Getting the vaccine could help long Covid sufferers??

[MarcelineMissouri]

Yes I know it’s just one twitter thread (but has been shared by someone I’ve found to be an interesting and sensible reporter) but what an interesting idea - would be good news if it turns out to be the case!

twitter.com/apoorva_nyc/status/1364614022268674050?s=21

twitter.com/erictopol/status/1365420856944390144?s=21

And another

I think it has been reported in the DM as well

Im really hoping so.
Ive been left with
Brain fog
Muscle twitching
And pins and needle hands at night.

Just hoping its not caused ms or parkinsons. (As did the flu in 1919 cause parkinsonism).
My lung issues seemed to get better after about 8m or so.

Some long covid group have seen improvements but i guess it depends on what symptoms you are getting. As it's not going to fix lung damage etc

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9303149/Coronavirus-vaccines-help-long-Covid-patients-beat-crippling-fatigue.html

Sorry it is that paper but still interesting 🤷‍♀️

I hope this is turns out to be the case. It would be absolutely amazing news!

In uk i think it's certainly possible some have like ptsd. We have dealt with it so badlly and to go through that and feel at severe risk still to catch again. Im not saying it's all in the head, but cant help recovery.

We do know so!me people are shedding virus for ages and china was quaranting people like that. It would be immunocompromised people. One sars1 person had it still until they died .
Also why would asthmatics have more lc and women. Who also get more autoimmune things.

Vaxs can cause a lupus flare etc.
Maybe the vax is raising some peoples temps enough to kill it off.

Also would it only fix lc if the antibodies match the virus you had. So

if you catch a mutation

Also dc1 always goes a bit mentally funny odd behaviour after flu vax. So that at least is either causing inflamation or for her getting up into brain maybe. Luckily this year it was just before half term.

Imo there are likely people contagious longer thsn the 10d, which explains why rates shoot up so much when everyone goes inside.

And another
twitter.com/profshanecrotty/status/1365107279427760128?s=21

And from The Times

apple.news/A1HX9T-4cTvaxJrChD2H1LQ

And from America

www.wpxi.com/news/top-stories/long-term-covid-19-side-effects-could-go-away-after-first-vaccine-doctors-say/RYHEOCFIQNAOBDD6GFRGICKUZI/

And apparently they are now starting some studies on this in the US
twitter.com/sailorrooscout/status/1365646813177511936?s=21

I have Long Covid and had my first shot on Friday (Oxford AZ). So far I'm getting the common mild-moderate side effects (sore arm, groggy, headache). Relieved that it didn't cause a big setback and hopeful for positive changes - I'll post back and let you know if I see any!

@HSHorror

Im really hoping so. Ive been left with Brain fog Muscle twitching And pins and needle hands at night.

Just hoping its not caused ms or parkinsons. (As did the flu in 1919 cause parkinsonism).
My lung issues seemed to get better after about 8m or so.

Some long covid group have seen improvements but i guess it depends on what symptoms you are getting. As it's not going to fix lung damage etc

I have had long covid. Cant tell for sure, but feels like it has nearly gone.

I didnt realise that the 1919 flu caused parkinsons.

When covid started I thought uh oh, as family history is lungs, not so much heart attack, strokes and cancer like lots other families.
I have had flu several times in my life, and my dad had parkinsons. So your post is ringing bells somewhat.

I had brain fog, and that is not totally better. pins and needles a bit, but during long covid, I had a bit of all sorts of things[no muscle twitching though]. I hope you recover well.

As to op[I have come over from your posting on the long covid support thread], wouldnt it be wonderful if the vaccine helps that. No, I havent had it yet, and even if offered shortly, I am one of those who is going to wait and see what happens to people. I have read that people who have had covid, can react worse to the vaccine in the first instance, so not fancying that. But my bigger concern is are there long term effects, so I am willing to play the longer game, particularly through the summer months.

Another twitter thread

twitter.com/virusesimmunity/status/1366067849480048643?s=21

I have had ill effects of long COVID. Reduced smell ongoing. I have however just been saying to my friends this week that I have noticed that the awful smell and taste I would get when brushing teeth etc that made me want to be sick has gone since I have had the vaccine three weeks ago.

My family likely had COVID back in Spring (no test but doc and hospital conclusion was COVID). I have been struggling with nerve pain and twitching in left leg and foot. I thought maybe low leve sciatica as I have had this before but this feels different.

Anyway had the Vax a couple of days ago and pain in foot much better. Still there but better.

Following

We need to do placebo controlled trials to find out if there is any real effect (not hard to do, by the way; most LC people under 50 are not yet eligible for the vaccine, so you simply bring a group of these people forward and give some of them an early vaccine while the others get a placebo---the ones who got the placebo can then be notified and get the real vaccine later on when they would be eligible anyway).

@HSHorror

Im really hoping so. Ive been left with Brain fog Muscle twitching And pins and needle hands at night.

Just hoping its not caused ms or parkinsons. (As did the flu in 1919 cause parkinsonism).
My lung issues seemed to get better after about 8m or so.

Some long covid group have seen improvements but i guess it depends on what symptoms you are getting. As it's not going to fix lung damage etc

I have the muscle twitching and pins and needles at night, I'm so worried but also relived to hear someone else has it so it probably is long covid. I hope we start feeling better soon but it really is worrying.

When did you test positive?

Unfortunately it was apr so no test.
When were you ill.

The pins and needles and twitches unfortunately can be lots of things. (Calcium/potassium/hypothyroid/b12/magnesium)
Pins and needles can be carpel tunnel/cubital tunnel or again hypothyroidism.

That’s very encouraging. I’ve been suffering from long Covid for the last year and it’s been particularly bad again recently. I’m booked for my first jab on Saturday so that really is making me dare to hope! I’ve experienced ‘false dawns’ several times, though, so I’m trying not to get my hopes up too much.

Even so, it’s definitely giving me cause for optimism,

I can't say nonsense, because there's no proof it's nonsense, but it would be beyond remarkable - there is no biological mechanism by which a vaccine could accomplish this.

If the effect had occurred more slowly over the days/weeks following the vaccination, I'd have had more interest as that would have corresponded with the immune system kicking into action - but even that would be highly unlikely as the immune system is being trained by the vaccine to attack the virus and long-covid sufferers are not infected by the virus any more.

What we're likely seeing here is a placebo effect. It's no different to Paltrow's infrared sauna cure! If you take something that you believe will make you better, it's common to feel better at least for a few days.

@notrub

I can't say nonsense, because there's no proof it's nonsense, but it would be beyond remarkable - there is no biological mechanism by which a vaccine could accomplish this.

If the effect had occurred more slowly over the days/weeks following the vaccination, I'd have had more interest as that would have corresponded with the immune system kicking into action - but even that would be highly unlikely as the immune system is being trained by the vaccine to attack the virus and long-covid sufferers are not infected by the virus any more.

What we're likely seeing here is a placebo effect. It's no different to Paltrow's infrared sauna cure! If you take something that you believe will make you better, it's common to feel better at least for a few days.

Yes I have to admit while this would be fantastic I can't think of any biological mechanism that would allow this to happen

Long covid is an umbrella term for symptoms that persist long after the initial infection has been dealt with by the immune system. Giving the vaccine will only help protect a person against a repeated infection, it wouldn't ameliorate damage already done (unless for some reason the person had remained infectious and with active virus long term)

Will keep an eye out for any research that is testing this theory robustly

[quote MarcelineMissouri]And from America

www.wpxi.com/news/top-stories/long-term-covid-19-side-effects-could-go-away-after-first-vaccine-doctors-say/RYHEOCFIQNAOBDD6GFRGICKUZI/

And apparently they are now starting some studies on this in the US
twitter.com/sailorrooscout/status/1365646813177511936?s=21[/quote]
I've had a look at these and can't see any links that suggest trials of vaccination on long COVID patients are underway in the US?

The twitter account linked mentioned the NIH and their website below, who are certainly looking at long COVID, but not specifically at impact of vaccination

www.nih.gov/about-nih/who-we-are/nih-director/statements/nih-launches-new-initiative-study-long-covid

From their website:
Some of the initial underlying questions that this initiative hopes to answer are:

What does the spectrum of recovery from SARS-CoV-2 infection look like across the population?
How many people continue to have symptoms of COVID-19, or even develop new symptoms, after acute SARS-CoV-2 infection?
What is the underlying biological cause of these prolonged symptoms?
What makes some people vulnerable to this but not others?
Does SARS-CoV-2 infection trigger changes in the body that increase the risk of other conditions, such as chronic heart or brain disorders?

@notrub

I hear what you’re saying. And, as I said, with the ‘false dawns’ that long Covid sufferers go through, it’s impossible to know whether there is truth in this or not. And logically you’re right, and it’s what I’ve assumed up to now.

OTOH, with severe Covid infections, the immune system goes into overdrive, which is what leads to more serious illness (as I understand it). The vaccine could potentially act to reverse this process.

Alternatively, it could make it worse, as it apparently has in 18% of cases. (Although here, too, we don’t know whether this is because of the vaccine.)

Long Covid is well known for ‘false dawns’ and flare-ups, so it will be a while before there’s a clear picture about what difference vaccines make, if any.

It’s certainly giving me grounds for optimism but I’m not getting over excited, that’s for sure.

[quote Mittens030869]@notrub

I hear what you’re saying. And, as I said, with the ‘false dawns’ that long Covid sufferers go through, it’s impossible to know whether there is truth in this or not. And logically you’re right, and it’s what I’ve assumed up to now.

OTOH, with severe Covid infections, the immune system goes into overdrive, which is what leads to more serious illness (as I understand it). The vaccine could potentially act to reverse this process.

Alternatively, it could make it worse, as it apparently has in 18% of cases. (Although here, too, we don’t know whether this is because of the vaccine.)

Long Covid is well known for ‘false dawns’ and flare-ups, so it will be a while before there’s a clear picture about what difference vaccines make, if any.

It’s certainly giving me grounds for optimism but I’m not getting over excited, that’s for sure.[/quote]
with severe Covid infections, the immune system goes into overdrive, which is what leads to more serious illness (as I understand it). The vaccine could potentially act to reverse this process.

But giving someone a vaccine, (i.e, coronavirus antigens) simply stimulates the immune system to respond to a coronavirus infection. This wouldn't act to dampen down the immune system, that can only be done with immunosuppressants.

There's a huge amount of research activity into long COVID and the future is really promising for helping people get better (and hopefully preventing people developing it altogether!), but vaccination is unlikely to be viable treatment.

Fair point. Obviously I’m mainly having the jab to prevent me being infected by the virus again, and to make it less likely that I’ll infect others.

This was certainly interesting, and also encouraging to note that this study implies that long Covid sufferers mostly don’t have their symptoms worsen as a result of having the jab (because this was a concern of mine).