GP's please why are you not back to seeing us face to face

[whenwillthemadnessend]

Just that really ?

Please can any GP's explain the reasoning

If dentists physios and accident and emergency doctors can see people why can't GP doctors?

So yes. Protect the NHS. But don’t actually use it or try to access any of their services unless you’re dying or have COVID. Because you won’t be allowed.

That's it. It's no longer phone and make an appointment. It's jump through several hoops, pass several barriers, not be put off by dozens of messages about Covid, get past the receptionist and THEN they might grant you an appointment.

Can medical staff really not see how all this gives the message that they'd really prefer not to see people?

GP’s did more appointments in 2020 not less and are now playing a significant role in the vaccine rollout. DH won’t be doing f2f appointments at the surgery today but is going to the local care homes to do the second vaccine for the residents and staff.

I rang GP 11 days ago
Finally got through to the receptionist
In pain due to a back issue ....wanted stronger painkillers
Was told a GP would ring later that day as she could tell I was in a lot of pain
Nobody rang
At 5 pm I got a text message to say someone would ring me 31st March at 9-30am
Sorry but I don't think that's acceptable
This as happened at my surgery a few times that I know of
So I shall be complaining !!!
Let's hope I get the phone call today

MIL moved in with us a few months ago and received a terminal diagnosis shortly after.

We changed her GP to make sure all the referrals & support were for the correct area. GPs have been excellent with referrals, prescriptions and phone advice but I was a bit concerned by the lack of F2F from a relationship building POV given what is ahead.

MIL however has found that her experience is better than at her previous surgery because people call her back & do what they say they will. She has also found the GP calls supportive & personal.

Sometimes it's about perception.

I'm so jealous of you all getting phone calls. My GP now has you fill in a form online. I have been prescribed antibiotics for my throat and an antibiotic spray for my ears this week. No one spoke to me, no one looked at me. I filled in a form (no photos) and got an email telling me a prescription had been sent to the pharmacy. The first question was what was I looking to get from the consultation - not medically trained I just said I wanted the pain to go away.
We've had the telephone triage here for years, it doesn't bother me but filling in a form is ridiculous. I highly doubt that it will go back to the old system after the pandemic recedes. This is a large chain of GPs too

@whenwillthemadnessend

They are still offering telephone appointments only to most in my village.

Same here. And to even get a phone appointment you have to sacrifice your firstborn to the great Gods of GP

Thank you to whoever explained about the risk being to patients, rather than to GPs.
I didn't intend to get involved in a pile-on towards GPs and surgery staff. I think we've all had enough of the unpleasantness towards people who are trying their best to provide as best a service as they can in circumstances none of us signed up to. School staff have had it in bucketloads this last year and I don't wish to see that being turned upon nhs staff.
Personally, my surgery has always been sensible and efficient and telephone triage has suited me, but then perhaps I've been lucky to receive calls bang on when scheduled.
Thank you to the medical staff on here who've taken time to explain the system.

Just to add I’ve had contact several times with the practice where I am patient to over the last year. They are working in a similar way to where I work.
My son has had is immunisations, been seen twice due to infections requiring antibiotics and I had a telephone consultation for him for another issue. I’ve had immunisations myself (separate to my covid jab), a telephone consultation, a blood test and my management started. Previously I really struggled to get an appointment but the new system is working well for me.
I do appreciate that it isn’t ideal for everyone but neither was waiting weeks for appointments in the old system. As I said I know some GP surgeries are not working well but many of us are working very hard and certainly not hiding away. Many of us are seeing patients face to face.

My GP now has you fill in a form online

Is this the only option? If so, they are disenfranchising a whole section of society who can't access the internet. Like my parents. No smartphone, no tablet, no internet connection. They could no sooner fill in an online form than fly to the moon.

Online should be AN option, not the ONLY option.

@babyyodaxmas when managing my long term chronic health condition I do not take a day off sick so I can see the GP, I take the time off I need to go to the appointment then I go back to work.

They are if necessary

@danceaddict

But the point is how can a GP be 100% sure the person they have spoken too on the phone doesn't need to be seen in person for EVERY consult.

People have a different relationship with a doctor. They can be submissive and not speak up. They can minimise the issue as they are worried about wasting time etc.

@Parker231
The problem is simple - there aren’t enough GP’s for the population. The population has increased but the number of GP’s has decreased. Going forward wait times for appointments will increase. When you ring up for an appointment and there aren’t any, it’s not because the GP doesn’t want to see you but because there are no appointments left

This. I’ve been working in general practice (admin not clinical) for 20 years. There are good GPs and bad, just like all professions, but the main fact is there aren’t enough. There aren’t enough hours in the day for them to do all the things they are now expected to do. As someone unthread pointed out, they are private businesses but that doesn’t mean they can do what they like - there are very strict rules for referrals for instance as someone mentioned re tonsillitis.

For those asking why GPs were avoiding seeing patients while teachers had to go ahead, it is a very different scenario. A GP who has unknowingly contracted Covid seeing 30 people (many of whom will be extremely vulnerable) could make those people very ill indeed, plus their families. Most older surgeries are very cramped (my desk is a couple of feet away from three other people) and it’s very difficult to socially distance so they could quite likely to infect colleagues - if everyone goes down with Covid or has to self-isolate, the surgery has to close and nobody would be seen, phoned, prescribed medicine, referred. There are contingencies in place for this, but if it happened widely it would have been disastrous for patient care.

The situation has now improved and we know much more about Covid, plus the vaccination programme is going well. Hence, they are seeing more people. The phone consults will continue at our surgery though as MOST of our patients prefer them.

I wonder how many of the people complaining on here have volunteered to help with their local vaccinations centres, many of who are desperate for people so that all those maligned receptionists and admin staff don’t have to give up all their weekends. They may be getting paid for it, but it’s standard (bad) rate and the vast majority would much prefer to be at home with their families. They don’t HAVE to do it by the way - they volunteer.

@Darkbrownistheriver

I volunteer at the mass vaccine centre in Stevenage and welwyn garden city.

That's an amazing effort and should be applauded however it really is starting to feel for a lot of people that covid is the only issue that's important.

Our surgery is using econsult. The good thing about this is you can put all of your problems in. Rather than just the one. And actually I will use econsult rather that make an appointment as I don't like to bother people.

However I suppose it depends on how it is dealt with after that. My doctor chose to communicate via text message, to tell me to fill in another econsult a month later to book an appointment. (Face to Face)

I did that, I had a blood test and face to face appointments. They then said that they had referred me. I did not hear anything. Completed another econsult to find out what happened to the referral.

I now have the referral however as it is a gynaecology referral they are booked up and I won't be seen until August at the earliest. It will be a year by the time I see anyone. As realistically it probably won't be until September. I really do wish that I felt less dismissed. However if they thought it was serious it would have been a two week pathway referral.

Not the GPs fault, it is years and years of underfunding plus other factors. The whole system needs to be sorted out. And it seems to be every service that is struggling.

(Dentist wise- we are going private now. No NHS appointments and the dentist that does NHS and private seems to be only seeing the private patients- NHS emergency only. )

[quote whenwillthemadnessend]@danceaddict

But the point is how can a GP be 100% sure the person they have spoken too on the phone doesn't need to be seen in person for EVERY consult.

People have a different relationship with a doctor. They can be submissive and not speak up. They can minimise the issue as they are worried about wasting time etc.
[/quote]
and they can be those things in person too - GPs are not magicians and have no crystal ball. If people don't tell term the problem, they can't help deal with it. Nobody can be 100% sure about most things - they can't be 100% sure face to face either.

And also we have so many volunteers at the vaccine centre that's it's actually hard to get a shift in the first place

@MissLucyEyelesbarrow This has been addressed later in the thread, it wasn't the call handler who referred me but the health care professional who called back based on the call handlers assessment. My GP surgery never bothered to get in touch with me, even just to book a phone appointment or tell me I don't need to be seen and should get a prescription instead.

I recently asked for a referral for my child via e-consult form. I submitted it on Monday around noon, got an automated response back that the surgery will contact me by phone, text or email by Thursday 6:30 PM. I don't even mind the long timeframe, it wasn't really urgent and I know they're busy.
For medical concerns I usually get a 24-36 hour timeframe.

What I do mind is that I was expected to be glued to my phone every minute for 4 days.
Sure enough they called me on day 2 or 3, three calls each literally a minute apart, which I happened to miss. I called back 20 minutes later only to be told I missed my appointment (I didn't even know I had one unless a 4 day timeframe is considered an appointment) and I needed to fill in another e-consult and go through it again.

@Darkbrownistheriver

I volunteered at a vaccination centre. Couldn't get a shift for love nor money. They had so many people volunteer. There are threads of other people in the same situation on the coronavirus topic. It may not be true all over the country or in your area but please don't make out they are all staffed by exhausted GP surgery admin staff because no one else stepped up to offer.

My dad is having hip trouble that is most likely age related. He phoned the GP and the GP referred on to X-ray and physio from there. That is a sensible use of telephone consultations because the GP is limited in what they can do in person anyway.

Other things though need to be seen either to be treated at the GP level or to decide if they need to be referred on further.

It’s not an either/or but some practises aren’t doing any face to face and that’s worrying.

My docs will only phone you. Won't tell you when. Then if you miss the call that's it, you missed your chance. Luckily they've now signed up to a video call thing run by some external company so I just use that instead. Only used the GP for repeat prescriptions since COVID.

@Sansaplans why should we be taking the risk of seeing additional patients when GPs have locked themselves away because of the risk? They had little to do in the peak of lockdown whilst we were absolutely swamped.

Hopefully seeing your doctor has evolved and it will be a combo of telephone and face to face in the future. I am not a GP but I would imagine there is a lot of time-wasting going on. In my surgery, there is always a poster saying "Last month 120 appointments were missed". Also, I think a lot of people are wasting GP's time. Both my and my DH's parents visit or call the GP 2-3 times a month each for things which I think can just be attributed to being older. They are all very fit and healthy but are constantly asking for blood tests and other things at the slightest twinge. Also, they expect things that take up time and precious resources. One of my parents will call up constantly to complain that they have not received their paracetamol in the post when they are more than capable of picking it up when they go into town for 50p. A lot of people also just go for a chat with the doctor for a bit of reassurance. I know that is sad, but other people who are ill have to wait for their appointment as a result. Meanwhile, anything my DC needs such as a massive wart removed from his knuckle is not within the GP's budget. I ended up paying over £1K to get it removed after nothing worked to get rid of it and it was there for 2 years. He couldn't bend his finger to hold a pen it was so bad. How is that fair?

Unless it sounds like it is really urgent or a serious problem, all things should be done on the phone now and referred up if serious.

My local surgery has been great, you can have online consultations, where you can upload photos (great for DD’s eye infection when the GP needed to see it) and they will get back to you by the end of the day. Phone appointments are available too but I prefer doing it online as I can just get on with my day.
They are definitely seeing people face to face too, as I’ve had an appointment, but only where a phone call isn’t an option.

Mine aren’t either and pretty much laugh down the phone at you when you try and make an appointment... especially frustrating when you have a phone appointment and you know they will tell you they can’t treat without looking etc