Info on impact of Delta variant in children?

SonnetForSpring · 04/06/2021 20:27

I don't think anyone does yet. I know Singapore closed schools because they were concerned about the numbers of children falling unwell and they wanted to be cautious. I think it's too early to tell here. I do think it's a concern though.

Bagelsandbrie · 04/06/2021 20:30

I am concerned about this and can’t find any data or anything about it anywhere. I’m guessing if children were becoming seriously unwell with it then it would be all over social media and the news by now...

Littlebelina · 04/06/2021 20:36

RCPCH issued a statement yesterday saying very few children in hospital with covid. Link

mobile.twitter.com/RCPCHtweets/status/1400448874066571270

SonnetForSpring · 04/06/2021 20:37

@Bagelsandbrie

I am concerned about this and can’t find any data or anything about it anywhere. I’m guessing if children were becoming seriously unwell with it then it would be all over social media and the news by now...

Its early days. We will know more over next few weeks.

SonnetForSpring · 04/06/2021 20:38

[quote Littlebelina]RCPCH issued a statement yesterday saying very few children in hospital with covid. Link

mobile.twitter.com/RCPCHtweets/status/1400448874066571270[/quote]
Good to hear.

Original poster

deathbypostitnote · 04/06/2021 22:44

That's good to hear but also confusing! It seems so out of step with the deputy first minister's comments?

I'm deeply confused and still, there doesn't seem to be the data from India that would be helpful (not that it's a straight comparison, I know that).

I suppose the next few weeks will show everything.

OP posts:

Dustyboots · 04/06/2021 23:02

I'm very cynical about all this now.

I think they want kids to be vaccinated now - to stop spread in the community. Because it's getting complicated. Vaccine immunity is dwindling in those who were vaccinated in January and earlier on. Variants escape vaccines. Vaccines don't work for all.

Kids need to be vaccinated to help prevent the spread ...

So the message needs to be that kids are getting ill and are in hospital. They most likely aren't. But that's my take on why there's mixed and confused messaging.

Wingingthis · 04/06/2021 23:05

@Dustyboots 10000% this

SonnetForSpring · 04/06/2021 23:07

@Dustyboots

I'm very cynical about all this now.

I think they want kids to be vaccinated now - to stop spread in the community. Because it's getting complicated. Vaccine immunity is dwindling in those who were vaccinated in January and earlier on. Variants escape vaccines. Vaccines don't work for all.

Kids need to be vaccinated to help prevent the spread ...

So the message needs to be that kids are getting ill and are in hospital. They most likely aren't. But that's my take on why there's mixed and confused messaging.

we do need 12+ to be vaccinated if we are going to get out of this.

Dustyboots · 04/06/2021 23:11

we do need 12+ to be vaccinated if we are going to get out of this.

Maybe we do ...

I'm not letting them anywhere near my 12+ though.

And in actual fact I don't think if they vaccinate 12+s it will make a scrap of difference. These vaccines are a momentary optical illusion or trick. They're not the way out - in fact I think they may make it worse. I may be wrong about that of course.

But either way - we have to sit this out and get through the pain. It will take time. Nothing is going to miraculously make this easy.

ResilienceWanker · 04/06/2021 23:16

The deputy FM was responding to a comment/series of tweets from the Health minister who was himself responding to a softplay owner who was (understandably) pissed off that they had to stay closed, whereas other soft plays in different Scottish council areas will be allowed to open. Soft plays are closed in level 2 but open in level 1, and from tomorrow some of Scotland will move to level 1 and other parts will stay in level 2. As it is permitted in guidance and law for people to travel between level 1 and 2 areas, the owner pointed out that parents would just travel to use soft plays in different areas... The health minister tried to prevent this by pointing out that 10 children under 10 were in hospital in Scotland "because of covid" and such flagrant travelling would lead to "hospitalisation of children" (he initially said such "breaking of the rules" will lead to it, but then deleted the tweet, as he realised it wasn't breaking the rules, and might piss people off a bit...) . Parents were understandably concerned by this, so the deputy FM tried to calm everything down, while not admitting that the health minister was talking rubbish, and that the 10 children weren't necessarily there "because of" covid at all, and suggesting soft play would lead to mass child hospitalisation was a tiny bit scaremongery.

The RCPCH had to step in to point out that actually, the children in hospital with covid had it incidentally, and were not generally ill with it... But as covid prevalence rises in the community, and children are doing more activities, so breaking more bones etc, there will inevitably be a rise in the number of children with covid in hospital.

I'm not sure if this link to a tweet will work but it explains the story. So in terms of the effect of the delta variant on children it seems a non story and definitely not proof that child hospitalisations due to covid are "on the high side". In terms of government ministers telling outright lies to get people to behave in a way they want them to behave, it may be more of a story. But that's where we are, I suppose...

Pootle40 · 04/06/2021 23:17

@deathbypostitnote

I'd like to know more about this but struggling to track down hard info. The Deputy First Minister of Scotland has said that the numbers of hospitalised children with Covid are currently 'on the high side' but this is all I can find.

Does anyone know more?

Yeah they were 'twisting the truth'....aka lying and was quickly correctly by paediatricians.

jumpbounce · 04/06/2021 23:20

@Dustyboots

I'm very cynical about all this now.

I think they want kids to be vaccinated now - to stop spread in the community. Because it's getting complicated. Vaccine immunity is dwindling in those who were vaccinated in January and earlier on. Variants escape vaccines. Vaccines don't work for all.

Kids need to be vaccinated to help prevent the spread ...

So the message needs to be that kids are getting ill and are in hospital. They most likely aren't. But that's my take on why there's mixed and confused messaging.

Children have always been admitted to hospital throughout the pandemic though? Albeit in lower numbers than adults. This isn't anything new, people just chose to ignore it and it seemed a media blackout. We spend a lot of time in hospital and they had a covid ward with children and they had children with complications of covid in PICU. Children (even healthy ones) aren't completely immune to the affects of covid.

Original poster

deathbypostitnote · 04/06/2021 23:23

So the message needs to be that kids are getting ill and are in hospital. They most likely aren't.

As far as I can tell, that's not the message. It's what the deputy first minister for Scotland said but no one else is putting out that message. RCPCH seems to be saying the opposite.

Are you saying you think others are also saying there are children n hospital? Why do you think there probably aren't? My concern is that we could be the last to know because they're keen to re-open and any indication the the Delta variant is more grave for children will jeopardise that. But I think it's unlikely that they'll do this.

I would like to know if the children currently in Scottish hospitals who have tested positive were admitted for treatment of Covid symptoms, or something else. And which variant they have. I'd also like to know how the proportion of children in hospital testing positive for Covid has fluctuated throughout the pandemic, and what proportion of currently hospitalised children in England, Wales and Northern Ireland have tested positive for Covid yet been admitted to hospital for something else..

I was hoping for a signpost to statistics that maybe I have missed.

OP posts:

neveradullmoment99 · 04/06/2021 23:25

ONS data state the rise in cases is the highest in children and educational settings and specifically children in secondary and then primary. This was shown on todays indie sage [ although may relate to England rather than Scotland, I am not sure]
I absolutely do not trust a thing that has been said about schools and children. It is heavily political.

neveradullmoment99 · 04/06/2021 23:27

I reckon although ONS data I think is primarily English. I would imagine that it is the same here.
A whole secondary school has had to close just the other day.

Original poster

deathbypostitnote · 04/06/2021 23:27

Thank you. I'm hopeless at reading the graphs and end up in a panicking dither :)

OP posts:

neveradullmoment99 · 04/06/2021 23:34

@neveradullmoment99

ONS data state the rise in cases is the highest in children and educational settings and specifically children in secondary and then primary. This was shown on todays indie sage [ although may relate to England rather than Scotland, I am not sure] I absolutely do not trust a thing that has been said about schools and children. It is heavily political.

I mean I don't trust Governments when it comes to school. The data from ONS shows rises in age groups 9 + with the highest cases. They have kept the rise in schools quiet until it has become a huge situation and yet still perpetuate the notion that its everything else that is causing the rise i.e. parents not adhering to social distancing, the community etc.

RedcurrantPuff · 04/06/2021 23:40

@deathbypostitnote

That's good to hear but also confusing! It seems so out of step with the deputy first minister's comments?

I'm deeply confused and still, there doesn't seem to be the data from India that would be helpful (not that it's a straight comparison, I know that).

I suppose the next few weeks will show everything.

The deputy first minister is a fucking idiot. There is no way you should take what he says over the medics.

starfish4 · 05/06/2021 08:20

Look at Scottish section on TravellingTabby. There's a section that shows hospital admission by age group this week, and also in total - we're not talking about massive numbers but it does look as other numbers are up by ratio to the total.

ResilienceWanker · 05/06/2021 08:25

I was hoping for a signpost to statistics that maybe I have missed.

The SG doesn't publish that info as far as I'm aware. Only the number of admissions with a positive test either in hospital or a certain number of days before. So those being treated for covid complications (obviously high fever can be an issue in children, whatever the fever is caused by), but also anyone else who had covid either symptomatically or asymptomatically and then had a broken bone, or heart attack or cancer treatment or whatever. As the stats aren't available, I feel more comfortable going by what the medics on the ground are saying as in this article rather than politicians. To be fair, it's usually the other way round (medics are saying its a shit show, and politicians are "its all fiiiiiine"). But seemingly not in this case.

In Scotland, as pp said, there has been a rise in cases in children, which is v disruptive in education, and of course worrying. But, thank goodness, it hasn't translated to increased child hospitalisation. Of course there's still the issue with vulnerable family members/teachers not being fully vaccinated, but even so, the link from infection to hospitalisation does seem to have been weakened, if not entirely cut yet, by the vaccine.

WaterBottle123 · 05/06/2021 09:06

@Dustyboots

we do need 12+ to be vaccinated if we are going to get out of this.

Maybe we do ...

I'm not letting them anywhere near my 12+ though.

And in actual fact I don't think if they vaccinate 12+s it will make a scrap of difference. These vaccines are a momentary optical illusion or trick. They're not the way out - in fact I think they may make it worse. I may be wrong about that of course.

But either way - we have to sit this out and get through the pain. It will take time. Nothing is going to miraculously make this easy.

@Dustyboots

I hope you've called all the worlds most qualified and experienced scientists to inform them vaccines are a 'trick'.

Ffs, Mumsnet needs a policy..or at least a basic intelligence test.