Second Astrazeneca jab

WishIWasSomewhereElse · 2021-05-07T19:56:08+00:00

I'm due my second AZ jab tomorrow and am really, really unsure whether to have it. I've had to restart Lithium tonight, due to deteriorating MH and anxiety due to family issues. I'm so scared by the blood clot issues and am scared that Lithium will harm my kidneys or lower my platelets making me more at risk. My psychiatrist says it is fine, but they would wouldn't they? It's 10 weeks tomorrow, so theoretically I can wait another week or so. But then I wonder if it's more likely to be an issue with a longer gap. Everyone (DH, Dsis, GP, Dparents, etc), think I'm mad, but I can't shake the fear, dad has only months to live, it's nearly a year since Dbro died suddenly and my DD starts High School in September. Can anyone reassure me, or tell me if it is a risk?

ZammoUK · 07/05/2021 21:09

Don't worry, there is ZERO cases of a 2nd jab of AZ causing blood clots. You would know about it within 3 weeks of 1st jab if you were going to get problems. So you will be fine, 2nd jabs of AZ are totally fine all around, not even side slight effects on that one. The 2nd jab of AZ is safer/milder than the 2nd jab of the others.

SnarkyBag · 07/05/2021 21:20

@ZammoUK

Don't worry, there is ZERO cases of a 2nd jab of AZ causing blood clots. You would know about it within 3 weeks of 1st jab if you were going to get problems. So you will be fine, 2nd jabs of AZ are totally fine all around, not even side slight effects on that one. The 2nd jab of AZ is safer/milder than the 2nd jab of the others.

That’s not actually true although the numbers are statistically much much smaller for the second dose

ZammoUK · 07/05/2021 21:30

@SnarkyBag are you sure ? I know there is a risk with the 1st jab of AZ but I have not seen any issues mentioned with the 2nd jab. I am an extremely anxious person so I read info everywhere. Has there been issues linked to the 2nd jab of AZ ?? Either way though, given the OP has had the 1st jab which is by far the riskier it is probably worth having the 2nd, even a chronically anxious person like me would have the 2nd jab of AZ if I was fine after the 1st.

Rockbird · 07/05/2021 21:45

Had my second AZ this evening and I was honestly so glad to get it. I had no reaction at all to the first one so hopefully this will be just as easy.

Original poster

WishIWasSomewhereElse · 07/05/2021 21:56

I was pretty ill the day after my first (felt like I had flu, felt cold but was hot), then fine, so no clots.

It's more the interaction between that and Lithium I was worried about.

OP posts:

whataballbag · 07/05/2021 22:00

I'm pretty sure there's usually always a pharmacist or clinical lead on site at the vaccination centre, if you're worried about possible interactions you could speak to them I'm guessing?

Becca7910 · 07/05/2021 22:19

I've had my 2nd dose. I have hashimotos, ME, and fibromyalgia. I also have varicose veins and a history of blood clots in my family. However, I realise my risk to covid is worse. I had a horrible reaction to the 1st dose, it was a lot less worse for the 2nd. Life is full of risks, but please believe a blood clot is so unlikely. Try and feel excited that a 2nd dose should make you a lot safer Xx

NLM20 · 07/05/2021 22:31

I have been following Prof Makris on twitter as somebody mentioned his knowledge on thrombosis on here and he mentioned on a tweet that neither he nor his colleagues were convinced the cases were convincing. Ie they want more data to see if they were indeed vaccine related or not. At the time there were four in around 4 million doses given, now 6 in near 6 million doses given. Much much lower than first doses although I totally empathise at how this has affected and worried so many people and feels like the risk of first doses is although rare, the fatality rate is high so feels like Russian roulette.

I’ve had my second vaccine as I am classed as extremely vulnerable but feel like at 40, I am now spending my time worried.

NLM20 · 07/05/2021 22:36

Just wanted to add by fatality rate being high, I meant that it’s after first doses around 20%. (This is just from memory it could be lower and perhaps as cases are being spotted quicker, staff being trained to spot and treat quicker that this may start to reduce)

I’d read that there have been no deaths after second cases.

SnarkyBag · 07/05/2021 22:51

[quote ZammoUK]@SnarkyBag are you sure ? I know there is a risk with the 1st jab of AZ but I have not seen any issues mentioned with the 2nd jab. I am an extremely anxious person so I read info everywhere. Has there been issues linked to the 2nd jab of AZ ?? Either way though, given the OP has had the 1st jab which is by far the riskier it is probably worth having the 2nd, even a chronically anxious person like me would have the 2nd jab of AZ if I was fine after the 1st.[/quote]
Yes I think it’s four cases so really really low risk. I’m not saying the op shouldn’t get the second jab by the way I can understand the anxiety I’m not thrilled about getting my second dose next week either although I will go ahead with it

AppleJane · 07/05/2021 22:56

@ZammoUK

Don't worry, there is ZERO cases of a 2nd jab of AZ causing blood clots. You would know about it within 3 weeks of 1st jab if you were going to get problems. So you will be fine, 2nd jabs of AZ are totally fine all around, not even side slight effects on that one. The 2nd jab of AZ is safer/milder than the 2nd jab of the others.

The yellow card data is released every Thursday and at last count it was 6 cases. But the data is not up to date and there's a time lag for the clots to show up so next week's data might answer your question better.

AppleJane · 07/05/2021 22:58

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/coronavirus-covid-19-vaccine-adverse-reactions/coronavirus-vaccine-summary-of-yellow-card-reporting

Up to 28 April 2021, the MHRA had received Yellow Card reports of 242 cases of major thromboembolic events (blood clots) with concurrent thrombocytopenia (low platelet counts) in the UK following vaccination with COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca. These events occurred in 141 women and 100 men aged from 18 to 93 years and the overall case fatality rate was 20% with 49 deaths. Six cases have been reported after a second dose .

Goodasgolden · 08/05/2021 07:42

How would we find out how many second doses had been given 4 weeks ago? 6 clots isn’t really 6 in 6 million is it? It’s 6 in however many doses had been given 2-4 weeks ago as I thought that’s when the clots present after the jab?

AppleJane · 08/05/2021 09:01

@Goodasgolden that's a good question and the reason why many people are frustrated with the yellow card data because there is not quite enough breakdown of information for us to be able to calculate risk to our personal satisfaction. Some people would argue it is intentional.

whataballbag · 08/05/2021 09:12

@Goodasgolden

How would we find out how many second doses had been given 4 weeks ago? 6 clots isn’t really 6 in 6 million is it? It’s 6 in however many doses had been given 2-4 weeks ago as I thought that’s when the clots present after the jab?

Exactly. And how many of those are still within the 4 weeks

duffeldaisy · 08/05/2021 13:16

Look up VAERS and the Yellow Card system- there’s a big investigation into them because the VAERS is completely unverified- anyone in the US can enter any side effects they want, and there’s suspicion that there have been fake reports by anti-vaxxers.

From what I’ve read, the clots, if they do happen, are usually within 4-20 days of the 1st vaccine, and there was one outlier before 40 days. But the most recent cases weren’t fatal, I guess because everyone is on the lookout for symptoms, so gets help, & hospitals know what to do. But the risk is so, so minuscule- you’re much better off being properly vaccinated.

Do check at the vaccine hub about the Lithium. A Doctor did my jab, and there were several there, as well as nurses, so you should have good expert advice there.

Goodasgolden · 08/05/2021 17:22

I just want more information. Did the people who had the clots have any warning symptoms in hindsight, how many days is most likely? I read somewhere second dose clots were presenting much earlier and one was the same day but we’ve not been told this officially. I am low risk of covid, have been vaccinated as it was the right thing to do and feel now we should be given more information.

Original poster

WishIWasSomewhereElse · 08/05/2021 21:00

@Goodasgolden That's interesting if clots following second doses occur much earlier, I've not heard that but would be interested to know.

I had the jab today. I did ask the nurse who got a doctor to see me, who assured me that there was no interactions and Lithium doesn't affect clotting or low platelets. Feel worried, but at glad that I asked.

OP posts: