the first week of April and sadly died on 12th May on his birthday. (6 weeks later)

The other colleague, again another paramedic, caught Covid in March 2020 at the beginning of the pandemic, but he caught it again in November and sadly died of it.

So it may be these figures that you think may be missing from statistics if only 28 days from diagnoses is counted

If someone dies from a Long Covid symptom after living with it for 7 months or so, would they be counted as COVID or the sympton it triggered, eg Diabetes etc

What about those poor people who gave been in hospital for months, often on ventilators or in ICU as their bodies have been unable to recover after Covid? If God forbid they die, what is their cause of death?