Why is vaccine uptake so low for care workers?

[Hamilbamil]

1/6th of workers haven't had it despite it being available and being urged to for months! We're at just under 80% take up for the country at large with most under 30s either still waiting or not even able to book yet for the youngest groups. It seems likely that we'll get to 90% without breaking much of a sweat!

I'm puzzled by this apparent correlation between being a care home worker and being anti-vacs. It seems totally bizarre, but there must be a reason.

@Rubyrecka

It's going to become compulsory soon and rightly so. Get another job if you don't want to take the necessary precautions to protect the vulnerable people who are cared for.

Oh, be careful what you wish for.

I bet you 'Covid Passport' has waaaay more information encrypted in it that you'll know about! .

I get what you're saying wake up. It's the way some posters worded it - basically calling us all stupid and we don't know what's best for us. It just upset me.
My dh had a stroke 10 days after his jab....I'm sure that would have put my colleagues off if we hadn't already had both our jabs!

there is understandable vaccine hesitancy among some ethnic minorities who make up a large proportion of care workers

^^ this.

I taught in an international college for a while, some students were, superstitious is not quite the word for it but a belief in JuJu wasn't uncommon.

One student told me that the president of Malawi is a witch and could hang his coat in mid air. If you crossed him he would send a swarm of bees to kill you. About half the class nodded along in agreement while I was getting rolled eyes from others.

Lots thought the part of application forms asking for ethnicity was used to select people to interview.

As for 'understandable' have a look at the Tuskergee study

www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/history/40-years-human-experimentation-america-tuskegee-study

If you've had Covid there's no need to get the vaccine. This isn't being mentioned though

I wondered about that when Bo Jo had his jabs

*Have a look at this data for care workers:

www.skillsforcare.org.uk/adult-social-care-workforce-data/Workforce-intelligence/publications/national-information/The-state-of-the-adult-social-care-sector-and-workforce-in-England.aspx

The go to the qualifications section:

90% of care workers in adult care have under level 4 qualifications. Only 10% have qualifications above level 4. Most have entry or level 1 qualifications - A level 2 qualification is similar to a GCSE.

Care certificates, moving and handling, etc etc etc are considered low level qualifications*

I don’t see where you are reading those stats, page 98 of the document says that 2% of the workforce hold an entry level or level 1 qualification. Most have not completed training in care yet, or hold a level 2 or 3 qualification.

Care courses are much more in depth than any first aid and moving or handling class. A level 3 qualification is much closer to the first couple of years at university than it is a GCSE.

Anyway, it’s a moot point because the statistics are only about the care qualifications the workforce holds, not level of education.

I’ve had a read though the document, and information about level of education is not even included in the workforce demographics section.

I do know that for entry into most care courses at college, applicants need to have at least several GCSE’s including Maths and English.

It’s a huge misrepresentation to say that certificates in health and social care are the same level as moving and handling training.

DragonDoor google says a level 3 qualification = 2 A levels.

Jesus Christ.

I can’t believe some of the attitudes on here.

Nice to know people think I’m thick as all fuck because of the job I do.

I’m actually horrified.

If you've had Covid there's no need to get the vaccine. This isn't being mentioned though

That is blatantly not true. I’ve had
Covid twice. Different strains. Zero sign of antibodies after 4 weeks. People need to stop spouting the shit that covid makes you immune. Natural herd immunity has long been discredited.

4PawsGood - I’m in Scotland, it’s seems our qualification levels are different! A Level 3 qualification here can provide 2nd year entry into some degrees.

I’m surprised that a Level 3 qualification in England is only equivalent to A Levels.

@DragonDoor

4PawsGood - I’m in Scotland, it’s seems our qualification levels are different! A Level 3 qualification here can provide 2nd year entry into some degrees.

I’m surprised that a Level 3 qualification in England is only equivalent to A Levels.

That’s really annoying that they are different!

I never understand why the obsession with comparing qualifications with A levels.

If people want A levels, why not do them rather than try proving that what they’ve got is ‘equivalent.’

They cannot be equivalent. Most good universities require A levels, not something apparently ‘equivalent.’

You don’t need academic qualifications to be a good nurse/carer, you need compassion, pragmatism and common sense. Many academics lack this.

Before we jump to the conclusion that uptake is low because care workers are hard of thinking, uneducated, anti vaxxers and a bit thick (and really, I do hope you don't have relatives in care if you truly believe that)
Let's see a breakdown of statistics first?

How many out of that 1/6th

• have had the first and are awaiting the second?
• are or were within the 4 week window of having a positive covid test that meant they couldn't take the vaccine when initially offered, and no alternative arrangements have yet been made? Therefore their vaccination is delayed.
• Have been missed off lists, or were unavailable due to shift patterns, illness etc when the vaccine was offered through their workplace, and are waiting for appointments?
• have other reasons (needle phobia, pregnancy, breast feeding, allergies) that have meant they haven't been vaccinated?
• and how many have actually refused.

We're 6 months into a vaccination program that's far from perfect, let's make sure everyone has had a fair crack at actually getting it before we start making assumptions?

@Iquitit

Before we jump to the conclusion that uptake is low because care workers are hard of thinking, uneducated, anti vaxxers and a bit thick (and really, I do hope you don't have relatives in care if you truly believe that) Let's see a breakdown of statistics first?

How many out of that 1/6th

• have had the first and are awaiting the second?
• are or were within the 4 week window of having a positive covid test that meant they couldn't take the vaccine when initially offered, and no alternative arrangements have yet been made? Therefore their vaccination is delayed.
• Have been missed off lists, or were unavailable due to shift patterns, illness etc when the vaccine was offered through their workplace, and are waiting for appointments?
• have other reasons (needle phobia, pregnancy, breast feeding, allergies) that have meant they haven't been vaccinated?
• and how many have actually refused.

We're 6 months into a vaccination program that's far from perfect, let's make sure everyone has had a fair crack at actually getting it before we start making assumptions?

And making excuses doesn't really help.........

And making excuses doesn't really help........

They're valid reasons why people may not have been vaccinated yet.

How is waiting for your second dose an 'excuse'? I only had mine in May. Was it an 'excuse' on my part that I hadn't been doubly vaccinated until then and was probably included it stats from then about 'unvaccinated' care workers, even though I willingly got mine?

How is testing positive for covid and being told you have to wait 4 weeks after that test to be vaccinated an 'excuse'?

What doesn't help is people like you just assuming that 1/6th of care workers not vaccinated is because they're anti vaxxers or just hard of thinking and they need putting in their place and people discussing it like it's a foregone conclusion that any care worker not vaccinated at this point is just a refuser, there's more reasons than refusal why care workers may not have been vaccinated at this point - but that doesn't fit the selfish, thicko care worker attitude does it? So they're labelled as excuses.

I'm not saying that there are some valid reasons you have mentioned- but what percentage do they cover?

Someone on page 1 posted Scotlands percentages on care homes. I'm not convinced they are correct- but I do suspect they are considerably higher than the UK as a whole.

Carers were one of the priority groups. The vast majority habe had the opportunity to be fully vaccinated now.

Vaccines were not only available in the workplace. There are vaccination centres all over the place.

It would be wonderful if you are right and the reasons are as you say- but I really doesn't stack up.

Yes, they could all be valid, but as I said, making excuses does not really help the situation. Accepting there may be a problem and responding to that is the way forward in my opinion.

I suspect that even with all the reasons you have mentioned, there would still be ~1/6 unvaccinated in a few months time.

I'm not saying that there are some valid reasons you have mentioned- but what percentage do they cover?

That's exactly my point, we don't know what % they cover because as far as I can see, there's simply vaccinated Vs unvaccinated.

The question asked was why a low uptake, I've proposed reasons, based on my experience and that of colleagues and the area I work in, as to why, rather than just thinking it's because people are refusing and that's that.

A colleague was within their 4 weeks, had to wait 3 weeks to clear the window and then another 10 days for an appointment. That's almost 5 weeks behind the rest of us.

We only received our second dose in May after waiting 12 weeks between.

I think at least finding out, or waiting until we know that the 1/6th are definitely refusal and not lack of access for one reason or another is important before we start deciding people have not had it because they don't want it.

Then we need to address the reasons why they don't want it with education, support and training.

I'm not pretending that there aren't people refusing, but to say that the valid reasons why some of the 1/6th may not be vaccinated yet are excuses, without ensuring everyone has had an opportunity to be vaccinated is closed minded really.

@DragonDoor

4PawsGood - I’m in Scotland, it’s seems our qualification levels are different! A Level 3 qualification here can provide 2nd year entry into some degrees.

I’m surprised that a Level 3 qualification in England is only equivalent to A Levels.

A Levels allow entry to the second year of many degrees in Scotland.

They cannot be equivalent. Most good universities require A levels, not something apparently ‘equivalent.’

Lots of unis accept BTEC, CTEC etc. The 'equivalent' also includes things like music grades, LAMDA etc. Oh and I don't know a uni that doesn't accept the International Baccalaureate.

They cannot be equivalent. Most good universities require A levels, not something apparently ‘equivalent.’

Because most 'good universities' are in England? 🙄

Maybe the conclusion to draw from this thread is that many of the people who think their educational achievements are vastly superior to those required of care workers are woefully incompetent when it comes to understanding and interpreting the statistics they are using to back up their pre-conceived beliefs.

@Walkaround

Maybe the conclusion to draw from this thread is that many of the people who think their educational achievements are vastly superior to those required of care workers are woefully incompetent when it comes to understanding and interpreting the statistics they are using to back up their pre-conceived beliefs.

And maybe if they think we are so thick and uneducated they should look after their relatives themselves rather than entrusting us Neanderthals with their loved ones.

I never forget when a woman was in visiting her mother one day, she had a little girl with her. I was in her mothers room, giving her her medication, we had what I thought was a lovely chat as I was so interested in the life her mother had lead.

As I walked out of the room, the woman said to the little girl “that’s why you need to work hard at school. Do you want to grow up and be like that lady?”

That comment made me so upset. I did mainly nightshifts and would sit with that woman’s mothe when she was upset - when I wasn’t supposed to, because their wasn’t time. I was supposed to go in, move her sleeping position and onto the next one. I had three meetings and telling off from the managers about spending too much time with that resident. Because I wanted to comfort her when she was crying and calling out in the night, not just move, strip off pad and replace and leave her crying while I moved onto the next room as I was supposed to.

He daughters remarks were a slap in the face after that and I can see the attitude is prevalent on here.

*there - so many typos. Not uneducated. Just very tired from a teething baby.

@Mrstumblesspottyface

Jesus Christ.

I can’t believe some of the attitudes on here.

Nice to know people think I’m thick as all fuck because of the job I do.

I’m actually horrified.

You are spot on, the attitude that carers are sub normal is very common. Ignoring the fact they do procedures that only a few years ago was the reserve of nurses, inc the use of controlled drugs, end of life care, have on going training, deal with severe dementia etc etc.

One reason why so many quit, they feel totally undervalued/under paid.

My mum was a nursing sister for many years in a care home, she used to call the carers "my girls" she'd defend them to the death and said without them, she could never do her job, she held them all in the highest esteem.

Might be better to acknowledge carers concerns and reassure rather than call them stupid/lack critical thinking or force them to have medical treatments they don't want.

@HappyintheHills

The issue with minorities goes back to a long history of pharmaceutical companies and government agencies experimenting on them. Eg pretending that a population of black men were being treated for STDs but in fact the experiment was to see what happened when they were allowed to run through the population

Yes, this. Many minority communities in the UK mistrust the medical establishment and the gov, not without reason.

@Bluethrough when I tell people what I do, I usually get a held tilt and I’m told, “that must be so rewarding.”

I’ve trained in specialist dementia care. And I specialise in working with people of all ages with korsakoff dementia. I’ve studied out of my own pocket.

But no, I’m dumb.

@Malteser71

I never understand why the obsession with comparing qualifications with A levels.

If people want A levels, why not do them rather than try proving that what they’ve got is ‘equivalent.’

They cannot be equivalent. Most good universities require A levels, not something apparently ‘equivalent.’

You don’t need academic qualifications to be a good nurse/carer, you need compassion, pragmatism and common sense. Many academics lack this.

I went to a Russel Group uni with my "equivalent". It was number 5 in the country for my subject when I did my degree.