Some of the guidance doesn’t make sense

[Notarulebreaker]

So currently you can arrange to meet only 1 person and walk / sit or exercise with them outside but it is not possible to arrange to do this with 2 people. But when you walk you can stop and talk to another person for a length of time. which is surely the same? If you know them amd you’ve all been careful and are vaccinated surely this is better than doing this with strangers at work or in the street. It’s similar that you can have your cleaner or builder come to your home but you can’t have your mum - just seems strange if you’re being responsible and careful.

The emphasis upon the elderly and care homes in the media throughout the early part of the pandemic meant that the policies and emphasis focused on protecting in the government's words " protecting our most vulnerable." Children and young people were forgotten - potential illnesses were forgotten,everything was Covid. The opening up of care homes and the publicity around a visitor being allowed was understandable but sadly many of the residents would not have know what was happening anyway. Meanwhile millions of young people do, many unable to cope - lockdown has done irreversible damage to them and to those for whom lack of screening has seen illnesses become incurable. I understand people want to protect everyone but what has happened is that we have sacrificed a generation.

@MadMadMadamMim

Hmm.

Are you only just noticing this, op?

Most of the guidance hasn't made sense for the last year!

Totally agree with this. All the posters tying themselves in knots trying to justify the rules and laws.

We're not supposed to be leaving our local Council area. So I technically can't drive 3 miles to the Morrisons which is in the next Council area, but can drive 15 in the opposite direction to a Morrisons which is still in the same Council area? Last summer the Scot Gov said children 11 and under could mix freely - but my son who had already turned 12 wasn't supposed to be mixing with his friends who were in the same school year and still 11?

This is why lots of us aren't following the more silly rules and are assessing our own risk.

I wish we each could have a personal Covid budget to spend.

So people have 50 points to spend.
Going to a shop = 5p
Having someone in your house = 20p
Working face to face with people but Covid secure = 15 points for the week.
Socially distant walk = 5p.
Cuppa on a park bench with someone = 10p

And people could then spend it as they want, so if you want to go and visit someone in their house, you can but you'd have to restrict other activities

Or you could go for several socially distanced walks instead. Or go to lots of shops. But not both.

If you wfh, then your get to see more people, but that makes more sense as you are lower risk, and probably a bit lonely in comparison.

If sounds complicated, but no more so than spending actual money is, and we understand that as a concept fine.

twelly I don't disagree about the effect on school aged children .And their poor parents trying to WFH and home school .

But your comment "sadly many of the residents would not have know what was happening anyway" is a teensy bit sweeping and I wonder what it's based on ? Do you imagine that for example someone with dementia has no awareness at all ? .That there is not part of their brain wondering why they've been abandoned ,why there are no longer any visits from that nice person (who does know what's happening to her mum ) no longer appears ?

The basic reason is that people's work and business have been prioritised over socialising. Although I understand not everyone will agree, allowing people to get on with the work or running their businesses is better for the economy.

I agree @Notarulebreaker

I sit in my work dining room twice a day, with young man at another table 1 meter away. I don't know what he does out of work. Yet I can't have my student son over for dinner, sitting on the other couch.

It drives me mad.

Student son hasn't been here since Xmas day.

I think that those in school/college and teenaged especially have found bit hard to cope, they have been isolated, the damage to them mentally and physically is huge. The elderly in nursing homes were not socialising outside their home, older people who retired at 60/65 many still very active would have been able to choose whether to isolate or not. The rest of society could have just carried on. Interestingly when the over 70s had had their vaccination many felt they could do what they want - socialise, go shopping in pairs etc vaccine passports mean they can go abroad the younger generation ie 20/30s teenagers can't . I don't have a problem with the later as that is a fact, but I believe that the young have borne the brunt of this policy

Totally @twelly

This has been hard for me mid 50s.

Imagine being 21.

Sigh, how do people still not understand this?

Mixing spreads the virus. The aim is to reduce mixing wherever we can to keep the most essential activities going.

You can’t meet your mum for chat so that your plumber can come and fix your boiler (and keep his job).

You can’t stand closer than 2 metres from the school mum so that your daughters can play with each other at school.

You can’t have your son to visit so that you can go to work (and sit near someone you barely know) and still have a job.

Most of it doesn't make sense.

I see my DPS every week.They are old and I am simply not prepared not to see them.

People are voting with their feet now, so many more people and traffic about than this time last year
Its well time we got back to normal,people who want to stay in their houses washing their tins can carry on

And I know it’s really tough and I know some of the rules seem arbitrary and have gaps and inconsistencies. I know it’s not always seemed fair.

But I can’t believe after one whole year of this, people don’t get the basic premise of what we’re trying to do here.

I too agree that the rules are questionable.

I think people understand the premise but that doesn't mean they agree with it

Sigh, how do people still not understand this?

Sigh, why are people still being so unbearably condescending after a whole fucking year of this shit?

Yeah, I no longer care.

baby yes! I was thinking we need covid points too.

I wouldn't spend them on restaurants, gym, haircuts etc. I could save them to "spend" on staying with my family.

The problem with a points system is those "fortunate" enough to work front line NHS wouldn't be able to do anything. And we're at breaking point ☹️

Well said Bubbins.

As a country we’ve got a maximum “budget” for mixing which is the most that the population can interact without the NHS crashing irretrievably. The government has chosen, for understandable but not unarguable reasons, to allocate almost all of that budget to private sector work rather than general social interaction. Recently they’ve calculated that they’ve got a bit more spare in their budget and have chosen to spend it all on school reopening.

One of the consequences is that towns where more of the population WOH are stuck with a higher Covid burden throughout.

@MadMadMadamMim

Hmm.

Are you only just noticing this, op?

Most of the guidance hasn't made sense for the last year!

This.

In scotland, they are going from 5 people max at funerals and weddings to 50 in one step, but I still can't have my parents in my house. Makes so much sense.

@Bubbinsmakesthree

And I know it’s really tough and I know some of the rules seem arbitrary and have gaps and inconsistencies. I know it’s not always seemed fair.

But I can’t believe after one whole year of this, people don’t get the basic premise of what we’re trying to do here.

The problem being 'after one year'.. We all totally understand a year ago. The science is now less convincing and yet the stupid rules remain.

I personally think that many who have followed the roles disagree with them - I am one of those. We are allowed a view!

The problem being 'after one year'.. We all totally understand a year ago. The science is now less convincing and yet the stupid rules remain.

But the logic is still exactly the same as it has always been! You can argue we should be unlocking faster, sure. Or that there should be different rules for the vaccinated - I don’t agree with that but I’d hear your argument.

But complaining “why can I do this when I can’t do that?” just seems to failing to grasp the very basics.

We would all desperately like to meet up with family and friends. And yes a single chat with your mum doesn’t have to be inherently much more risky than a chat with a plumber. But we don’t see plumbers very often. Allowing plumbers into houses introduces some mixing - maybe tens of thousands of visits into a home a week? Allow household mixing and suddenly you’re talking millions upon millions of people visiting each other’s houses.

@Justcurious93

Yes, that would be one of the big downsides. It's not fair. But equally, it's not fair that someone who works from home can't see elderly relatives, even if both are totally isolated, and no risk to eachother, based on arbitrary guidelines.

We either have a system which is unfair to those who are more of a risk (through no fault of their own, often there opposite), but allows non risky activities to continue, or we ban low risk common sense activities because it wouldn't be safe if higher risk people did them too.

It's like asking whether you want to be stabbed or shot. Both options are terrible.